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Thread: Sander Suggestions

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eric Anderson View Post
    I have the Rotex 125 and the ETS ec 125. The Rotex can take down stock faster than my PC belt sander and the dust collection is great. The Rotex 150 has a larger surface area (about 30% larger) and thus better for larger areas (or at least faster), but I find the 125 more ergonomic and lighter and easier to use and since I already have the 5" sandpaper for the Rotex, went with the ec 125 so I could use a single sand paper size for both. If you are not sanding a lot of big table tops, you may be fine with the smaller foot print of the 125's. While I have gone to 220 with the Rotex, the ETS EC is much smoother and easier to handle than the Rotex, so I do the rough sanding with the Rotex and finish with the ETS EC. Can't stay away from the green koolaid nor the yellow mustard monsters. They keep calling me back.
    Thank you for an excellent post Eric. I have been going back & forth and I think you may have just convinced me about the ETC EC 125.
    "I've cut the dang thing three times and it's STILL too darn short"
    Name withheld to protect the guilty

    Stew Hagerty

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Jones View Post
    Buy a $50 ROS and put the $450 to something more important. Festool isn't worth the price if you're on a budget. Honestly, not even tradesman get festool in the field. If you don't have anything else to spend your money on, and clean your tools with rubbing alcohol every time you use them and like to see how pretty they look on the wall, get festool. If you actually do work and have better things to spend your money on, get something else.

    THAT SAID, the domino is worth the steep price if you're doing a lot of M+T joinery. This saves a shitton of time and makes up for the price. But you're going to have to do a lot of projects to validate the purchase. Even the tenons they sell are outrageously priced.

    Not for the festool purchasers, might give you a heart attack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oezp-_DcUgg
    IYHO "Festool isn't worth the price if you're on a budget." This (and your Domino comments) are certainly fair statements. The remainder of your opening statement is not borne out by my Festool usage or that of many other "tradesmen"/women I know. As expensive as the Festool line is those that I own have been well worth the investment. They are used hard and serve well. IMHO
    "... for when we become in heart completely poor, we at once are the treasurers & disbursers of enormous riches."
    WQJudge

  3. #33
    Fair. That's what makes the market what it is I guess. If everyone wanted the same type of tool at the same price point, then there wouldn't be a market, just a ticket taker.

    A sander is a sander is a sander.. it is a motor that spins.. nothing special. A $50 sander will get you to the same place a $600 sander will. The $600 sander is better if you're working in a place where you can't have any dust.

    The domino is so much better than a biscuit joiner, because it actually does something the other tools don't. So it's worth it. Just like a toll highway, it costs more but saves you money in the long run. $600 sanders? not so much. $1000 circular saws with brass bushings? LOL.

  4. #34
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    Mar 2007
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    I guess I could state that if one is doing this for a living and therefore time is truly money, any tool that pays for itself over a reasonable amount of time is a worthwile investment, and not merely an expense. That's the logic behind investing in expensive tools. Although I'm no longer doing woodworking for a living but still follow that logic... which is, I guess illogical! But, hey, I prefer to spend as little time as possible sanding and if an expensive tool does the job faster and more efficiently, I'm all over it! Bring on the Festools!!
    Marty Schlosser
    Kingston, ON, Canada

  5. #35
    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Jones View Post
    A sander is a sander is a sander.. it is a motor that spins.. nothing special. A $50 sander will get you to the same place a $600 sander will. The $600 sander is better if you're working in a place where you can't have any dust.

    I don't think I'm taking this out of context or misinterpreting it, but this statement is completely false.

    I don't care about dust collection. I care about results, and how quickly those results are reached. Not all sanders leave the same scratch behind, or do so in the same time frame. Rule out life span, purchase cost, operating cost, operator interface, operator fatigue, dust collection, and just dial it down to scratch. I will take any quality sander and it's price tag that operates as advertised over a lesser/cheaper sander just because of the results. Put those things back in, and it's a no brainer when your tools provide you with a livelihood.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Jones View Post
    Fair. That's what makes the market what it is I guess. If everyone wanted the same type of tool at the same price point, then there wouldn't be a market, just a ticket taker.

    A sander is a sander is a sander.. it is a motor that spins.. nothing special. A $50 sander will get you to the same place a $600 sander will. The $600 sander is better if you're working in a place where you can't have any dust.

    The domino is so much better than a biscuit joiner, because it actually does something the other tools don't. So it's worth it. Just like a toll highway, it costs more but saves you money in the long run. $600 sanders? not so much. $1000 circular saws with brass bushings? LOL.
    Wish this comment about the sander was true. I remember the cheap PC sander I had - was like hanging on to a buzzing brick. After about 10mins, fingers start to go numb from the vibrations. I would prefer not to sand at all, but, as that's not realistic, I want to use a tool that is quiet, light and doesn't vibrate

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stew Hagerty View Post
    What do you like about the Rotex ...? Does the Dual-Mode really make that much of a difference?
    I have the Rotex 125 and find that it works much better than my belt sander for rapid stock removal in rotex mode and is more than adequate for most finishing work. Dust collection is exceptional with the Festool vacuum. I used it in rotex mode to strip an oak bathroom floor and flush trim the edges on a pantry I built this week. It also performs very well in ROS mode but is a bit heavy and not as comfortable to use as a palm sander. Today I used it in ROS mode at its slowest speed with a single sheet of 80 grit paper to remove 100 year old varnish and shellac from a pine door. It gently removed the finish without going all the way down to bare wood and didn't gum up the sandpaper by heating the finish. I was able to dissolve the remaining shellac with DNA and OOOO steel wool to achieve a consistent color that I'll be able to easily refurbish with some fresh shellac.

    I was a skeptic about there being much difference between sanders but would buy the Rotex 125 again in a heartbeat. Well worth the money.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Jones View Post
    Fair. That's what makes the market what it is I guess. If everyone wanted the same type of tool at the same price point, then there wouldn't be a market, just a ticket taker.

    A sander is a sander is a sander.. it is a motor that spins.. nothing special. A $50 sander will get you to the same place a $600 sander will. The $600 sander is better if you're working in a place where you can't have any dust.

    The domino is so much better than a biscuit joiner, because it actually does something the other tools don't. So it's worth it. Just like a toll highway, it costs more but saves you money in the long run. $600 sanders? not so much. $1000 circular saws with brass bushings? LOL.
    I once though just like you, but then I discovered that I was an idiot.

  9. #39
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy Giddings View Post
    Wish this comment about the sander was true. I remember the cheap PC sander I had - was like hanging on to a buzzing brick. After about 10mins, fingers start to go numb from the vibrations. I would prefer not to sand at all, but, as that's not realistic, I want to use a tool that is quiet, light and doesn't vibrate
    I concur. I had to get away from the typical sub-$100 sanders to deal with the effects of vibration. The superior dust collection was icing on the cake. I'm now at almost ten years of use for the 150/3 and have replaced the pad a few times as the only maintenance. The first four years, I went through two of the PC333 sanders, so in retrospect my investment in the better tool wasn't so expensive after all. And I'm not a heavy user, either.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  10. #40
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    Well this thread sure took a turn.

    Anyway... So, the Rotex in kind of interesting. I'm just not sure about the comments that it's heavy, and that it doesn't do a good job as a finish sander.

    I use my RO sander from 40 grit up through 400. I've even used it for rubbing out up through 8000 grit. I'm a Hybrid Woodworker, so I also use handplanes a lot. Since I started using the planes, I rarely go to my belt sander anymore. Although there are some times when rapid, heavy stock removal would come in pretty handy. Hmmm...
    "I've cut the dang thing three times and it's STILL too darn short"
    Name withheld to protect the guilty

    Stew Hagerty

  11. #41
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    Stew, the Rotex is a nice and very capable machine. The older version like I have is a bit cumbersome for "regular" sanding use because it's not one-hand-friendly from a balance perspective. The current version may be better in that respect. About the only time I pull out the Rotex these days is if I'm going to do something "heavy duty" where the rotary action will be helpful or when I do my semi-annual workbench cleanup. Two hands on a large, stationary surface is comfortable for me. Otherwise, I prefer the 150/3 because of its ergonomics. If you have the ability to hold these tools prior to purchase, that might be a good idea. Woodcraft and other retailers sell them. Even our local Benjamin Moore store sells Festool sanders.
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Jones View Post

    A sander is a sander is a sander.. it is a motor that spins.. nothing special. A $50 sander will get you to the same place a $600 sander will. The $600 sander is better if you're working in a place where you can't have any dust.
    A car is a car is a car... says a person that has never driven a Porsche GT3 RS and/or doesn't car about cars or driving.

    To the OP, I have both the Deros (had a Ceros, no longer sold) and the ETS EC 150/3 and the Mirka is simply a better sander. I returned the ETS EC 150/5 because I like the Mirka better, I traded it for the 150/3 since I wanted a shorter stroke brushless sander and my dealer didn't have the Deros 2.5 in stock. The only issue with the Deros is it cost more than the Festool. I think the ergonomics are better (more like a pneumatic) and it has even less vibration. That said the Ceros is/was the best electric sander re ergonomics, if you have a chance to get one it would be my choice.

    Edit RE the Rotex, it is a different beast, more a 2 handed stock remover than a comfortable ROS, I do not find them fun to use for finish sanding which is 90% of my hand sanding work.
    Last edited by Van Huskey; 02-09-2017 at 12:36 AM.
    Of all the laws Brandolini's may be the most universally true.

    Deep thought for the day:

    Your bandsaw weighs more when you leave the spring compressed instead of relieving the tension.

  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan Jones View Post

    Not for the festool purchasers, might give you a heart attack: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oezp-_DcUgg
    I think everyone on the internet knows of AvE.

    The key is there of tens of thousands of the TS 55 plunge saws being used day in and day out by tradesmen and the the number are failures reported are very low and certainly nothing to indicate a pattern problem. If you want to have a go at Festool start with the Kapex at least then it will appear you did a little homework.
    Of all the laws Brandolini's may be the most universally true.

    Deep thought for the day:

    Your bandsaw weighs more when you leave the spring compressed instead of relieving the tension.

  14. #44
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    I've had the Deros for about six months now, and I'm not in love with it. The paddle switch is annoying, there's no lock so you have to keep it depressed all the time, and if you forget to turn the sander off it triggers inadvertently while changing disks, etc. There is something not right with the hook/loop sanding pad on mine, it won't hold on to my Klingspor disks for more than a few minutes before shooting the disk across the room, with the Abranet disks the attachment still fails long before the abrasive side of the disk is worn out. (this has been true with several different new attachment pads) I've been messing with different vacuum hoses, and now have a smaller diameter very flexible Bosch hose that works OK. With the hose that came with the Deros the ergonomics are terrible, the sander is so light that the hose completely dominates the way it handles. It's a constant battle to keep the sander flat to the surface without exerting too much pressure, as the hose completely overbalances it. When it works there's nothing magical about it, it sands and produces a nice finish-- but so did the sander it replaced that cost less than half as much.

  15. #45
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    I'm going to pile on with several of the others... I have both the Festool 150/3 and the Rotex 150. The 150/3 is one of the most used tools in my shop. It is comfortable, you can use it for extended periods (low vibration), and the dust collection is fantastic. It also does a great job giving a smooth surface. I use the Rotex for heavy stock removal, stripping, and initial sanding. It is much more a two-handed sander. If I were recommending a new sander to someone, it would be the 150/3 (or 125/3 if you prefer 5")

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