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Thread: Cyclone.. Which one? ClearVue won

  1. #1

    Cyclone.. Which one? ClearVue won

    At the end of this thread I will post that I have put a ClearVue on order.





    I have read till I am about to explode!

    What I would like to hear is from REAL experiences with the Grizzly, Onida and Clear Vue owners. If you have another one and would like to chime in, please do. I am ready to buy, just not sure what one is the "best". It seems to me that the bottom line it how clean the output filters stay will say a lot about how good the cyclone design is. The largest machine that will be connected is the 20" Grizzly planer. Also connected will be the Grizzly 19" BS, 10" TS, Drum Sander and hose over at the lathe. I will also install a floor sweep.

    I will be running new ductwork so now is the time to move from my 4" to ??

    Cyclone will be mounted in the corner of a 28'X42' shop. Most of the machines will be in the front half of this space. Only scroll saws are in the rear.

    I am leaning towards the 5HP Clear Vue at this time.
    Last edited by Ed Lang; 09-11-2005 at 11:03 AM. Reason: Changed Title a bit

  2. #2
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    I have owned two Oneida units and have been extremely pleased with the product and company. The 1.5hp component system was fine when my shop was tiny and the 2hp commercial that I now run (similar to the 2hp Gorilla) is extraordinarily good at what it does for my larger shop with larger tools. Made-in-USA with a made-in-USA motor...a rare opportunity these days...an these folks only do dust collection.

    All of the units you are considering should be equally suitable for your application. Choose based on your comfort with the vendors/manufacturers and in the case of the ClearVue, your time to put it all together.

    Your duct work will generally increase to a much larger size; at least 6" on your mains, for example. In the case of the 2hp Onieda, your initial main run will be 7".
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker

    ...snip good stuff...

    All of the units you are considering should be equally suitable for your application. Choose based on your comfort with the vendors/manufacturers and in the case of the ClearVue, your time to put it all together.

    ...snip good stuff...
    Jim,
    This may be a bit of a thread hijack, but...

    How much extra time do you think a ClearVue would take? - from looking at the pages, it looks ready to go. I think the only extra time would be in making a filter stack?


    In any case, I can't disagree with anything you've said and, as always, you have given sound advice.

    Cheers,
    -Mike

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Weaver
    How much extra time do you think a ClearVue would take? - from looking at the pages, it looks ready to go. I think the only extra time would be in making a filter stack?
    I think that someone who is building or has built one is best to answer that question. My statement revolved around the fact that the buyer needs to source and/or build stuff that comes with the Grizzly and Oneida systems "in the box". That conceivable takes more time...and is only what I was suggesting. And it's a valid choice that can give a lot of satisfaction!

    I also don't think the question is outside of the thread subject, either...it's an important consideration in Ed's choice.

  5. #5
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    I have the Oneida 1.5 hp unit in my garage shop. It is made very well and works as advertised. If I had it to do over again, I would have purchased the 2 hp version because 1.5 hp is not quite enough to collect from beneath the table saw as well as from my overblade Excalibur guard. I also have the internal filter model which is a little difficult to service. I am currently working out a conversion to the external filter model.

  6. #6
    My concerns are the lack of power with the 2HP units. That is why the 5HP looks good to me.

    The big thing I am wanting to find out is how much dust gets to the output filters on each system? I think I understand the object of getting the dust in the can, not the filter. My thinking is then if little is getting cleaned from real world use, then the cyclone design must be good. If you have to clean the output filter, then the cyclone design must not be as good as it could be.

    I want to get this purchase right the first time as I am going to start asking questions in the laser woodworking forums and I will not have the money to buy another cyclone after that forum finishes with me

    Getting all of the parts shipped from one source and having everything fit is important to me. I don't want to order from several sources, run all over the country to find this and that and have to cobble up stuff to get it to work.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Lang
    My concerns are the lack of power with the 2HP units. That is why the 5HP looks good to me.
    This is interesting...my 2hp Leeson powered unit presents a danger to small animals anywhere near my shop...it moves a LOT of air. Your concern really needs to be about what airflow you need to accomodate your machines, not the horsepower of the motor. Impeller size is more important, within reason, and as long as your motor is sized to be able to swing the impeller to it's full capacity, you'll be happy. "Real horsepower" is also something to look for, not marketing numbers, the same as "real CFM" is what you want, not free-air claims that some purveyors of dust collection systems provide. There are a lot of so-called 5hp motors that are really only 3hp in normal operation. Etc.

    What is the CFM requirement to service your shop? Once you have that, you can use that to help decide on a cyclone setup as well as the required duct work to support the air flow needs. You really have to work back from the tools to get there...
    --

    The most expensive tool is the one you buy "cheaply" and often...

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Becker
    ...Your concern really needs to be about what airflow you need to accomodate your machines, not the horsepower of the motor. Impeller size is more important, within reason, and as long as your motor is sized to be able to swing the impeller to it's full capacity, you'll be happy. "Real horsepower" is also something to look for, not marketing numbers, the same as "real CFM" is what you want, not free-air claims that some purveyors of dust collection systems provide. There are a lot of so-called 5hp motors that are really only 3hp in normal operation. Etc.

    What is the CFM requirement to service your shop? Once you have that, you can use that to help decide on a cyclone setup as well as the required duct work to support the air flow needs. You really have to work back from the tools to get there...
    Jim hit the nail on the head -
    Ed, you should figure based upon CFM, not motor HP.

    I'm doing the "cobbling up" myself with a Pentz cyclone, so perhaps my following comments/views should be taken wth a grain of salt...

    For a "safe" bet, Oneida has been a standard to which others have tried to catch in the past. I think they are still top notch. They have a design service that can engineer a fine solution for you,

    I suspect that the ClearVue will easly do what you need, but without having the CFM requirements and what the ducting will look like, it's hard to definitively say so...

    Jim correctly pointed out earlier that the Clear Vue will take some more time, but I don't think I'd put it in the "cobbling up" category since the unit is basically ready to go (minus a straightforward filter stack).

    It will require you to order from different sources though since you'll need filters like those from Wynn Environmental.

    Anyway - it all starts wth CFM requirements, in my opinion.
    Cheers and Good luck,
    -Mike

  9. #9
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    Hi guys! While I can't tell you about performance yet, I can tell you a little about installing the Clear Vue. I took some extra steps that are probably not needed. I put 2 coats of clear poly on all the MDF parts. Everything is in the kit, including motor and impeller. The only thing you have to supply now is the filters, the lumber to make the "shelf" for the mount to mount to, and the trash can for the dust and ships. I also went a little overboard in sealing up things, a lot more than was needed, but that is just me. then I built a "tree" to mount this to, instead of bolting the 2X4 bracing to the wall and mounting the unit. I did this for noise control, even though I don't know how noisey it is yet ;-). I would say if you had a couple 2X4's, a trash can, and ordered the filters when you ordered the Clear Vue, it could easily be done in a day, less if you have some help lifting parts into place. If you would like some more detailed info on what I did, see: http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...t=14427&page=4
    With that said, this is a great time to be in the market for a cyclone. There are several really good options. I purchased the Clear Vue because it fit my needs and desires. Part of my decission was the price I got it at, at that time it was less than the Grizzly, and the Gorilla hadn't been announced yet.
    Let us know what you decide! JIM

    edit: The Leeson 5 hp is compressor duty rated. I understand it is acutally more like a 3 hp for real world comparrisons. Jim
    Last edited by Jim O'Dell; 08-25-2005 at 11:38 AM.

  10. #10
    [QUOTE=Ed Lang]My concerns are the lack of power with the 2HP units. That is why the 5HP looks good to me.

    QUOTE]

    Keep in mind that is a compressor motor which comes in around 3 h.p. I believe.

    I have the 2 h.p. Gorilla, longest run is around 34 feet, running a 7" main with 6" branches, commercial home shop. generally two gates open as my son generally works with me on his own projects/customer orders, shop is around 960 sq feet and has over 14 tools attached to it. I can't imagine needing more CSF than what I am experiencing and am very pleased with the setup.

    Andy

  11. #11
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    Cyclone choice

    Hi All,

    I have a similar setup as Andy-- main shop is 960sqft(2nd floor 600sqft), 11 machines and 2 floor sweeps hooked to a 2hp Grizz. Mine is in an attached shed so noise levels are not a problem and performance is excellent. Mostly have been sanding on both belt and drum sanders and there is virtually no fine particulate dust in the filter bag. I agree with Jim and others in that any of the units you mentioned would be an appropriate choice. I think a 2hp is plenty of performance and selecting a vendor close by is the logical choice. I drove to the warehouse to pick up the Grizz and this gave me the excuse to buy two other machines. Good luck, John.

  12. #12
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    Cyclone choice

    Hi All,

    I have a similar setup as Andy-- main shop is 960sqft(2nd floor 600sqft), 11 machines and 2 floor sweeps hooked to a 2hp Grizz. Mine is in an attached shed so noise levels are not a problem and performance is excellent. Mostly have been sanding on both belt and drum sanders and there is virtually no fine particulate dust in the filter bag. I agree with Jim and others in that any of the units you mentioned would be an appropriate choice. I think a 2hp is plenty of performance and selecting a vendor close by is the logical choice. I drove to the warehouse to pick up the Grizz and this gave me the excuse to buy two other machines. Good luck, John.

  13. #13
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    Hi again. I'm home for lunch and got to thinking of a few itiems that may sway you, one way or another. On the Clear Vue, the cyclone body is assembled, the blower housing is assembled, but you have to put the 2 together. The exhaust to the filter transition has to be assembled (2 pieces of pre-formed PTEG, and 3 pre-machined MDF pieces that fit together in a few seconds, then gets mounted to the blower housing. The Motor has to be mounted to it's MDF plate, and the impeller has to then be mounted to the motor shaft. You need to have access to an inch/pound torque wrench. Not a foot/pound one!! I don't own one, but borrowed one from a co-worker/friend at work over the weekend. YOU DON'T WANT TO ATTEMPT ASSEMBLY WITHOUT THE TORQUE WRENCH!!
    One other thing that I haven't mentioned anywhere yet is that when I went to assemble my Clear Vue, I noticed that the cone part of the cyclone body was not symmetrical. I questioned Ed about this, and he promptly sent a new body out and had the first one picked up, at his expense. No questions asked. Talk about customer service!!! And he has been more than diligent about answering all the questions I have sent his way. Heck of a nice guy to work with.
    If you decide to go this route, PM me and I will suggest a few things to have on hand to speed the install up. Jim

  14. #14

    live and learn, for me anyways.....

    The Dust Gorilla 2HP (or 3HP) from Oneida is well worth it if you got the bucks. I had an awful experience with a Jet 2HP Cannister Style Dust Collector ($500) and I don't want to deal with that again. Live and learn for this guy. Major problems with the pleats loading up and starving the motor no matter how often I blew them out with a compressor combined with using the flapper repeatedly.

    I am blown away by this unit!!! I do a lot of particleboard and very LITTLE gets past the fan to the external filter. I am not saying there isn't a unit just as good in the 2HP class, but I know this unit is about as good as you can expect for a 2HP cyclone unless we want to get to the molecular level (not me!!!!). I don't expect to ever own another dust collector in my life unless the motor unfortunately konks out on me one day. Then I'll just replace the motor and go on.

    If you can huddle up enough cash, get this unit and end it. I have been through 3 dust collectors with no success until now. My wife tires of me saying this is the last one, I promise. Well, she's seen this unit and knows by the look on my face that it works. A smile a mile wide!!! Anyways, do what's right for you and what you can afford. This is just my opinion of this unit and how it's worked for me. Jim Becker and Andy London also helped in my decision and everything they said about the unit was right on. Take care.

    David

  15. #15
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    Ed,
    I use the Grizzly 2 hp unit, and also run a home based business. Equipment attached to the cyclone are; cabinet TS (3hp), drum sander (22 inch), router station, bandsaw, radial arm saw, jointer (8 inch) and my planer (20 inch).
    Although this unit operates at 75db, they should be placed in an area isolated from the general work area.
    The grizzly is a very effecient unit for the cost, don't forget to include all ducting and dampers into your cost.

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