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Thread: Green wood end grain sealer iTree Saver Brand vs Anchorseal vs Anchorseal 2

  1. #1
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    Green wood end grain sealer iTree Saver Brand vs Anchorseal vs Anchorseal 2

    Okay, I have seen various discussions regarding Anchorseal and just using latex paint to seal end grain. I have used Anchorseal (original formula not not Anchorseal 2) in the past and am getting low on my existing supply. I have tried the latex paint in the past and it works okay but I seem to get a little more checking than I do when I use Anchorseal.

    Anyone have any info on Crafts Supplies PVA based "Tree Saver End Grain Wood Sealer" https://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/p...er?term=sealer

    how does it compares to Anchorseal or Anchorseal 2 which are wax based emulsion sealers?

    Thanks
    Ricc

  2. #2
    I've heard of people using watered down wood glue (i.e., pva) as a sealer. Does it work? I imagine it does. But when they say it "outperforms" wax, I think they mean the wood dries faster. That might be desirable for (some) bowl blanks, but it isn't as safe or versatile. And it probably doesn't have the perpetual easy cleanup of anchorseal.

    I've been using anchorseal 2 and after going through almost the whole 5 gallon bucket, I think I'm going to go back to the original now that I've found you can order it directly from the manufacturer. I'd rather my bowl blanks dry slower than have to to paint all the ends of my boards twice.
    Last edited by Bob Bouis; 08-01-2016 at 10:20 AM.

  3. #3
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    If you're going to buy Anchorseal, I would call UC Coatings directly and order the original formula.

    BUT, Anchorseal wouldn't be my first choice today. I would buy the Tree Saver End Grain sealer from Craft Supplies. It's comparable in price to Anchorseal and according to Kirk DeHeer of Craft Supplies, it outperforms Anchorseal. I talked to Kirk quite a bit about it during a class that I took and again at the Utah Symposium. Kirk does a lot of rough out bowls that he sells. He tested Tree Saver for a year or more (if I remember right) before it was brought to market. Remember that Utah is a very dry place, and trying to slow down moisture loss is harder in Utah than other places. In all of Kirks testing, the only bowls that cracked were those that had an existing defect. Every other bowl - read that as 100% success or 0% loss - did not crack. That's worth it right there in my book. But Kirk also said that Tree Saver also cuts down the drying time by half. So if you normally air dry a bowl for a year with Anchorseal, that same bowl would be ready to re-turn in 6 months with Tree Saver.

    Kirk is much more knowledgeable about the make up of Tree Saver than I am, but I know that he talked to the folks that make Anchorseal. Tree Saver differs from Anchorseal and all the other wax emulsions on the market in it's chemical makeup, but I couldn't tell you the specifics of what that is. Maybe it's that Tree Saver is PVA based instead of wax based? That kind of talk was frankly a bit over my head and I was getting glassy eyed. All I needed to hear was how it performed.

    I still have a little left of my old sealer so I haven't used Tree Saver yet. Everything I've said is going off what Kirk told me. But the choice was an easy one for me - it costs the same, 0% loss, and 1/2 the dry time.

  4. #4
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    http://www.baileysonline.com
    anyone used Bailey sealant. Great price if it works as the orginial anchorseal

  5. #5
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    Latex paint is basically useless as it is formulated to pass water vapor through to prevent peeling. Most of the other parafin based endsealers seem to work well except for anchorseal II. When anchorseal did their change I went to Artisan wood sealer sold by Craft Supplies some 10 years ago. It is fine in every respect. I coat all my roughouts--bowls and vases inside.

  6. #6
    Maybe I'm overly cynical about merchants and puffery, but saying that none of their test bowls cracked unless there was some defect isn't saying much, since it doesn't take much to prevent cracking or checking in straight-grained, perfectly turned bowls. But if you've got figure, or you've tried to maximize size by going closer to the pith than you should, or you left the bottom too thick, or whatever, cracking still isn't inevitable. Slowing down the drying as much as possible seems to give the best results. That's why everyone seems to prefer the original anchorseal to the new version. Unless there's some other mechanism at play with the PVA sealers, faster drying is going to equal more cracking.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Nix View Post
    http://www.baileysonline.com
    anyone used Bailey sealant. Great price if it works as the orginial anchorseal
    Baileys is what I have been using for the past couple of years. I bought a 5 gallon bucket and still have a little left to use up, then I'll start in on my 5 gallon bucket of Tree Saver. Baileys works much better than Anchorseal 2, I have not lost bowls to cracking like I did with Anchorseal 2. I would say it's comparable to the original Anchorseal as far as effectiveness, although it's been years since I used the original. Baileys is watery, I don't remember the original Anchorseal being as thin. But it works so no complaints. Had Tree Saver not come out, I would buy Baileys again or ordered the original Anchorseal.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Bouis View Post
    Maybe I'm overly cynical about merchants and puffery, but saying that none of their test bowls cracked unless there was some defect isn't saying much, since it doesn't take much to prevent cracking or checking in straight-grained, perfectly turned bowls. But if you've got figure, or you've tried to maximize size by going closer to the pith than you should, or you left the bottom too thick, or whatever, cracking still isn't inevitable. Slowing down the drying as much as possible seems to give the best results. That's why everyone seems to prefer the original anchorseal to the new version. Unless there's some other mechanism at play with the PVA sealers, faster drying is going to equal more cracking.
    Bob you're missing the point. I used original Anchorseal and had good success with it. Then I used Anchorseal 2 and had terrible results. I roughed out bowls the same way as I had for years, and all of a sudden I couldn't figure out why half of them were cracking. I thought it was me, what did I do different, was it the type of wood or time of year. Then I read of others having similar problems with AS2. I don't like to lose even one bowl to cracking, I have a lot of time invested in them at that point.

    I had got a nice truck load of Black Walnut and had spent a lot of time chainsawing, bandsaw round, coring and roughing out. I probably had 50 bowl blanks waxed and downstairs drying in my basement. Two weeks later it seemed like close to half of them had cracks. Some of the blanks were 15" to 18" diameter, so to have a nice big blank like that crack and become useless is really frustrating. So I resorted to waxing the blank and then put it in a paper bag or cardboard box. Or pack it with shavings. AS2 recommends putting on two coats. Ever try to put wax over an already waxed surface? So now I had to take extra precautions and use twice as much AS2 (in addition to all the other tricks), all in an attempt to keep my bowls from cracking. Remember I never had to do any of these extra steps with the original AS - just paint it on and wait for it to dry. I agree slowing down drying is the key - with Baileys, Anchorseal, or Anchorseal 2.

    But if there is a new product that will eliminate even one bowl from cracking, then it's got my attention. Like I said, I have a lot of time invested in the bowl at that point. If that same product will eliminate cracking AND reduce the drying time by half, AND is the same price as the other brands out there, well now I'm all ears and ready to buy.

  8. #8
    I just don't see how if slow drying [Anchorseal 1] = good and fast drying [Anchorseal 2] = bad, it follows that really fast drying [PVA] = best.

    Like I said, I might be overly skeptical. Please do let us know how it works!

  9. #9
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    For what it is worth, I had a chance to chat with Glenn Lucas who turns hundreds/thousands of bowls a year. He uses cheap white glue for this purpose. He told me he changed because the inevitable spills of any wax based product made the floor slick. I use anchor seal original and get about what everyone else gets, some crack, some don't generally the ones I wish wouldn't do.

  10. #10
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    I recently tried the new Tree Saver product from CraftSupplies and it seems to be working fine. I brought a load of wood (cherry, walnut, maple, etc) from Michigan to SW Colorado where it is very dry. I cut them into manageable sizes and sealed everything. So far after about 8 weeks I haven't had any cracking. I have everything from small pieces to pieces that are 24" across. I did use a couple coats on some of the pieces. Just my experience so far.

  11. #11
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    Like Greg points out--technique is necessary here like most things. I often double coat bowl and vase rims and bottoms if they show endgrain. Some really crazy woods get an entire second coat--it,s cheap.

  12. #12
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    I know this is an old tread. So what are you guys opinions now? I'm new to turning and the forum. I would like to use what's best for the job.

  13. #13
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    I am using latex house paint on live cut birch. The various species of birches that grow in Alaska are quite prone to checking. I am starting with freshly felled live trees delivered as 16" rounds for firewood, using a firewood splitter to bang out pieces that look sort of quarter sawn except for not having been sawn, and then painting the end grain of the ones I want to work on to slow drying and reduce checking.

    I am confident latex house paint is not ideal, but I have nearly five gallons of a color my family decided didn't look right when I started slapping it on the side of the house. I find on my local birches latex paint does slow drying, enough to dramatically reduce end splits and end checking on green birch. I don't mind losing a few pieces as I paid under 10 cents per board foot for the birch. The pigment in the paint is probably causing a little wear and tear on my edges of my froe and drawknives as I process the original chunks - the firewood pieces - down to chair part sized components.

    If I was storing more expensive wood I would definitely look for a more ideal product to protect the investment better.

  14. #14
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    Seems like drying wood is an individual thing. Temperature, humidity, how it's stored etc. One size doesn't fit all. Our turning club buys 50 gal. drums and I get it from them for $10 a gallon. I don't know if it's Anchor Seal 1 or 2. Pretty good deal and in my conditions it works most of the time.

  15. #15
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    I don’t have enough experience to comment with any degree of assurance but it seems to me that the Tree Saver product allows the wood to dry faster than Anchorseal. And it “dries” to a hard finish rather than a waxy feel that the Anchorseal has.But if I set a wet edge on cardboard I can be assured the cardboard will stick to the wood. Minor nuisance.

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