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Thread: How do I make a stopped groove in a dovetail?

  1. #1

    How do I make a stopped groove in a dovetail?

    Hi guys.
    I want to make a small tray, 10x13" and 2 1/2" high. Will join the sides with through dovetails. I want to use 1/4" thick material for the bottom. I want the bottom to ride in a groove on all 4 sides.

    No sweat - got out my plow plane and cut a groove on the tail boards. The end of the groove wont show. But if I groove the pin boards all the way to the end, it WILL show. So I tried to cut a stopped groove with the plow - can't get a uniform depth because the skate is longer than the groove.

    How do you cut grooves like this?

    Thank you.
    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  2. #2
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    Chisel a mortise of the proper depth and width that is just a tad longer than the length of the skate that precedes the cutter. Only drawback is that the plow needs to be set twice, as the groove needs to be run from the center towards either end. There may be an easier way, but that’s how I’ve done it.

    To clarify, you’d need to cut a mortise at either end of the stopped dado.
    ---Trudging the Road of Happy Destiny---

  3. #3
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    A router plane is one possibility. Use half blind dovetails. Put plugs in the groove. just a couple of ideas, I'm sure others will have more.

  4. #4
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    Another possibility is using a slip base like Derek C. has described here. Building the Drawers Basically your tray is a drawer with handholds. I know you said you wanted to use thru dovetails but if the groove is shorter than the plane, I think you have to do a work around??
    Last edited by Chet R Parks; 03-15-2018 at 10:47 PM. Reason: shorter was longer

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Chet R Parks View Post
    Put plugs in the groove.
    Fred,
    This has been my practice, to make it a through groove and plug it. You'll be plugging end grain, and usually it's imperceptible with a little grain matching care.

    Edwin

  6. #6
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    Hi Fred

    Chopping out the groove with a mortise chisel goes surprisingly fast. You can then clean up with a router plane. That's how I did mine in the recent coffee table build thread I posted. For longer grooves I sometimes do the beginning and the end, just enough to fit the skates of the plow plane and then some, and plow away the rest.

    I wouldn't go with a plug. It will show, and you will forever notice it.

  7. #7
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    I plow what I can and finish with a router plane and chisel.

  8. #8
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    It can be done depending on your plow plane.

    Here is an old post of mine using a Stanley #45:

    https://sawmillcreek.org/showthread....the-Stanley-45

    The Stanley #55 has tilting fences to allow cutting a groove into a face of an octagon and other endeavors. It also has a screw that threads into the skate by the blade to inhibit lateral movement of the blade when it is used in a manner that needs to be adjusted between cuts.

    If your bench can hold two pieces at a time the two pin boards can be cut together saving some time or make two grooves in one piece that can latter be cut apart for the pin boards.

    jtk
    Last edited by Jim Koepke; 03-16-2018 at 11:02 AM. Reason: If your bench can & spelling
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  9. #9
    Thank you guys! Some of these ideas never occurred to me and I was uncertain of the others. Some of them are doggone clever! I'll try a couple of these and report back on what worked for me.

    Jim, I'm intrigued by the idea of advancing the blade with each pass. That never occurred to me, but that will be something I try.

    I appreciate your help!
    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  10. #10
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    I might also add that if you go the router plane route, I clamp a “stop” for the front of the router plane to keep me from accidentally blowing out the end. This example shows the “stop” when I was doing a dado to keep from tearing out the adjoining groove, but I do the same for any stopped groove or dado.

    5AD56E2B-30EF-49D5-A1DD-1BA91ED8EBF6.jpg 617641EA-EDE9-47B4-BAFA-C7162C7E6DFA.jpg

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Phil Mueller View Post
    I might also add that if you go the router plane route, I clamp a “stop” for the front of the router plane to keep me from accidentally blowing out the end. This example shows the “stop” when I was doing a dado to keep from tearing out the adjoining groove, but I do the same for any stopped groove or dado.

    5AD56E2B-30EF-49D5-A1DD-1BA91ED8EBF6.jpg 617641EA-EDE9-47B4-BAFA-C7162C7E6DFA.jpg
    Good point Phil. Thanks for that idea!
    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  12. #12

    A very repeatable way that worked for me

    I tried a few of the ideas suggested above, and again thanks to everyone who responded! The approach I came up with is a close relative of what Jim Koepke was doing with his #45s. Because the LV small plow only has one depth stop, I couldn't use just that.

    So what I did was make an auxillary fence to install on the other side (see pics) of the skate. The bottom of that fence is flush with the edge of the skate. I advance the blade every pass. When I clamp a stop to the bench, the plow will cut stopped grooves all day long with no muss or fuss. Minor cleanup with a chisel on both ends. [Edit: In case it's confusing, the second picture really is a top-down view - I just turned the depth stop upside down to get it out of the way.]

    I think it is important NOT to bear down on the aux fence, because it is riding on the fence rails and you dont want to distort/damage those. So I put most of the pressure on the "real" fence and the tote. If anyone sees a flaw in doing it this way, please point it out so I don't trash this wonderful tool. Otherwise, I think I've got a good approach here. See what you think?

    Best wishes,
    Fred

    20180316_133938.jpg
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    Last edited by Frederick Skelly; 03-16-2018 at 3:09 PM.
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  13. #13
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    Great improvisation, kind of like a wooden cam stop.

    jtk
    "A pessimist sees the difficulty in every opportunity; an optimist sees the opportunity in every difficulty."
    - Sir Winston Churchill (1874-1965)

  14. #14
    Front view, placed on the wood so you can see the aux fence and how it works.
    20180316_144121.jpg
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Frederick Skelly View Post
    Front view, placed on the wood so you can see the aux fence and how it works.
    20180316_144121.jpg
    That's awesome! Looks mush simpler than the way I last did it, and less chisel work. Thanks for sharing
    ---Trudging the Road of Happy Destiny---

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