Turning from power tools to hand tools

[Patrick Chase]

I was able to get the silky smooth result with the 62 and can see where sanding from that point would ruin that beautiful finish. My disconnect is that once I got the wood to the silky smooth finish I would then start my process of dovetailing to create the box. Since most boxes seem to get sanded after joining the dovetails wouldn't this negate the silky smooth finish? If I was building furniture or just doing large panel glue up I could see the advantage of finishing with a smoother.

I classify surfaces based on whether they'll be accessible to a smoother after assembly. For the ones that won't be I take them to final finish before assembling joinery, and try my best to keep them clean. If I fail then I'll typically use a scraper to refine them after assembly (or maybe a rabbet plane for "simple" inside corners parallel to the grain).

For surfaces that will be accessible after assembly and where handling is a major concerrn, I stop short of final smoothing, assemble, and then take a light smoothing pass over the finished piece. I do this 100% of the time with box sides, for example. I typically smooth them with a #2 or #3 after I surface the DTs with a block plane as Jim outlined. It sometimes takes some clever fixturing/clamping, but it's worth it.

[Bill Sutherland]

I classify surfaces based on whether they'll be accessible to a smoother after assembly. For the ones that won't be I take them to final finish before assembling joinery, and try my best to keep them clean. If I fail then I'll typically use a scraper to refine them after assembly (or maybe a rabbet plane for "simple" inside corners parallel to the grain). For surfaces that will be accessible after assembly and where handling is a major concerrn, I stop short of final smoothing, assemble, and then take a light smoothing pass over the finished piece. I do this 100% of the time with box sides, for example. I typically smooth them with a #2 or #3 after I surface the DTs with a block plane as Jim outlined. It sometimes takes some clever fixturing/clamping, but it's worth it.

This is where I’m trying to get. Eliminating those power tools I seldom use or don’t enjoy using and building boxes and smaller items like that with hand tools is where I want to end up. After my exercise yesterday taking the boards to final dimensioning convinced me I could do it with the tools I have and possibly eliminate ones I don’t like. I didn’t realize that planes could be used in the final finishing of boxes. That’s encouraging. I won’t be getting rid of my power saws but would sure enjoy using different planes to get my boards ready for final assembly. I realize jointing one face and then using power planer to finish up is the normal procedure but to me it isn’t any fun and after spending 6 hours planing the boards to identical thickness I really had fun.

[Marshall Harrison]

Thanks David & Jim.
I'll check out thoe resources. I've got this book on my Amazon wish list - https://www.amazon.com/dp/1440329605...8IFUDOU6&psc=0

Hoping to purchase that soon and use it for a resource. I'll also check out more Youtube videos which is where I have learned what little I already know.

[Normand Leblanc]

...after spending 6 hours planing the boards to identical thickness I really had fun.

Yes, like many others here I enjoy hand planing and have fun doing it. I can't believe that I had all that dust/noise/danger around me before. My shop is entirely manual tools, no electrons.

[David Eisenhauer]

I believe working primarily on smaller boxes (at first anyway) may be a good way to jump into hand tools because the sheer volume of donkey work to be performed with hand tools on a project would be a lot less and also allow for quicker feedback on the effectiveness of your technique on the different tasks involved.

[Brian Holcombe]

Jointing and thicknessing is excellent training. You'll learn much much more about wood properties.

Make yourself some winding sticks and a straight edge. Make certain that you have a sturdy work bench.

[Patrick Chase]

Make yourself some winding sticks and a straight edge. Make certain that you have a sturdy work bench.

OK, so I have a long-standing nit to pick here. Winding sticks are great, and absolutely essential for long and narrow boards, but I see a lot of people using them in cases where they're really not the most efficient or accurate way to work.

If the board is reasonably wide relative to it's length, say 1/8 as wide as long or wider, then you can just check the diagonals for flatness with a straightedge. If the center and both diagonals are flat (or at least have the same concavity/convexity), then the board isn't twisted. You can detect VERY small amounts of twist that way, arguably at least as small as you can using winding sticks. Winding sticks magnify twist and make it easier to see by being wider than the workpiece, but they also add several sources of imprecision and variability.

[Warren Mickley]

I think you are making extra work for yourself by avoiding winding sticks, Patrick. We typically use the winding sticks early on the process to help make a mental map of the surface. This helps avoid planing areas that are low to begin with, saving both effort in planing and thickness of stock.

We also use winding sticks in making an edge joint.

Winding sticks are mentioned in 17th, 18th, and 19th century texts.

[Matthew Hills]

If you're looking for inspiration on technique and tools to get, you could do a lot worse than watching some traditional japanese cabinet makers:



to OP: I'd recommend storing any power tools you are considering getting rid of, and then doing the work by hand for 6 months... you'll then be able to confirm which path you prefer and regardless of future, will have learned a lot.


Re: drum sander... I've heard that it isn't a good idea to do finish planing after sanding, as the sandpaper will leave a bit of grit in the boards that tears up your fine plane blade. I haven't tempted fate with this, so don't have first-hand experience with it. Does anyone here have experience to either confirm or disabuse this notion?

Matt

[Bill Sutherland]

<p>
I do have winding sticks and a good straight edge but was so excited to get planing I completely forgot about them until about 1/4 way through Scrub planing the first board. I won&rsquo;t be selling any mor tools until I get the jointing process dialed in. It did get me going on setting up my sharpening jigs so I can quickly hone plane blades. Not sure what plane to get next. I have th LN Scrub and 62 as well as old Sears block plane and small plane about 9&rdquo; long from Sears that must be 40 years old but hardly used. I&rsquo;d love to have a LN 7 or 8 but not sure what&rsquo;s next.</p>

[steven mendez]

Man you guys sure have a lot of tools, electric and hand. If you looked at my humble space ( will not call it a shop yet ) a lot of you would be probably be going down memory lane. I do like to try and work with hand tools, and i think for me, the more vintage the better. I just like the &quot; hand made &quot; aspect i guess. But I do realize that power tools are a neccesity , ecspecialy for repeated cuts.

[Jim Koepke]

I've heard that it isn't a good idea to do finish planing after sanding, as the sandpaper will leave a bit of grit in the boards that tears up your fine plane blade.

Worse, the grit can not only affect the blade it can mar the sole of the plane. This would be more a problem with wood body planes. Anyone who dulls a blade should be able to sharpen a blade. It is the first rule of edged tools.

Most of the time there isn't that much grit left to do a lot of damage.

The point is if you are using planes properly sandpaper tends to not be used. Even 600 grit and higher will tend to dull a well planed surface. If a plane can not get a spot smooth then a scraper may be the tool of choice.

jtk

[Brian Holcombe]

OK, so I have a long-standing nit to pick here. Winding sticks are great, and absolutely essential for long and narrow boards, but I see a lot of people using them in cases where they're really not the most efficient or accurate way to work.

If the board is reasonably wide relative to it's length, say 1/8 as wide as long or wider, then you can just check the diagonals for flatness with a straightedge. If the center and both diagonals are flat (or at least have the same concavity/convexity), then the board isn't twisted. You can detect VERY small amounts of twist that way, arguably at least as small as you can using winding sticks. Winding sticks magnify twist and make it easier to see by being wider than the workpiece, but they also add several sources of imprecision and variability.

In any case, small or wide I would rather magnify the error. They also function as a straight edge and tell you where along the width of the board that the corner is being lifted. It takes longer to check with a single straight edge.

I can say from building the kitchen over the summer, small things add up quickly in terms of speed.

[ken hatch]

Just slapping a pair of winding sticks on a board can give false information if the area of placement isn't flat. Doing so is operator error not a fault of the winding sticks. A couple or three swipes with a plane should true the areas of placement.

I usually work belly up if able, find the wind and true it, true the edges, mark the belly and go it it. it is not hard and goes reasonably quickly if you have a plan. That said, it sure is nice to have a big planer for day to day prep but even with a planer you need to be able to quickly ready a reference surface for the planer because most folks have neither the room or money for a 20" or larger jointer.

ken

[Bill Sutherland]

Not sure I understand,”if the area of placement isn’t flat”?