Renewing the Battle with my Paragon

[David Weaver]

I bought a GW #5 Paragon way back when too. These planes are an interesting testament to how far we have come since "the old days". Looking at the fit and finish on my plane is certainly a little disappointing compared to the new state of the art from Lee Valley, Lie-Nielson and others, especially considering how GW sang the praises of the Paragon.

This is, of course, only my opinion, but a lot of the old players who had high margin businesses and who focused on mail order catalogs haven't fared as well as LV once feedback online became easy to access. I don't think I have anything from garrett wade, though I have gotten some catalogs. Most of what's in it looks like a way to spend more than I would spend getting the same things elsewhere. A lot of the catalog companies sing the praises of things they have to sell but after you get them, you sort of wonder what all of the praise is about. The one and two stage turbines marketed at hobbyist woodworkers are one thing that I can think of where they came out and were pitched as solve all gadgets, but I tried one as a beginner and could not get it to work at all with half of my finishes. Those were pushed so hard with videos all over the place about how great they were. They still are, I guess, but I haven't seen as much chatter about them on here (maybe we're in the wrong forum to see it!).

How about the short stint where folks were recommending anant planes over vintage planes? I can only guess that was due to the fact that it's hard to sell a used plane when you're a mail order place selling new ones. Just gross.

[Jim Koepke]

Thanks to all for their suggestions and to George for the solution I implemented. I did like Jamie's suggestion, but with the frog having so little movement when placed in the body, it would have been a long difficult process to work the high spots down.

Just goes to show there is more than one way of doing most things.

Now that you know how much adjustment is needed, removing a touch of metal from the frog shouldn't take that long. Otherwise, you know just how much foil is needed to fill the gap.

Glad to hear you got it working.

jtk

[Clint Baxter]

Thanks George. Will keep that in mind. Or as Jim said, carefully dress down the opposing high spots to make it mate properly.

Now that I've spent lots of dollars on Garret Wade and Leichtung before that, I tend to agree with David on some, if not all, of their offerings. I got a dovetail saw from one of those two back in the day that tends to wander in use. Another less than stellar tool maybe? I'm still not confident in my saw sharpening skills, and as long as I don't use it to cut too deep, am able to get the job done. Least wise enough that I correct any issues with some judicious paring.

On recommendations from here and elsewhere, ordered a new dovetail saw and carcass saw from Mark at Bad Axe Tools and am eager to place them into service. Maybe I will he attack that saw and see if I can turn it round as well. Or send it off to Mark so I know it'll get done right.

Mike, I think he original iron would have probably worked okay if the frog would have been mated properly. I still have he iron and chip breaker, but don't hunk that I will ever go back to it due to the Hock being a thicker, (and most likely much higher quality), blade. If I put he thinner iron back in, I would need to readjust the frog if I wanted to keep that narrow throat. And seeing as ow it presently is working okay, will let dog sleep till it decides to wake.

Clint

[Erik Manchester]

Clint,

I have a Paragon No 4 made for LV in the early 80's as it has LV on the lever cap instead of GW. I picked it up years ago as a novelty item as it has never been used.

From what I can gather, there were some QA issues with the planes such that LV was replacing some of them and ultimately decided to build their own planes. The Paragon sure does not look like any of the other Veritas planes I own. I have not used it as I have others that work better.

[Clint Baxter]

Clint,

I have a Paragon No 4 made for LV in the early 80's as it has LV on the lever cap instead of GW. I picked it up years ago as a novelty item as it has never been used.

From what I can gather, there were some QA issues with the planes such that LV was replacing some of them and ultimately decided to build their own planes. The Paragon sure does not look like any of the other Veritas planes I own. I have not used it as I have others that work better.

Eric. Not sure I understand. How do you know others work better if this has never been used. If it was like mine, don't doubt that any working plane that you had was better. I do like the way mine currently works. Maybe you have a good one that doesn't need "work" to make it work.

Clint

[Erik Manchester]

Clint, I put a sharp blade in it and gave it a brief test and it works as well as any other Bailey type that has not been tuned. I have a bunch of Millers Falls, a few Stanley Type 11s and some Veritas planes so I didn't feel like messing with this one. It seems OK and the frog meets the bed OK. According to Rob Lee, the ones that LV had made were fettled in Ottawa before being sold.

[Clint Baxter]

Clint, I put a sharp blade in it and gave it a brief test and it works as well as any other Bailey type that has not been tuned. I have a bunch of Millers Falls, a few Stanley Type 11s and some Veritas planes so I didn't feel like messing with this one. It seems OK and the frog meets the bed OK. According to Rob Lee, the ones that LV had made were fettled in Ottawa before being sold.

Gotcha. The way the Paragon was touted, you supposedly were getting a better plane. One you shouldn't have to put a bunch of effort into tuning. Sounds like yours should be, as you said, "OK" if LV passed it prior to it going out". Seems that nowadays we can buy new ones that are better "out of the box" from makers such as LV or LN, or tune an older one at considerably less cost, (with probably the same amount of effort.). I may still get one of those new planes yet but at least have another tool in the stable regardless of what comes to pass.

Thanks for update.

Clint

[steven c newman]

seems I may have had a worse frog seat to levelSDC14072.jpgthis is a KK7's frog seat area, nice, ain't it....