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Thread: Oklahoma Homestead 40x80x12

  1. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Heidrick View Post
    I agree! Those lights are very dim compared to some options out there for sure. You have super tall ceilings - This is not a 12' ceiling (much less 8'-10') you are dealing with.

    I think you are really wanting some T5HO lights. Some may say T8HO but taking into account your 3200sqft and a rough stab at 400 sqft per fixture you are looking at a minimum of 8 six bulb fixtures at about 3 amps each which will be a couple circuits. I am actually running 8 now on two circuits in a 40X64X16 in two rows of 4 ea and plan to add two more rows of four lights on a total of 4 lighting circuits. It is super nice having good lighting and I want no issue seeing anywhere. I am running Howard ballasts/fixtures purchased from corslighting on ebay in jacksonville IL using the 5000k lamps. I really like the light and so has everyone that has been in there. Cost is about $110 ea with bulbs shipped.
    Thanks, Mike. I really like what you've done with your shop so far. I will check out the lights you have.


    Quote Originally Posted by Greg R Bradley View Post
    My original post was assuming you would mount the lights at 12-14'. If you wish to mount them at 16', that does open up the 4xT5HO as a reasonable option. They basically have the same light out of a smaller area so they glare more at lower heights. Being a bit smaller and lighter they are easier to mount. At 16' either is a good option. I mounted the 167 6xT8 units in the big building at 28' and they work fine at that height.

    85 avg Lumens per watt - 216 watt for 18,200 lumens: 4 T5HO using high output long life bulbs
    89 avg Lumens per watt - 192 watt for 17,200 lumens: 6 T8 using high output long life bulbs
    88 avg Lumens per watt - 128 watt for 11,200 lumens: I-Beam LED $199 at HD.

    All these are using average lumens which is after 30,000 hours of use at 12 hours per day. T5HO specs drop below 95 degrees, certainly not a problem near the ceiling around here.

    ALL of these require 2' clearance to ceiling. LED also spec 104 degree max.

    T5HO lose the ability to turn half of the bulbs on and then turn on the other half when/where you want more light. May be a big deal for some, certainly for me. Could be a huge money saver if you have skylights. OK is sunny a lot, right?

    You mentioned trying some. You probably need to try 2 mounted at your intended height and separated by your planned row distance. Pretty easy with a forklift.
    Greg, all good points. I think I'll stay with the T8 or T5 High Bays. I've been looking at specs on them and they seem to be rated for 15-40 ft ceilings so no worries as far as having a really high ceiling. Thanks for the information you provided, very helpful.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tom M King View Post
    That's what my Wife and I said in 1980 when we decided to build her pottery shop first, and live in it for a while. We've been here for coming up on 36 years.
    Tom, I can see us doing that too! I think that's very cool!


    Quote Originally Posted by Brad Adams View Post
    I just built A 50'X80'X14' new shop. My electrician had the lighting designed. I have 18- 6 bulb t-5 high bay fixtures.

    The light output is awesome. I would have went LED if there would have been rebates available to help with the cost. Unfortunately, the utility here only offers rebates on replacing existing fixtures.
    Thanks for chiming in Brad. I will take your experience into consideration when designing my grid. I may go to a local lighting supply store and see if they provide any kind of design services. I plan to do all the electrical myself from the main panel out to the lights, fans, and outlets.
    Jeff

  2. #17

    Second crack at the lighting design

    Here's another grid design for the lights. This plan would place 1 fixture every 100 sq feet. With this density I would put each row on its own circuit or if I got dual ballast fixtures, half of each row on a circuit. I'll have a large main panel with 200 amps, so no worries on the number of circuits in the box.

    shop w lights 2.jpg
    Jeff

  3. #18
    Wondering what is the purpose of building with 16' sidewalls? Do you plan to build a 2 story house in one end? I have a neighbor who did that, about half the shed is house and the other half is a huge high ceiling garage.
    I have a 16' sidewall building, but built it so a combine would fit under the door. Adjusting the doors is a pain, huge high ceiling. Need a long ladder to do anything in there.

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
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    El Dorado Hills, CA
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    1,311
    I would want lots of light switches. No sense in lighting the entire building if you are only working in one zone.

    Steve

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Upland, CA
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    1,344
    FYI, assuming full reflector High Bay Lighting and good bulbs, measured at 30" bench height and 14' fixture height:

    Your first plan of 3 rows of 7 4xT8 is 73fc

    My initial suggestion of 6xT8 with double ballast and 3 rows of 6 is 88fc

    Change that to 4xT5HO is 85fc

    Change that to $199 HD LED High bay is 67fc

    If you change to 4 rows of 5 then the 6xT8 gets you 92fc, 4 rows of 6 gets you 110fc, your last design of 4 rows of 7 is 120fc

  6. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Andrew View Post
    Wondering what is the purpose of building with 16' sidewalls? Do you plan to build a 2 story house in one end? I have a neighbor who did that, about half the shed is house and the other half is a huge high ceiling garage.
    I have a 16' sidewall building, but built it so a combine would fit under the door. Adjusting the doors is a pain, huge high ceiling. Need a long ladder to do anything in there.
    I do plan on a 2nd floor above the office/bathroom area and would like the ability to duplicate that arrangement anywhere in the building as needs change. It's just a way to get more floorspace as needed. Also, I had planned on buying some rolling scaffolding for the interior build out, so I should have it handy to change light bulbs.


    Quote Originally Posted by Steve Peterson View Post
    I would want lots of light switches. No sense in lighting the entire building if you are only working in one zone.

    Steve
    Absolutely! I want to only turn on what I need depending on which area of the building I'm working in. I'll be buying romex in the big rolls



    Quote Originally Posted by Greg R Bradley View Post
    FYI, assuming full reflector High Bay Lighting and good bulbs, measured at 30" bench height and 14' fixture height:

    Your first plan of 3 rows of 7 4xT8 is 73fc

    My initial suggestion of 6xT8 with double ballast and 3 rows of 6 is 88fc

    Change that to 4xT5HO is 85fc

    Change that to $199 HD LED High bay is 67fc

    If you change to 4 rows of 5 then the 6xT8 gets you 92fc, 4 rows of 6 gets you 110fc, your last design of 4 rows of 7 is 120fc
    Prepare for the Sunburn!!

    You are a lighting guru, Sir.
    Last edited by Jefferey Scott; 01-21-2016 at 12:49 PM.
    Jeff

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Fredericksburg, TX
    Posts
    2,576
    In addition to lots of light switches, I recommend using multiple breakers and also have an emergency exit light(s) for power outage. I got caught in shop early one morning when there was a power outage and had to feel my way across shop to flashlight.

  8. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by Thomas Canfield View Post
    In addition to lots of light switches, I recommend using multiple breakers and also have an emergency exit light(s) for power outage. I got caught in shop early one morning when there was a power outage and had to feel my way across shop to flashlight.
    Amen on the multiple breakers, I'll have plenty to use. And I hadn't thought of the emergency exit light. I know exactly what you're talking about and that's an excellent suggestion. Thanks Thomas.
    Jeff

  9. #24
    I wish I had some construction pictures for everyone, that will happen in June/July. For now, I can show you where the shop will sit...

    IMG_2824m.jpg
    Jeff

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Yorktown, VA
    Posts
    2,754
    A bit off topic, but have you considered adding a storm shelter? It might be easier now than later. You won't regret having one when that big twister heads your way.

  11. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Ted Calver View Post
    A bit off topic, but have you considered adding a storm shelter? It might be easier now than later. You won't regret having one when that big twister heads your way.
    Storm shelter? Absolutely!
    Jeff

  12. #27

    I'm Back! Now a 40x80x12 Pole Building

    Hi Guys,

    It's been over a year now and has taken me that long to get things in order. I just signed a contract for my 40x80x12 Shop with a local pole barn builder. I reduced the height of the building from 16 to 12 in order to keep within my budget which is pretty strict. It also allowed me some funds to start finishing out the inside. So to recap this is going to be a metal fab and woodworking shop. The two will be at opposite ends of the building to reduce the chance that metal grit and grime will stay out of the woodworking area. I've got some pictures of the land where the building will go and renditions of what the building should look like below.

    Wide shot of our 10 acres from the back fenceline

    Back of Property.jpg

    Shot of where the shop will sit. Four t posts mark the corners

    IMG_0731.jpg

    Shot of grade slope. Its slopes from front to back 18". House in the shot is the neighbors.
    IMG_0734.jpg

    Front of Shop
    IMG_0782.jpg
    Back of Shop
    Back.jpg
    Floorplan including living quarters at the west end.
    FloorPlan.jpg

    So the builder has me about 8 weeks out on their schedule. They might bump me up if an opening comes available. The plan calls for a dirt building pad to be constructed and then built on. They will pour a 4" slab with monolithic stem walls around the perimeter. I'm going to contract the dirt work. I calculate I'll need 10 loads of loam to do it. Haven't got a quote yet, I'm getting recommendations from the builder on dirt guys in the area. This building will be our primary residence for a while. Can't wait to get all my machines and tools moved in. This is something I've dreamed of for decades, but waited almost too late to accomplish (I'm 54).

    Thanks for looking.

    Jeff
    Jeff

  13. #28
    Greg,

    Great post with the numbers. My 58 year old eyes are fine with 73 foot candles for sure. One point that I didn't notice mentioned in this thread is that not only are high quality lamps important, the output of the ballasts is key. Most HIF (High Intensity Fluorescent) high bay fixtures come with High lumen output ballasts but not all. T8 Ballasts typically come in low, normal and high output versions. They all produce about the same lumens per watt (roughly), the higher the output the higher the energy consumption (sp). Something about physics there. Sorry, I digressed. Make sure you get the high output ballasts in your high bay fixtures.

    Also, I strongly agree with the recomendation that you switch the devil out of that lighting layout. Stating the obvious perhaps, you can put multiple switchs on a circuit as long as you don't exceed the wiring/breaker limitations. The 21 fixtures you discribed will draw a little over an amp apiece. Once I do the math thats 2.4ish kW. If you are paying 10 cents a kWh for electricity, thats 24 cents an hour if they are all on. Your Mileage WILL Vary.

    Paint everything (ceiling/walls/floor) as light a color as you can stand. I recommend white for ceiling and walls, light gray/tan for the floor. The reflectance can add 10% plus to your over all light levels, especially near the edges.

    Cuse my spelling, I do Math and lighting lol. Lastly, I think you'll be very happy with your original 3x7 layout.

  14. #29
    You might look at putting your storm shelter inside the building. We went through a tornado in 1980, had to go outside to get into the cellar, so we just sat in the house, and the tornado went around us. It took the barn across the road, and spread debris all directions around our old house.

  15. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by mike wacker View Post
    Greg,

    Great post with the numbers. My 58 year old eyes are fine with 73 foot candles for sure. One point that I didn't notice mentioned in this thread is that not only are high quality lamps important, the output of the ballasts is key. Most HIF (High Intensity Fluorescent) high bay fixtures come with High lumen output ballasts but not all. T8 Ballasts typically come in low, normal and high output versions. They all produce about the same lumens per watt (roughly), the higher the output the higher the energy consumption (sp). Something about physics there. Sorry, I digressed. Make sure you get the high output ballasts in your high bay fixtures.

    Also, I strongly agree with the recomendation that you switch the devil out of that lighting layout. Stating the obvious perhaps, you can put multiple switchs on a circuit as long as you don't exceed the wiring/breaker limitations. The 21 fixtures you discribed will draw a little over an amp apiece. Once I do the math thats 2.4ish kW. If you are paying 10 cents a kWh for electricity, thats 24 cents an hour if they are all on. Your Mileage WILL Vary.

    Paint everything (ceiling/walls/floor) as light a color as you can stand. I recommend white for ceiling and walls, light gray/tan for the floor. The reflectance can add 10% plus to your over all light levels, especially near the edges.

    Cuse my spelling, I do Math and lighting lol. Lastly, I think you'll be very happy with your original 3x7 layout.
    Thanks for your thoughts Mike. I am definitely going to have multiple switches and lighting zones. Question, since my ceiling height is 12' now, do i still need High-Bay fixtures?
    Jeff

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