Any need for a Thicknesser when you have a jointer?

[Andrew Joiner]

I am having the same dilemma too..

Currently I just plane the wood by hand, very tedious and I have no way of making sure that it's even square.

To Eoin and Tai:
Google "Planer sled" You only need a lunch box benchtop planer to get rough stock flat. Low cost and simple.
I use planer sleds a lot. I have color coded shims of 3 taper sizes most are from 0" to 1/8". They are rough sawn on a bandsaw. The rough surface keeps them in place without hot glue. I set the stock on the sled,hold it to the front stop and lightly slide in shims till the stock is firm. The shims don't move as it goes thru the planer.

The key to success with a lightweight sled is a flat setup area level with the infeed table of your planer bed. You can't disturb the "package" of the stock shimmed firmly on the sled before it gets pulled in by the infeed roller. I grab the stock and push it tight to the sled as it comes out of the planer sliding on my outfeed table. If I need to take off more I crank up the planer 2 turns I can slide the "package" back thru without disturbing the shims. I check the shims before the second pass, but they are usually good or just need a slight shift to be firm.

This method is almost as fast as jointer and you have power feed! I spent a lot time at a jointer getting real tired pushing down on long stock. Sleds eliminate this and they get stock just as flat.
Here's more on my thoughts as I worked this out:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?134633-A-Lightweight-8-Foot-Planer-Sled

[Wade Lippman]

I have found that with the planner I can plan one side flat then flip it over and get both sides parallel. With that done I square the edges with the table saw, work just fine for me.

If you are lucky enough to buy flat wood that works; but if your wood isn't flat going into a planer it won't be flat coming out either.

[Tai Fu]

that's what planer sleds are for...

[Kirk Poore]

I have put my hard hat and body armor on.

Most of the wood I use is 4/4 or 5/4 and 12+ inches wide. I have a 6" jointer making face jointing difficult. I use a 13" planer for the faces and have not had a problem removing cupping. For cupped boards I use very small increments to get one face flat then plane the other side to get it flat. Excessively cupped boards can be ripped to reduce the cupping on the pieces to a workable amount. A light cut puts less pressure on the board and then reduces the cjhances of pushing the board flat while planing (and it spring back to cupped on exit).

I try to avoid twisted or warped boards. IfI do get one, judicious cutting before planing can help eliminate planing problems.

Once I have flat/parallel faces the jointed is used to square and flatten one edge.

So far I have only had one board that I could not get flat berfore it got too thin.

Glenn:

I'm with you. I will run narrower (<8") boards over my jointer to get one side reasonably flat, but for wider stuff I go straight to the planer and take shallow passes (1/16"). Frankly, it isn't a big deal. I've never bothered with a sled. Now, I have an Oliver 399 18" planer, so big boards aren't too much of a problem, though I may have to help push or pull the worst ones through on the first pass. I'm also starting with 4/4 or better stock, and that thick isn't going to flatten out much from the feed rolls.

Kirk

[Andrew Joiner]

Glenn and Kirk, I agree you can get rough boards fairly flat with that method. A good sled set-up will get them as flat as a jointer can get them.

[Eoin Ryans]

Thanks for the replies guys - I will look at getting a good planer (or thicknesser here in UK & Ireland)!

[Eoin Ryans]

Are there any limitations to the planer sled idea? Is it that it just takes longer/ more effort to get the desired result? Will accuracy be compromised?
Thanks guys
Eoin

[Andrew Joiner]

Are there any limitations to the planer sled idea? Is it that it just takes longer/ more effort to get the desired result? Will accuracy be compromised?
Thanks guys
Eoin

No accuracy compromise,flat is flat. Yes it takes a little longer. Actually less effort because you have power feed. Another plus is you save the space a jointer takes up and it's infeed and outfeed areas.

[Rick Moyer]

Warning! Confusing and circular descriptions ahead.

What we (in N. America) call a jointer is used to make one face of rough and often twisted, cupped or bowed materials flat (or planar) and often to make one face and one edge of a board square to one another. If you run one face of a board through a jointer (aka JOINT THE BOARD) and then flip it over and do the same to the opposite face, there is absolutely no guarantee of the faces being co-planar when you're done, and the chances of such happening are probably very small.

What we call a planer in N. America, doesn't make things planar, it just makes things thinner (though one can employ various jigs to use a planer to make things planar). So, if you put a twisted, warped or cupped board into a planer, a thinner twisted, warped or cupped board comes out the other end. However when you put the perfectly flat face that you created with a jointer on the reference surface of the planer (it's bed) a thinner, board with two flat and co-planar faces comes out the other end.

I suspect Eoin may be outside the US which would confuse matters further.
In much of the rest of the world they call a jointer a planer and they call a planer a thicknesser - so the machines' names actually described their function more accurately.

http://www.recordpower.co.uk/categor...--thicknessing

Eoin, you probably want one of each if you're doing work that requires square and co-planar solid wood stock (if you're making Windsor chairs or small boxes or casework from sheet goods or whatever, it might not be needed). If you can only get one, get a planer and find another way to joint boards or take a straight edge and winding sticks to the lumber yard to pick out the flattest possible stock (there there is no guarantee it will stay flat since wood moves). Of course the other option is a combination machine which incorporates the functional of both into a single machine (often at the same cost as two individual machine but with a smaller footprint).

good luck
-kg

Resurrecting this thread because I have been thinking about our terminology on these two tools lately for some reason.
I sure wish we (Americans, or North Americans in this case) didn't have to complicate things. Why can't we call these tools "thicknessers" and "planers"(planars) instead of planers and jointers? The other terms are much more intuitive and accurate. A thicknesser dimensions the thickness of the board and the planer surface one side to be a plane(planar). In our terms, a planer does not make a surface planar, and a jointer doesn't directly involve joinery. May as well call a tablesaw a "dimensioner"; at least that would be somewhat intuitive.
OK, rant off.

[John Schweikert]

a jointer doesn't directly involve joinery

Well, yes it does. Long edge joining of boards for table tops, panels, etc is a very common use for a jointer.

[Andrew Hughes]

I think your may have to let this one go,It's not something new the invoice for my oliver jointer calls it a hand planer and jointer.It was wrote by someone in 1960.

Its just one of those things.

[Joe Hillmann]

You could buy a planer "thicknesser" and do your jointing with a hand plane and winding sticks. You don't need to get it perfect with the hand plane, just a good enough so the high points can act as a reference surface on the bed of the planer.

[Alan Lightstone]

I've always wondered if a planer sled decreases snipe. Does it?

[John Schweikert]

Snipe is a funny thing, not ha-ha but just odd with respect to why some get it and some don't. I wonder if it's an issue of design, manufacturing or how well the user sets up the beds. I have a Dewalt 733 which I can't even remember when it was bought (15 years?) but I experience absolutely zero snipe, none visually, none from measuring with a caliper. It's a decent but by no means high quality planer.