My point was only that there is a lot to consider and I tend to get wrapped up in the pros and cons to the point of eternal procrastination. If I were in the market, the input here would be very much appreciated. And from my point of view, your point that all major cabinet saws work well, seems to be what I would conclude.
You and I agree more than you think also. Lots of these threads tend to be more about retail therapy and justifying decisions we have made than about actual woodworking. We would be ahead as woodworkers all of us myself included if we spent as much time talking about techniques and safe practices as we do about different brands.
Thanks for educating me on this. I've only used a SawStop once, the PCS model I think. I shouldn't have speculated about a machine I know little about. I do now recall the LED green light that made the difference between the power switch doing nothing and turning the blade.
Prashun's question about the long term reliability of the electronics is a good one. One good thing is that many Sawstop saws are subjected to very heavy use in industrial applications and so far so good.
You do wonder about electronic components being the weak link though. Reminds me of my friend's sophisticated BMW that had a fuel level sensor that failed and thought the gas tank was empty when it was full. So the car wouldn't start and he had to have it towed to the BMW dealer. Maybe this idea argues for the bulletproof "work of art" old iron that some of the responses have been talking about.
Not everyone has access to used or older industrial machinery. Machinery that is in running shape, no work needed.
I appreciate the older stuff ( some of it, not all) and understand points made. But not everyone wants to hire a truck or trailer or take a few days off to go look/pick up some machine.
My point is, if a good 10" saw will last daily rigorous use in a working shop... as I know it will based on my previous post. Why say they're not quality? That's a bit of a stretch imo.
Andrew J. Coholic
The quality of the Sawstop is top notch. I bought one for my dad as a x-mas gift because hes a surgeon and knew the tech was solid but had doubts about the build quality. Boy was I wrong, you couldn't ask for a better saw. Solid build and it has a slick mobile base. This will be my next saw if my Jet ever needs to be replaced.
Those who dream by day are cognizant of many things which escape those who dream only by night
-Poe
i bought my Clausing 10" saw in 1963, and still use it, having never needed to "upgrade" my own saw. Here's why I prefer it over the Unisaw(which I like better as far as aesthetics are concerned)
Clausing is TWICE as heavy as the Unisaw. It has larger trunnions,worm gears,etc. inside.
The fence DOES NOT move when you lock it down. The original fences that Unisaws had ALWAYS move when you lock them down!
The Clausing runs MUCH more smoothly than the Unisaw. The weight and probably precision of parts is better throughout.
The Unisaw has a lot of pot metal parts on it. Delta machines always have these,and should NOT.
Things I DON'T like about the clausing:
The spatter paint they sprayed it with. If I had the energy,I'd strip the entire saw and paint it with a SMOOTH gray paint, like the Unisaw.
The 3/4" arbor on the Clausing makes it a PITA to buy blades for these days. In the 60's, little knock out bushings came on every blade. Just knock them out to change from 5/8" to 3/4". They do not have those bushings any more. Fortunately, also having a machine shop,I bore out new blades I buy to 3/4". That becomes a lot more trouble when fitting a stacked dado set!
The aesthetics of the Clausing aren't as pleasing as the Unisaw. That probably doesn't matter to a lot of people, and, indeed, is not really a factor in judging how good a machine is.
I bought a SAW STOP for the Toolmaker's Shop shortly before I retired, as my new aprentice had never used a table saw. Obviously it is a high quality made saw. I wish the arbor had Acme threads instead of those standard "V" threads. That is a cheap way to make it. With Acme type threads, which ALL saws USED to have, the blade has the wide, flat spots on the thread to sit upon. With the V threads, blades just sit on the sharp crests, which will not last as long as Acme threads on their crests.
The Saw Stop can ONLY be run with their own dado set. And, you cannot use anything except 10" blades. There goes my special 6" blades for cutting guitar frets grooves at .023" wide.
10" blades VARY a bit. At least 1/16" when new. To get the saw to start, the brake pad's distance to the bade has to be adjusted just right. I found my new Saw Stop to be bothersome to get going!
You don't DARE cutting any material that has even a MICROSCOPIC amount of aluminum in it: The brake will engage, costing you the $85.00 for the brake, and the $100.00 for a new blade. An architectural model maker friend of mine had had about TEN
false firings of the brakes. They used plexiglass with mirror backing for windows on their models. The mirror dust had gotten into the works and kept blowing out brakes even when cutting other materials with no metal !
The only cure was to take the top off the saw, and thoroughly clean EVERY crevice where the aluminum dust might be hiding.
There were other things I didn't like, but this post has gotten long enough already.
I always enjoy your posts. Agree on the Unsiaw and pot metal, and on your critique of the saw stop. Eventually I plan to upgrade to something vintage by someone like Olivier or Tanneswitz, but right now I am too busy building things to worry about another table saw. Trying to upgrade the rest of the shop first...
Clausing is a very nice saw, given the opportunity would love to own one. Agree with your philosophy of buy it once and do it right.
"The Saw Stop can ONLY be run with their own dado set."
As far as I know, you can run any 8" dado set. I get your point about blades in general, though. It can be persnickity.
I very much agree - have the same reaction to the new Nova drill press. Solid state electronics are in general pretty reliable, but they are not maintainable, and are negatively affected over time by temperature cycling, power cycling and physical shock. They also become obsolete quickly (there are parts in 20 year old electronics today that are almost impossible to source new). I'm looking for a new saw, but am increasingly inclined toward one without the electronics.
I have a Sawstop ICS but from the threads I read here, the next step up would be a slider of some sort. Posters say that the SS safety system is unnecessary with a slider.
I wouldn't go so far as to say "unnecessary" but the way you use a slider is very different than the way you use a cabinet saw and you're less likely to get your hand into the blade.
I wouldn't mind having a slider but just don't have the room. Plus, I've been able to do what I need to do with a cabinet saw and a track saw.
Mike
Go into the world and do well. But more importantly, go into the world and do good.