Why I Buy Over the Internet

[Damon Stathatos]

Not many brick and mortars cater to or focus on professionals. If you're on this forum, you're most likely past their target audience. It's now just as well with them that you (us) rely on the internet for what we need. They fill the need for a different segment (a large segment) of people who are very unsure of what they want and need direction. There are a number of ways to achieve an end and they will suggest to you the path they can, based upon what they have to offer at that time. They fill this need pretty well.

About a dozen years ago, I wandered into our local Rockler, on a lark. Up to that point in my life, I had had only intermittent woodworking experiences but always loved the idea of the 'field' in general. Junior High Shop Class had been a very fond memory. Over the next five or so years, I spent a lot of time in that Rockler. Built a garage shop and started making all sorts of 'stuff.' They were always there to answer my plebeian questions and to lead me along my path. I continued but after a while, I outgrew them, began needing (wanting) specific things which were harder and harder to reliably find there, for whatever reason. Their advice was no longer needed or very helpful because I had continued the passion to a level beyond their target audience. I still patronize them as much as possible because without them, I doubt that I would have been able to be where I am today.

Fast forward to today and due to a career change (read: family business), I now import exotic hardwoods from Central and South America and (single handedly) operate 12k square foot shop filled with old iron purchased from IRS auctions and hardwoods like Cocobolo and Ziricote. I cater to local custom furniture makers looking for something they can't find through the normal channels. It's a tough-go catering to such a specific (and SMALL) market and I fully understand why a chain would never make it doing so, however, it is because of their inability to do so that I have created a very small niche for myself.

I thank Rockler for my early years and regrettably have limited use for them anymore, even though I try whenever I can. I actually supply my hardwoods to our local Rockler and often think to myself of their significance in that fact. They're the ones enabling the 'next generation' to figure out if they want to continue their path or not. I'm guessing that next generation of woodworkers would be a much smaller one without brick and mortars such as Rockler and Woodcraft. So that's the way I see the function that they serve.

[Steven Hsieh]

There are some items that are cheaper just to buy it at the store. Than paying shipping and wait for a week for it.

My local Woodcraft carry tools like Veritas, Lie neilson tools, and other franchise don't carry in their stores.

If my local area doesn't have what I want ill just buy it online.

[Brian Kent]

Damon, excellent post, and I agree with you. I have especially found help from the Ontario Rockler's manager and staff. Your explanation is also my experience, where I went from Ryobi at Home Depot to Rockler to hand tools that were beyond Rockler's market. Good job.

[Ron Jones near Indy]

Thanks Brian. This thread made me realize how fortunate I am. When I saw this earlier I decided to call my local hardware store. They seem to always have what I need, it's only 8 miles from home and give a 10% discount for cash in a deal worked out by the local electrical utility. Mike says they have 2--one is from China and one made in either the USA or Canada, he would check if I wanted him to. I asked about the prices--$31 and $73. I'll let you guess which one is the cheap one. He checked and only had the cheaper one in stock. His suggestions: a. buy the cheaper one b. drive another 19 miles to their other store, they have them both in stock c. tell him I want the pricey one and he will have it in his store by 9:00 tomorrow morning. I told him about your post and why I called. He laughed and said something like I'll get your money next time. Reminds me of the old William Herschell poem, Ain't God Good to Indiana.

[Van Huskey]

To me a store be it B&M or internet must provide one of two things or a balance of both. Price or value added service. All to often B&M stores offer neither and from the woodworking perspective not being a pro I really never HAVE to have anything today. I am lucky to have a real industrial woodworking supply house near me (OK its a 35 minutre drive but our home in Louisiana is 20 minutes from a Walmart so it isn't a big deal). From the second you walk it you see it is industrail, they have probably 100 machines on display everything from 6" jointers to big wide belts. They have EVERY Whiteside bit and every freeborn cutter head. BUT, they are very attentive to my needs. My first visit I made it clear I was a hobby guy and when I ask about the diameter of the impeller on a particular dust collector the guy diappeared and not only came back with the dimension but came back with the IMPELLER in his hands... Oh, I forgot to mention they stock parts too... These guys know machines and though I don't always agree with their position I always respect it. They aren't cheap (full retail unless their is a national sale or they buy a big lot of something) and they don't fill their end caps with the latest price dumped item from China but they make me feel at home and don't make me feel like it is trouble to take my money, since it is clear most of their sales are "on account" and they aren't set up to do a lot of counter sales.

My bet is if I needed a chuck they would have multiple options in stock from Albrecht through Jacobs and down to a Taiwanese knock off and they darn well will know what a Morse Taper is...

[fRED mCnEILL]

I buy a LOT from Lee Valley which not only has B&M stores but also does mail order. I have two stores available to me and from the people in the stores when I go in there sure seeem busy. I don't know how well employees are paid but the service is better that best. I don't even know how their prices compare because I never check around for stuff they carry.
For stuff I can buy locally I usually buy there as I tend to be impatient but if I even get a HINT of an attitude I don't hesitate for a minute to order it on-line. I AM THE CUSTOMER with money and its the retailers JOB to get that money from me. If they can't be bothered to cater to me I will go elsewhere in a "new york minute". I once had a shippier for an appliance company try and explain to me why they couldn't deliver as promised. He started to say that "what I had to understand was" when I cut him off and told him what he had to understand was that I was the customer and without me he wouldn't have a job.

[Dan Rude]

I recently had to get a flooring staple gun repaired. I borrowed it from a friend to do my brothers kitchen floor. Found the kits on line for $40 and would have to do it myself. I then called my favorite Hardware store for tools, 7 corners in St Paul, MN we might get it done in 2 weeks repair + $35 shop charge, I needed it in a week, find Hank's professional flooring place up in New Brighton Mn, drop it off and the repair guy says 2 days. Call mid week, repair guy out with sick kid, check back later. No problem I know, have had the same problem. Give him a call on Friday, yep I have it fixed. Show up, pay at front desk $13. Gun worked perfect. Even though I buy alot on the internet and Lee Valley is one of the best. There are some places B&M that treat you well.

[Randy Dutkiewicz]

I need a drill chuck with a #2 Morse Taper.

Step #1 - Go to Home Depot. "Yes, the Drill Chucks are over there." "Do you have one with a #2 Morse Taper?" "Sorry, no".

Step #2 - Stop in at Harbor Freight. "Do you sell Drill Chucks." "Just the 4-way." I had never heard of a 4-way chuck before, but he sells the tools and I am just a learner / buyer. "Actually, that was a 4-way drill chuck key. What I need is a chuck for a drill press, with a #2 Morse Taper, like most of your drill presses use." "Nope, don't have that. Try Tool Mart."

Step #3 - Go to Tool Mart. Front Door says "Entrance. Use Entrance on other side of building." The Door on the other side of the building says "Use Entrance on other side of building." I went in the first one. "I need a Jacobs Drill Chuck with a #2 Morse Taper." "We don't sell those, but the repair department can get you one." "Hi, do you sell Drill Chucks with a #2 Morse Taper?" "What brand?" "I don't care. A #2 Morse Taper is a universal standard. All of the drill presses you sell have a #2 or #3 Morse Taper." (I just decided never to bring in a tool for repair if I know more than they do. They are supposed to know more than me. A whole lot more.) "Well we need a part number. If you bring in a part number and the name of the manufacturer we can order one for you."

Step #4 - I see one on Rockler's website. I can get one for just $52.24 if I drive 20 miles. I call first. The Morse Taper is not in stock.

Step #5 - Go to Lee Valley website during coffee break. They have one for $31.50, delivered for free to my door (if I spend another $8.50 at Lee Valley, which I am quite willing to do.) I know that they will get the order right, deliver a product that works, and if anything goes wrong the nicest people in the world will comfort me and make it right.

I gave 4 local brick and mortar stores a fair shot and was willing to pay more for the convenience of driving to them and teaching them about the machines they sell. That's why I buy over the internet.

Brian

In one word - AMEN!

[Harry Hagan]

Try getting that kind of service online or at a box store.

I had a hardware store down the street just like that—until Home Depot happened. The store eventually relocated in another town about a thirty-minute drive from the old location and I continued to patronize them when necessity required or time permitted.

One day the owner commented, “You sure are a loyal customer.” as if he didn’t have any from the old location. Yep, I said. If I’m a loyal customer, I usually have a go-to-guy and that guy standing next to you is my hardware guy.

Much to my hardware guy’s embarrassment, I told the owner in great detail a few of the many times his employee had gone out of his way to help me if he could, or steer me in the right direction when he couldn’t. On more than one occasion he even took my stuff home to alter or make repairs when I didn’t have the proper tools. I made sure the owner understood his employee was the reason I drove an hour to get hardware or advice, not him.

I discovered the store had changed ownership on a recent visit. Requests for Boiled Linseed Oil and Turpentine were met with blank stares. Questions about lawn equipment and plumbing supplies left them speechless. I won’t be going back.

I miss my hardware guy. I wonder what he’s doing now?

[Myk Rian]

We have one hardware here that has been around since the town was built, or pretty close to it.
I'll need a metric drill bit. They have them. In a set, or one at a time.
I'll need some drive screws. They have them.
Drill chucks? Yep.
#2 MT? Yep.
You name it, this creaky wooden floor hardware store has it.

[Ruhi Arslan]

...I was in best-buy last week and a kid that worked there was trying to sell me a new no name TV and at the same time trying to sell me a $200 HDMI cable to connect it. I was not even shoping for a TV. I went in to grab a Apple gift card. I found it hard not to break out laughing.

The real question is if he or the cashier offered you an extended warranty during the checkout for the gift card?

During the process of finding a way to extract the bearings from the DeWalt RAS motor, I've been looking for a bearing pulley. A friend loaned me his which was form HF. As I tighten the cam, the legs which were supposed to be pulling the bearing were bending. So, I started calling auto stores to see if they have any before I will make the trip. Autozone, CarQuest, etc. The first question they ask "What year and model car is that for?". I answer it is not for a car and get "we sell car parts". Online for me as much as I can...

[ray hampton]

h f and lowe or hd sell drill chucks but they come without a morse taper,most stores will only stock the items that move quick

[Brian Kent]

I remember a hardware store in Downtown San Diego, a few blocks from the current Horton Plaza. Whenever the larger stores didn't have what I needed, they would send me to this place (it may have been San Diego Hardware, but that is the name of a different store now). Tiny old place. They had everything I ever asked for. I have no idea how they did it in such a small location. Maybe they didn't try to have 100 sets of anything. Just a few of everything and a great re-stocking system.

[Roger Feeley]

I guess I am lucky. My local Woodcraft (about 10 minutes away) is excellent. They know me pretty well so would imagine that I get a little better treatment than the guy off the street. A couple of times, I have sort of waffled on a tool and they have happily loaned me the one from back in the shop to try before I buy. Once I needed a veneer press for just one thing and they loaned me theirs. The guys are knowledgeable and willing to offer advice. They are also quick to admit that they don't know something. I always start there when I am considering a new purchase.