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Thread: Jointer head speed/ feed speed

  1. #1
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    Jointer head speed/ feed speed

    I'm restoring an old 16" jointer and I'm putting a new motor on it which has me wondering what the "ideal speed" for a jointer head is? The cutter head is a 2 blade 4" diameter, and the motor is 3450. I also want to put a power feeder on it and the slowest speed is 15 fpm. Any info or articles would be greatly appreciated. Jess
    Only one life will soon be past
    Only whats done for Christ will last

  2. #2
    i can try and measure the belts on mine this week - sounds like a similar head, but pretty sure my motor spins at 1750.
    sorry, can't help with the feeder, though. if i remember right, i think you want to shoot for 20 knife cuts/inch- I'm sure theres a formula for figuring the feed speed to make that happen based on the speed of the head...but i can't help you with that either.
    Last edited by Ethan Melad; 03-21-2015 at 7:40 PM.
    Melad StudioWorks
    North Brookfield, MA

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Busenitz View Post
    I'm restoring an old 16" jointer and I'm putting a new motor on it which has me wondering what the "ideal speed" for a jointer head is? The cutter head is a 2 blade 4" diameter, and the motor is 3450. I also want to put a power feeder on it and the slowest speed is 15 fpm. Any info or articles would be greatly appreciated. Jess
    Whats the maker and model.
    jack
    English machines

  4. #4
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    Ethan, it seems like 1750 would be quite slow.... at least all the new jointers I see are running a 3450 motor... Jack it's a Greenlee Bro. 550
    Only one life will soon be past
    Only whats done for Christ will last

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Busenitz View Post
    Ethan, it seems like 1750 would be quite slow.... at least all the new jointers I see are running a 3450 motor... Jack it's a Greenlee Bro. 550
    4600 to 5000 RPM can't say i seen a 550 before
    jack
    English machines

  6. #6
    Jointer rpm's can vary a bit. We have a direct drive Northfield with a 3500 rpm motor, which I feel is rather low. My 16" runs at 5000 as does the Griggio at work. All three have approximately 4" diameter heads with the standard modern gibbed wedged knife pockets.

    If you search the owwm site you will find a thread with pictures of a similar Greenlee 550, although the head on that was said to be 3". The head was a "clamshell" type with a rounded top cap holding the knife in the head. If yours is like that , be aware that it can potentially throw a knife if the threads have been stretched by overtightening. I'm not sure how to ascertain that. I can tell you that it did happen to my neighbor on an American 12" with a similar head design, and although he was unhurt and the machine was repaired with a new head, it was a memorable and expensive occurrence. Again, a query at owwm.org may save you some grief.

    As far as the power feeder goes, 15 fpm should be fine for most purposes.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Kevin Jenness View Post
    Jointer rpm's can vary a bit. We have a direct drive Northfield with a 3500 rpm motor, which I feel is rather low. My 16" runs at 5000 as does the Griggio at work. All three have approximately 4" diameter heads with the standard modern gibbed wedged knife pockets.

    If you search the owwm site you will find a thread with pictures of a similar Greenlee 550, although the head on that was said to be 3". The head was a "clamshell" type with a rounded top cap holding the knife in the head. If yours is like that , be aware that it can potentially throw a knife if the threads have been stretched by overtightening. I'm not sure how to ascertain that. I can tell you that it did happen to my neighbor on an American 12" with a similar head design, and although he was unhurt and the machine was repaired with a new head, it was a memorable and expensive occurrence. Again, a query at owwm.org may save you some grief.

    As far as the power feeder goes, 15 fpm should be fine for most purposes.
    I am running both my 16" and 26" plate types heads at 5000 rpm and there 5" round 2 knife. Is the GreenLee a plate type head? I am assume you know how set a machine up a jointer if you got a 16" if its babbitt bearing run it between 3600 and 4200 rpm. mine are ball bearing heads and can run faster
    Last edited by jack forsberg; 03-21-2015 at 9:27 PM.
    jack
    English machines

  8. #8
    could be, i honestly can't remember right now.
    Melad StudioWorks
    North Brookfield, MA

  9. #9
    I would stick with the speed the manufacturer set it up with. If you don't know what that is you'll have to do the math on the pulleys unless it is direct drive? Here's a calculator to make it a breeze.... http://www.blocklayer.com/pulley-belteng.aspx

    Why do you want a power feed on a jointer, no planer?

  10. #10
    Jesse, so sorry for referring you to your own owwm post. That was probably not very enlightening.

  11. #11
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    IMG_0810.jpg Here's a pic of the head... the bolts have been upgraded from factory, and it is a babbitt bearing. I'm going to be surfacing quite a few bf raw lumber through this machine, which is why I bought a 16" instead of using my 8" rockwell. Kevin no problem
    Only one life will soon be past
    Only whats done for Christ will last

  12. #12
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Busenitz View Post
    IMG_0810.jpg Here's a pic of the head... the bolts have been upgraded from factory, and it is a babbitt bearing. I'm going to be surfacing quite a few bf raw lumber through this machine, which is why I bought a 16" instead of using my 8" rockwell. Kevin no problem
    Jess as i said back channel(PM) this is not an Oliver type head. It is a plate type head that uses standard knifes not slotted of the correct thickness. i WOULD NOT CALL THE BOLTS AN UPGRADE ETHER. the head is made of forged steel and so it does not make sense to use a grade 8 bolts. There most likely 5/8 and what is needed is a matting metal of equal structure. All i can tell you is most makers of square head bolts use 4140 .so the head does not get striped out by the harder grade 8. the problem as i see it is the heads are to small to hold the plate down(lot of force to hold the heavy plate down when up to speed and the plate is thin at the hole) all of the plat type heads i have seen fill the counter bore with just room for a socket or spaner like the Oliver. these bolts are very much the same as square head bolts that hold thick slotted knifes



    here you can see what i mean in my head thought the wadkin head is stud and nut you should get the idea



    oliver head bolts for spaner


    your machine came with an option of a plat type round head over the square head in the 550 and this is Greenlee's versions of the safety head. I found the manual it it states that the round head does not use slotted knifes like the square head does. So my advise is to take a plate off and show me what you have in there because it is not correct from were i I sit and someone with little knowledge of the forces of cutter bolts in this type head has made modification to it. This machine is over 100 years old so i would hold off on the motor for a bit.

    manual

    square head



    round safety head the one you have



    Manuals states cutter block speed as 4000 RPM.

    be safe
    Last edited by jack forsberg; 03-22-2015 at 9:38 PM.
    jack
    English machines

  13. #13
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    IMG_0877s.jpgIMG_0878s.jpg

    Here's some pics.... the plate is 5/8 and it's 11/16 from head circumference to the post in the back. Also the post are 3/16 tall. So if I'm reading you right Jack, I need bigger headed bolt? They're a 3/4 head right now, and the blades I pulled off were slotted.. don't know the thickness.
    Last edited by Jesse Busenitz; 03-23-2015 at 9:33 AM. Reason: add info
    Only one life will soon be past
    Only whats done for Christ will last

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Jesse Busenitz View Post
    IMG_0877s.jpgIMG_0878s.jpg

    Here's some pics.... the plate is 5/8 and it's 11/16 from head circumference to the post in the back. Also the post are 3/16 tall. So if I'm reading you right Jack, I need bigger headed bolt? They're a 3/4 head right now, and the blades I pulled off were slotted.. don't know the thickness.

    Jesse i see your new to this and that you have a thread over at OWWM and i know all the guys that have chimed in on your thread there and there for the most part well meaning but not one of them have or use a plate type head . After all it was you that brought to there attention the head type in the first place was it not after I PMed you and gave you the run down on what i thought were the things to look at. it seams that there still telling you to use slotted knifes despite the manual information posted by Matty Melbourne stating otherwise in that very thread. So i can see that your being guided by people who have no personal experience with this type head and who like yourself don't read the Greenlee's own guild lines as I posted here above. I get that your trying to find out as much as you can but its really up to you to do your home work Jesse. I am going to leave it up to you to learn a bit more so you can weed out the opinions from the facts for your self. If you want someone to tell you what to do OWWM is all up to do that if you can weed through the opinions and get to the facts.

    I will tell you you are missing the back bar that sits on the pins for registration and locks it in the head to gauge the plate to knife thickness so the plate pressure is up front at the leading edge. Can't see Greenlee using just the pins at the back to hold the plate up as that is just garbage and i think greenlee is better than that.

    Good luck Jesse with your project and be safe.
    Last edited by jack forsberg; 03-23-2015 at 4:18 PM.
    jack
    English machines

  15. #15
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    I'm with Jack on this. That jointer is so rare that few of these heads are owned by anyone still alive. I would not run it until you know for sure exactly what type of knives and what type of bolts were used to hold it together. A good machinist will help with the bolts and maybe the knives but I'd look for real confirmation before I turned the machine on. Dave

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