Ancient Tools - The Stringline

[Phil Mueller]

Great post, Stanley, thank you. I was first shown this method back in my high school summers (decades ago) working for a home builder. It was how all the foundation forms were set. Even learned the twist around your finger/loop over the end nail knot. Have used it for fences, decks and the like.

A few other old methods learned back then was the 3/4/5 right angle measurment, and the clear hose with water to check level over wide expanses.

I learned a lot from those "old timers"

[Frederick Skelly]

I've been thinking about this post on and off all day. Stan, it sounds like you can measure to some small tolerances (you mentioned using feeler gauges). Just how small a swamp or belly can a "regular" user like me expect to detect? Is it realistic for me, a guy who's just reading how to do this without a teacher, to assume I can measure 0.02" or better? I ask this because the (very taut) line still has some flex. And the blocks could be very slightly unmatched, due to error in planing or wood movement.

It just seems too good to be true, and skilled Pros always make it look easy.

I'm also interested in trying the plumb bob. Always wondered why I see them in catalogs still, but Jim Pallas' post cleared that up for me. (Thanks Jim!)

As always, thanks for teaching us!
Fred

[James Waldron]

All the straight line work I've done lately - say about 7-8 years, I've used braided UHMW polyethylene (Spectra tm) fishing line. It's very strong (100 lb test), very VERY low stretch and very smooth. The only problem is that it's so smooth and so slick that it doesn't hold knots well. I keep mine on a small open face fishing reel on a stub of a rod that makes keeping the line working and untangled a breeze.

The Spectra can be tensioned to the limits your pins can hold, so you can keep sag to a minimum. I made my own pins with 1/8" drill rod, hardened and tempered, epoxied into turned handles. In my work, I'm usually using the string line on "framing" that is not part of the end result, so I can drive the pins in to a depth of and inch or so to hold a lot of tension.

Works for me.

[James Pallas]

I think I may have derailed this thread some by adding a plumb bob. The use of the dry string is the important part. There are many accessories that can be used with a dry string. The string is a very good and sensitive device for use in measuring and gauging. The plumb bob is one of the accessories along with dividers, feeler gauges, gauge blocks and line levels to name a few. Maybe those things can be used in further discussions.
Jim

[Stanley Covington]

I've been thinking about this post on and off all day. Stan, it sounds like you can measure to some small tolerances (you mentioned using feeler gauges). Just how small a swamp or belly can a "regular" user like me expect to detect? Is it realistic for me, a guy who's just reading how to do this without a teacher, to assume I can measure 0.02" or better? I ask this because the (very taut) line still has some flex. And the blocks could be very slightly unmatched, due to error in planing or wood movement.

It just seems too good to be true, and skilled Pros always make it look easy.

I'm also interested in trying the plumb bob. Always wondered why I see them in catalogs still, but Jim Pallas' post cleared that up for me. (Thanks Jim!)

As always, thanks for teaching us!
Fred

The precision you can detect will depend on several factors. The blocks need to be pretty accurate. A hand plane can take pretty fine shavings and work to tighter tolerances than an electric thickness planer. Vernier calipers can easily measure to .001". Your eye can easily see .001" under the right conditions, such as a backlit gap.

The line needs to be thin and taut. Twisted lines will have bumps, as Patrick correctly pointed out, but they average out. The rougher the line, and the surface being tested, the wider the traveling block should be to average out bumps and errors.

The rougher the surface being tested, the greater the error. A masonry wall is difficult to check for less than 1/16". But a mirror-finish stainless steel doorframe can easily be checked to less than .001".

When trying to measure to high precision, you need to develop a sense in hand and eye of whether the string is touching the traveling block or not. With practice, you can feel the block when it is touching the stringline, and see the stringline deflecting.

It helps to position your eye so your line of sight is in line with the offset block's face. With walls and ceilings, this can be a problem, so I increase the size of the blocks.

I mentioned a flashlight in my first post. This is a very useful tool especially for old eyes like mine. Even young eyes are helped a lot by the more uniform light a powerful flashlight can provide at any time of the day, in sunshine or shadow. Small and powerful is best, though especially in sunlight. The one I use is 700 lumens and small. I position my eye on one side of the stringline, and the light opposite shining at the block and towards my eye. I hood the end of the flashlight by cupping it in my hand to control where the light goes. High-power flashlights get hot, so some of my staff tape cardboard over the end to make the light "squint."

The gap (or lack thereof) between stringline and block is easily seen. Once you detect a gap, you can be measure it with feeler gauges if necessary. The only practical reason for feeler gauges though is to detect/record compliance with established tolerances and communicate the delta to others.

In industrial situations, where they use the electrically charged wires as I mentioned in my first post, they use precision steel offset blocks. The center block or "traveler" used is intentionally thinner than the end blocks. Combined with feeler gauges, swamps, bellies, and wind can be measured quite accurately by experienced people with steady hands. I have seen some truly amazing work done using these techniques by the wizards in stainless steel at Kikukawa Kogoyo, the top stainless steel architectural fabricator in the world, in my extensive experience. I wish I could show you pictures of the beautiful multi-axis curved stainless steel work they have done on some of my projects, but I would have packs of slavering lawyers from Cupertino jumping for my throat if I did.

http://www.kikukawa.com/en/

Hope this helps.

Stan

[Stanley Covington]

All the straight line work I've done lately - say about 7-8 years, I've used braided UHMW polyethylene (Spectra tm) fishing line. It's very strong (100 lb test), very VERY low stretch and very smooth. The only problem is that it's so smooth and so slick that it doesn't hold knots well. I keep mine on a small open face fishing reel on a stub of a rod that makes keeping the line working and untangled a breeze.

The Spectra can be tensioned to the limits your pins can hold, so you can keep sag to a minimum. I made my own pins with 1/8" drill rod, hardened and tempered, epoxied into turned handles. In my work, I'm usually using the string line on "framing" that is not part of the end result, so I can drive the pins in to a depth of and inch or so to hold a lot of tension.

Works for me.

Thanks James. Sounds perfect. I will go and buy some right away.

Please share some of the old-timey boat-building techniques with us.

Stan

[Bob Leistner]

Would it be possible to purchase a, say a new "Dewalt" chalk line and replace the string with the Spectra line to build a higher quality system?

[Phillip Mitchell]

What a great post, Stan! I use string lines as described in your post all the time at work as a carpenter. I just installed an entry door last week exactly as you described with the X string line method.

I like to use a Tajima extra fine chalk box with no chalk on it as a dry line. Nice, quality line and much easier and quicker to wind up and keep in order than a loose dry line.

Thanks you so much for these Ancient Tools posts. I'm looking forward to the plumb bob post.

[Stanley Covington]

I think I may have derailed this thread some by adding a plumb bob. The use of the dry string is the important part. There are many accessories that can be used with a dry string. The string is a very good and sensitive device for use in measuring and gauging. The plumb bob is one of the accessories along with dividers, feeler gauges, gauge blocks and line levels to name a few. Maybe those things can be used in further discussions.
Jim

No problemo, Jim.

I had intended to make a new post on Plumblines in a couple of weeks. We can wait until then, but I would not be offended if you started a separate one now. I have 2 or 3 ancient tricks that most people on SC will never have heard of.

Stan

[Stanley Covington]

What a great post, Stan! I use string lines as described in your post all the time at work as a carpenter. I just installed an entry door last week exactly as you described with the X string line method.

I like to use a Tajima extra fine chalk box with no chalk on it as a dry line. Nice, quality line and much easier and quicker to wind up and keep in order than a loose dry line.

Thanks you so much for these Ancient Tools posts. I'm looking forward to the plumb bob post.

Oh oh. More stuff I gotta buy!

[Stanley Covington]

I should have thought ahead and posted some pics of stringline reels. Not really reels, but I don't know a better word. They are called "itomaki" or "thread winders" in Japanese.

These are easily made, but I have several wooden units in several different sizes like the one in the attached picture with yellow stringline. They all spin on a long nail.

Very quick to use.

An interesting detail about the Japanese version of this ancient tool is the two hardened steel sharpened pins sticking out the ends of the two arms. These will poke holes in your hide, but they also allow you to stick the entire reel to a board to secure the stringline without rotating. See the examples in the cartoon promotion for the plastic version attached.

I like the chalkbox idea and will give it a try. The Spectra fishline Jim mentioned is genius.

Stan

itomaki1.jpgItomaki3.jpgitomaki-at50-1.jpg

[Stew Denton]

Stan,

Great post, and the comments by those, such as Stephen and other, who have also had considerable experience is much appreciated.

Back in the day I carpentered we used chalk lines a lot. I still use a chalk line part of the time to mark lumber for cutting and other purposes. Like some of the others I have also used string lines to check straightness. I also have and have used plumb lines, they can sometimes be used when nothing else will do or even can work. The old Stanley, and other brands, of chalk boxes can also be used as a plumb line, as you know, and in fact they were designed to do exactly that.

The discussion as to how to lay out a door jambs and dead flat surface was much appreciated, very well and clearly written, and I learned something and it was extremely interesting.

However, often times when installing a door jamb and door, though, for me it has been almost entirely in an existing house in existing walls in a remodeling effort, and as such getting the door to trim out nicely with the existing wall was as or more important than getting it dead flat. It had to function correctly too, though.

Because of that I normally start by mounting the hinges on the hinge side of the jamb,and then mark the hinge locations on the door itself by placing the door against the jamb with the correct gap at the header location and then use a utility knife to mark the hinge locations on the door. I then mount the hinges on the door and test them on the jamb.

Next I begin by leveling out the header of the jamb with my really good old Sands level that I bought new in the early 70s and have taken really good care of now for about 45 years. The 6' level is then used to get the hinge side of the jamb dead plumb and straight using shims and big finish nails. (I spent a significant amount of time, years ago, to determine which of the spirit level vials glasses were dead true on my level. Not all of them are.) You also have to check the door to make sure it is flat, straight, and square. I then mount the door on the hinge side of the jamb and true up all of the remaining edges with shims and finish nails to get all the gaps looking right. Lastly the stops go in.

However, I have to run the jamb true with the wall as much as is possible so the door casing can trim out the jamb and look good. Sometimes a plane is a necessary part of this. It is a game of compromise and truing so the door will look good and work correctly.

Stew

[Stanley Covington]

Stan,

Great post, and the comments by those, such as Stephen, who have also had considerable experience is much appreciated.

Back in the day I carpentered we used chalk lines a lot. I still use a chalk line part of the time to mark lumber for cutting and other purposes. Like some of the others I have also used string lines to check straightness. I also have and have used plumb lines, they can sometimes be used when nothing else will do or even can work. The old Stanley, and other brands, of chalk boxes can also be used as a plumb line, as you know, and in fact they were designed to do exactly that.

The discussion as to how to lay out a door jambs and dead flat surface was much appreciated, very well and clearly written, and extremely interesting. However, often times when installing a door jamb and door, though, for me it has been almost entirely in an existing house in existing walls in a remodeling effort, and as such getting the door to trim out nicely with the existing wall was as or more important than getting it dead flat.

Because of that I normally start by mounting the hinges on the hinge side of the jamb,and then mark the hinge locations on the door itself by placing the door against the jamb with the correct gap at the header location and then use a utility knife to mark the hinge locations against the hinges that are mounted on the jamb. I then mount the hinges on the door and test them on the jamb.

Next I begin by leveling out the header of the jamb with my really good old Sands level that I bought new in the early 70s and have taken really good care of now for nearly 50 years. I then use a 6' level to get the hinge side of the jamb dead plumb and straight using shims and big finish nails. (I spent a significant amount of time, years ago, to determine which of the spirit level vials glasses were dead true on my level. Not all of them are.) You also have to check the door to make sure it is flat, straight, and square. I then mount the door on the hinge side of the jamb and true up all of the remaining edges with shims and finish nails to get all the gaps looking right. Lastly the stops go in.

However, I have to run the jamb true with the wall as much as is possible so the door casing can trim out the jamb and look good. It is a game of compromise and truing so the door will look good and work correctly.

Stew

Very good points, Stew. My post was focused on new construction, and from the viewpoint of someone in the position, and with the authority and power of the purse, to have the work redone if it is incorrect. That is seldom the position of a carpenter doing remodeling where existing walls are retained.

Thanks.

[Frederick Skelly]

Thanks Stan!

[Stew Denton]

Stan,

I agree completely with you, and also assumed you were talking new construction. I want you to realize that I was not disagreeing with you, I learned from your post, and appreciated it. I just wanted to mention that you can't always do the flattening when doing remodeling work, which is almost entirely, but not quite, about all I did.

Great post Stan, and also the other knowledgeable contributors as well.

Thank you!

Stew