First (and hopefully last) Cabinet Table Saw Purchase - Advice needed use

[John Akerblom]

Big decision to make. Need a table saw for my two car garage workshop (no more $150 contractor saw from 1982). I want to go new, not used, cuz I am no expert at maintenance or alignment. I work with a lot of exotic, dense hardwoods, and need accuracy and power (and good dust collection)

Ive read about 1000 pages of threads and have narrowed my choices down to two.

1. Grizzly 5hp, 12" blade, oversized table (model G0696X)
or
2. Sawstop 3hp, 10" blade, pro model.

I know these are kind of apples and oranges, but I learn a lot from these threads regardless (and also get a real kick out of it when ppl start getting angry).

My question is, besides the safety feature on Sawstop, what advantages does it have. The Grizzly is more powerful, bigger and thicker table, way heavier, 12" blade, and has got great reviews so far. I know Sawstop has gotten rave reviews for the precision and quality machining, but am wondering if it would be worth it to save around $800 (once I'm done buying a mobile base, dust guard, etc) and get a bigger, more powerful tool. I use a lot of thick, dense lumber and could make use of the 12" blade.

If I do decide to go with the grizzly, what would be the best above blade dust collection system? Could an after market fence bring the accuracy up to sawstop's calibur? Has anyone used the Grizzly sliding table with this saw?

Any and all advice, experience, and insight is greatly appreciated. Yes, I value my fingers, but the safety feature is not my only concern.

Thanks in advance,
John

[Kelby Van Patten]

I have neither. However, SawStop's dust collection is probably the best of any tablesaw made today.

[Rick Potter]

Have you checked SS heavier 5 HP 10" saw?

[Kent Adams]

I recently purchased a Powermatic 2000 after a ton of online and hands on research. I'm very happy with the saw, but if expense isn't a huge consideration, I'd look into Hammer or Felder. If you're going SS, I'd get the ICS model rather than PCS. A 12" blade wasn't even a consideration for me, not sure I'd ever cut stock that thick. Check the dado capacity (width) of both machines you're looking at as well. I don't think you can go wrong with either the Grizzly or the SS, though I'd certainly want a longer table than the Grizzly model is giving you. Factor into your budget a good dust collector because they can really help you enjoy your time in the shop a lot more than a lousy one. If you have the means, I highly recommend the Oneida 3hp Smart collector. It leaves virtually no dust around when cross cutting.

[Curt Harms]

For guard/dust collection a lot of people speak highly of Lee Styron's shark guard. I don't see your saw model listed so you'd have to call.

http://www.thesharkguard.com/index.htm

[Robert Engel]

Other's more knowledgeable than me can chime in, but from what other guys have said, there's not a discernable advantage going to 5HP.
Maybe the reason is the power of a 3HP/10" blade is pretty comparable to 5HP/12" blade.
Even with very dense wood, as long as your blade is sharp I doubt the need for a saw that big.

Other things to consider:
1. The coast of blades for a 12" saw are considerably higher.
2. 5HP requires 10ga wire and 30A circuit.

Not knowledgeable enough in overarm DC to comment other than I'm pretty old school about this I want to see the blade so I don't use guards of any kind.

[Hoang N Nguyen]

I have the sawstop 1.75 HP cabinet table saw and love it. I should have gotten the 3HP motor but money was tight at the moment and honestly, the saw hasn't bogged down on me yet and the thickness hardest woods I've ran through it are 8/4 hard maple and purple heart. I never had a problem ripping the wood mentioned and I honestly don't see myself going any thicker. I also wished I had gone with the 52" version instead of the 36" version but again, money was tight. If I had to do it again, sawstop would still be my saw of choice, just bigger motor and longer fence.

[Chuck Saunders]

We have 3 SS PCS's at the Guild and they are sound saws without considering the flesh sensing, but the flesh sensing is a worthwhile bonus
Chuck

[Jim German]

As you say this really is apples and oranges. On the one hand you have a big, powerful heavy saw vs a smaller, safer, better built and more precise saw. I think the question comes down to do you really need a bigger saw? I doubt the HP will ever be a big deal, as others have said 3HP is plenty for a 10" saw. The bigger table will be handy, but its only about 10% bigger, I don't see that being a huge deal. So then the big thing is the extra depth of cut. On the Sawstop you get 3.125" vs the 4" on the Grizzly. I can't think of many situations where I've needed more than 3" of cut, and if I did, I just use a bandsaw. Therefore I'd lean towards the Sawstop.

[Jim Dwight]

If you want to cut wood thicker than a 10 inch saw can handle (i.e. thicker than about 3.25 inches), a bandsaw is a better idea than a bigger table saw. Maybe if you have a lot of work to do in wood around 4 inches thick a 12 inch could make sense but that would be unusual.

I've never had a 10 inch saw that needed 220V and I've been making sawdust pretty regularly for about 40 years. I have to slow down my feed rate, especially if the blade is dirty or dull, but I cut 3.5 inches on a 110V saw. The only advantage I see to more powerful motors is the ability to use dirty and/or dull blades. That isn't a good idea for other reasons. If you already have a big enough 220V feed, maybe the big motor makes sense. But if not, I would waste time and money on wiring. A 15A 120V motor will get the job done. I might feel differently if I did this for a living but for hobby work, I don't really think you need the big motor. I don't.

I would probably get the new Grizzly hybrid and possibly a bandsaw for about the same money.

[Prashun Patel]

12" feels to me to be overkill. Rather, you'll get more efficiency on deep, rips using a really good bladed bandsaw.

I work with exotics on my lathe and I find the dust to be in general more pernicious than domestics, so I'd invest in a saw with good dust collection. In fact, I find the worst dust generator to be trimming cuts on the tablesaw. The Sawstop does not prevent these dusty situations.

The SS has a nice riving knife/guard switch which is tool-less. That is a huge deal for me. It's accurate and wonderful in every way.

If the $$ is no issue, I'd get the SS.

If $$$ is no issue, then get the SS 5hp.

If $$$$ is no issue, then get the SS 5hp + a separate overhead guard that is decoupled from the saw altogether.

[glenn bradley]

If you have a need for a 12" blade, the Saw Stop is not a contender. If you can do your work with a 10" blade, I would not go to a 12". I have the 3HP PCS and it has been a fine saw. Like others have said in the past, even without the safety feature the design, build and finish are superior to many like-priced machines.

I was looking at the other usual colors of paint at the time. Having the opportunity to potentially buy my last saw, I went with the Saw Stop after many months of analysis. When you get into a certain category of machines that actually qualify by quality, not price, the choice can almost be subjective; which side the dust port is on, how the guard works, subtle differences in the Beis-a-like fences, etc.

I think you need to fine tune your requirements so that you are looking at more similar competitors and then make your choice.

[David Kumm]

To really make a decision as to apples and oranges, you need to look at the inside of the Grizzly. They used to make a clone of the Delta 12-14 which is a much heavier and better build than the unisaw based 10" series. It looks to me like the 696X may be closer to a unisaw build with a little greater capacity. The smaller saw stop is a little lighter build than the old Unisaw and their big saw falls somewhere between the uni and the 12-14 ( opinion of old guys who know both ). A riving knife on a traditional fixed saw is a big deal and if buying new, that should be mandatory. There are ways to work around but only if getting a great deal on a used.

I appreciate the desire for new, but the logic is flawed. A new machine may need every bit as much adjustment as a used heavier saw that has been in use by a woodworker. Even if not, once in adjustment, the old 12-14 or PM 72 12" saws remained in adjustment pretty much forever once dialed in. Not trying to change your mind ( although used saws are the deal of the century now ), but I've spent every bit as much time making new work well as my used stuff. The beneift of the older is you can afford way better quality if you shop well. Dave

[John Akerblom]

I understand I could get a good bargain with used saws, but I just have little expertise to determine which saws are in good condition and there seems to be little available in Los Angeles.

I was planning on getting a Laguna SUV Bandsaw, so I guess the 10" vs 12" blade is not very important. I know I don't need a full 5HP, I just liked that the Grizzly has a 2 inch thick, oversized table and ways a ton. I can't quite afford the Industrial line of Sawstops.

I guess I probably should just save my money and buy the 3HP Pro SawStop with mobile base, overhead dust extraction, and maybe the outfeed table (although I have read mixed reviews about their outfeed tables.

I don't need a full 52" rip capacity, so I'll probably get the 36" model (one of the reasons I don't want a mid-sized Grizzly is it seems you have to choose between 36" and 52").

[Dick Jones]

I Have the Grizz 12 inch 5hp and love it.

It is very heavy and I can leave in one place. It can be moved but I would not want to do on a regular basis.