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Thread: Veritas Shooting Plane Tolerance

  1. #46
    Join Date
    Nov 2015
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    Vienna, Austria
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patrick Chase View Post
    If one of the collets that holds the fence on the rod were tilted as you say then it should be almost impossible to move the fence all the way in - is that the case?
    I can only guess how free it supposed to move. But it is moving with some difficulty it tends to stuck on one side or another. Also very hard to remove from the rods. Had to use mallet to slightly tap it out. It moves better on other set of rods I attached to Custom #7 and goes off much better. I think if it would barely movie it would be noticed by manufacturer's personal.

    There is a visual difference how they pressed in. And measurable distance from the collet to fence working surface that doesn't match between the two.

    Meanwhile, I've got a reply and will ship it back to the seller for inspection.

  2. #47
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    Dec 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andrey Kharitonkin View Post
    I can only guess how free it supposed to move. But it is moving with some difficulty it tends to stuck on one side or another. Also very hard to remove from the rods. Had to use mallet to slightly tap it out. It moves better on other set of rods I attached to Custom #7 and goes off much better. I think if it would barely movie it would be noticed by manufacturer's personal.

    There is a visual difference how they pressed in. And measurable distance from the collet to fence working surface that doesn't match between the two.

    Meanwhile, I've got a reply and will ship it back to the seller for inspection.
    That sounds like a canted collet. Did you happen to notice whether the rods move freely through the collet when not attached to a plane? (i.e. no angular constraint)

  3. #48
    I only own two LV tools..the cutting gauge with the mortising wheels and the tiny little router. The router is cool even if it's really difficult to get that iron loaded in just right, and the cutting gauge works just like it's supposed to. I prefer the traditional design for a marking gauge because I like a one-handed set, but I have used this one a few times.

    But the mortise marking wheels did not impress me in the slightest. I am not a fan of the design to start with (micro-size set screws to fasten to the shaft and total inability to mark less than about 3/8"?) but when they bent on first use in construction pine, they went back into the baggie and haven't seen the light of day since. They were a gift so I didn't want to hurt the sender's feelings by returning them.

    I'll stick with an English gauge personally, but they have lots of other stuff in my wish list...like router cutters and maybe the bahco files.

  4. #49
    Join Date
    May 2013
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    Johannesburg, South Africa
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    1,076
    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Canaday View Post
    I only own two LV tools..the cutting gauge with the mortising wheels and the tiny little router.

    But the mortise marking wheels did not impress me in the slightest. I am not a fan of the design to start with (micro-size set screws to fasten to the shaft and total inability to mark less than about 3/8"?) but when they bent on first use in construction pine, they went back into the baggie and haven't seen the light of day since.
    Firstly those wheels are hardened so either you received a dud (and then should have returned it for a replacement) or you accidentally tried to mark a concrete pillar

    I'm also not sure what you mean by;
    mark less than about 3/8"?
    If you have the dual marking gauge, then those wheels can effectively mark a mortise width one ball hair thin. If you mean the length of the mortise, then you're using the wrong tool.

    I'm also not sure what your beef is regarding the;
    (micro-size set screws to fasten to the shaft
    You could swap this out for a 1/2-20 machine screw but I suspect this will affect the balance .
    Last edited by Hilton Ralphs; 02-06-2016 at 1:11 AM.
    "If you have all your fingers, you can convert to Metric"

  5. #50
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    Dec 2015
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hilton Ralphs View Post
    If you have the dual marking gauge, then those wheels can effectively mark a mortise width one ball hair thin. If you mean the length of the mortise, then you're using the wrong tool.
    He has these. I have them as well, and saw the same thing - the minimum mortise width is limited to about 3/8 unless you reverse them such that the bevels are on the outside, but that obviously brings its own issues. They also clearly spell out that limitation on the product page so I'm not sure why anybody would be complaining about it after the fact...

    I use the dual gauge for narrower mortises, which as you say has no such limitations. I still use the wheelset on the single-beam gauge sometimes because it's a little less cumbersome and a little easier to adjust to match the width of a mortise chisel. The trick to doing that on the dual gauge is to retract the inside arm so its wheel is flush to the gauge face, lay the chisel across the gauge face and adjust the outer arm to match, then lock down the shaft clamp (a mandatory accessory that they should just include with the dual gauge IMO) and extend both arms to the desired offset.

    The wheels on all of my Veritas gauges are reasonably hard. You can also buy extras fairly cheapy. I keep a couple sets on hand so that I can keep working if I do something silly.
    Last edited by Patrick Chase; 02-06-2016 at 12:01 PM.

  6. #51
    Took delivery of the Veritas Shooting Plane and the plane was out of Square by 3 1/2 thousands (.0035) at the tallest point, contacted Vertitas and they said the their tolerances for there planes was .003. I have sent it back as they wanted to inspect the plane, All my Lie Nielsen planes are at most .0015 thou out. So the 3 1/2 thou, is not acceptable to me, for a shooting plane.

    So sent an email to Veritas Customer Service, and Shannon in that department sent back this reply... i quote..." In what way was it out of spec, and do you recall how far out of square was it?. We ask because some people do not realize that the plane is intentionally slightly under square so that the plane leans a tiny bit away from the shooting board up to .003" for clearance. If this is what you ran into this is normal. Tha lateral adjustment capability of the blade allows you to ensure the blade cuts your wood square." end quote.
    This is not my first rodeo with a plane, but this reply is not consistent with other peoples experience and replies from Veritas, on out of speck planes.
    Any body care to reply on this matter?
    Thanks
    dennis.

  7. #52
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    I'm curious how you measured .0035"

    Brian
    The significant problems we encounter cannot be solved at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.

    The penalty for inaccuracy is more work

  8. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Peterson View Post
    Took delivery of the Veritas Shooting Plane and the plane was out of Square by 3 1/2 thousands (.0035) at the tallest point, contacted Vertitas and they said the their tolerances for there planes was .003. I have sent it back as they wanted to inspect the plane, All my Lie Nielsen planes are at most .0015 thou out. So the 3 1/2 thou, is not acceptable to me, for a shooting plane.

    So sent an email to Veritas Customer Service, and Shannon in that department sent back this reply... i quote..." In what way was it out of spec, and do you recall how far out of square was it?. We ask because some people do not realize that the plane is intentionally slightly under square so that the plane leans a tiny bit away from the shooting board up to .003" for clearance. If this is what you ran into this is normal. Tha lateral adjustment capability of the blade allows you to ensure the blade cuts your wood square." end quote.
    This is not my first rodeo with a plane, but this reply is not consistent with other peoples experience and replies from Veritas, on out of speck planes.
    Any body care to reply on this matter?
    Thanks
    dennis.
    I'm sorry but I must be missing something, because I don't see anything improper with his response. It sounds like he is trying to understand the problem so he can address it.

    They arent BS'ing you about the 0.003 tolerance. They have been consistently forthright about that. In fact, mine came with an insert saying that was so and to adjust the blade accordingly.

    I haven't had an ounce of problem adjusting-out the .003 - have you?

    Fred
    "All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing."

    “If you want to know what a man's like, take a good look at how he treats his inferiors, not his equals.”

  9. #54
    Hi Brian, measured with a Mitutoyo 6" master square, that is only used to check tools and is checked with my known cast iron L gauge. So holding up the square to the the plane body and sliding a .0035 shim under the square where the plane shoulder was out you get .0035 out of Square.
    So the Veritas Tolerance, i know , is .003 thou and this plane was .0035 so it is out of their tolerance,. by their standards. Also when I make a shooting board it is square, and this is the first time i have herd that they (intentionally) make the plane out of square?, so which is it , the tolerance is .003 or the plane is made out of square, so it does not hit your Square shooting board fence.
    i personally would rather have a Square shooting plane that is in tolerance. I have 3 veritas planes and the last two have been out of spec, so 2 out of 3 is not a good track record. When I sent back
    the Custom Jointer the service rep said they were having production problems with the custom jointer planes.
    Would just like to get an in spec plane that I paid for that's all. with out having to correct something on my part.
    thanks For your replies.

  10. #55
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Location
    New England area
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    588
    I would imagine that 'in spec' encompasses every point between perfectly dead square and whatever the advertised tolerance is, three thousandths I think is the number being quoted. Disclosing this fact doesn't necessarily make it palatable to the guy or gal who gets one at the extreme end of the range. Not every plane that rolls off the line is .003 out, some are perfect and some are at points in-between. Knowing this is how it works would make me a bit of an unhappy camper if I got one at .003 -- just barely in spec. Others received planes in closer tolerance.

    Whoever is guaranteeing one at 1.5 thousandths (I think I read this in the thread) has a more sensitive finger on the pulse of the woodworker who would own one of these planes in the first place and probably deserves the business. They are guaranteeing a spec 100% better than the other company. No brainer. Anybody guaranteeing 1. 5 has a lot of confidence in the material and how they're handling it, their design, their machinery, and their employees.
    Last edited by Charles Guest; 08-18-2018 at 1:08 PM.

  11. #56
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    Feb 2004
    Location
    Perth, Australia
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    9,467
    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Peterson View Post
    Took delivery of the Veritas Shooting Plane and the plane was out of Square by 3 1/2 thousands (.0035) at the tallest point, contacted Vertitas and they said the their tolerances for there planes was .003. I have sent it back as they wanted to inspect the plane, All my Lie Nielsen planes are at most .0015 thou out. So the 3 1/2 thou, is not acceptable to me, for a shooting plane.

    So sent an email to Veritas Customer Service, and Shannon in that department sent back this reply... i quote..." In what way was it out of spec, and do you recall how far out of square was it?. We ask because some people do not realize that the plane is intentionally slightly under square so that the plane leans a tiny bit away from the shooting board up to .003" for clearance. If this is what you ran into this is normal. Tha lateral adjustment capability of the blade allows you to ensure the blade cuts your wood square." end quote.
    This is not my first rodeo with a plane, but this reply is not consistent with other peoples experience and replies from Veritas, on out of speck planes.
    Any body care to reply on this matter?
    Thanks
    dennis.
    Dennis, did you try the plane out? Are you deciding that it does not work purely on specs?

    Regards from Perth

    Derek

  12. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis Peterson View Post
    So the Veritas Tolerance, i know , is .003 thou and this plane was .0035 so it is out of their tolerance,. by their standards. Also when I make a shooting board it is square, and this is the first time i have herd that they (intentionally) make the plane out of square?, so which is it , the tolerance is .003 or the plane is made out of square, so it does not hit your Square shooting board fence.
    i personally would rather have a Square shooting plane that is in tolerance. I have 3 veritas planes and the last two have been out of spec, so 2 out of 3 is not a good track record. When I sent back
    the Custom Jointer the service rep said they were having production problems with the custom jointer planes.
    Would just like to get an in spec plane that I paid for that's all. with out having to correct something on my part.
    thanks For your replies.
    Yes, I agree with you that if it is out of spec. it is out, whether or not they intentionally make their shooting planes a hair out of square. And a 2 out of 3 out of specs record isn't anything anyone would brag about either.

    That said, I must say I have never checked any handplanes from Veritas or from anyone else against whatever tolerances they set for their tools. Same for power tools. I have the Veritas shooting plane and shoot pieces dead square, or for that matter, dead mitered (with a miter add on) by adjusting the blade. Is my shooter square or within 0.003"? Frankly, I don't know and I don't care, as I judge its performance by the work it produces, not by its stated spec.

    Even if your shooter came dead square, you would not shoot dead square unless your blade was properly set.

    Yet, you are entitled to getting a tool within spec as provided by the vendor, and I am confident Veritas will exchange you with one that falls within spec. Money back if they can't find one.

    Simon

  13. #58
    Hi Derek , good to here from you, how are things from down under?
    Well, i was going to try it out but after the custom jointer plane I received a couple of months ago, and the way they dropped the ball on handling the whole issue , by the way it was way out of spec. both , length wise and width wise , and the fact it took someone 3 1/2 weeks to even look at the plane, i was a little gun shy on this purchase, when I inspected it, out of the box.

    If in fact , as the customer rep said it is designed to be out of Square intentionally, so it would not hit your shooting board fence, that should be published on their web description, but it is not as i suspect they would loose sales on the shooter plane, if that was added to the description. I wonder if LN has the same feeling in Mfg his Shooter?

    Any way , i like some of the Veritas tools , but with the response that Shannon replied back to me, it put me back on the wrong foot. I would rather have the plane machined Square, then I can adjust MY shooting board and MY ,plane angle to get me to 90.degrees proper., in stead of the other way around.
    So we will see what they say after they get the plane back.
    Best to you Derek
    Dennis.

  14. #59
    Just a note to fellow members concerning the Veritas Shooting Plane, as noted in this thread.

    Veritas sent me an inspected Shooting plane and I am very happy with it. It specked in at .002thou so very nice. So Cudos to them for their excellent service, and care for this customer.
    Dennis.

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