Rob Lee ... Where for art thou?

[Bob Lang]

I handled prototypes at last year's Woodworking in America, and I was impressed with the balance and the feel of them. I'm not always on the same page as Veritas when it comes to ergonomics, but I think they got the handle shape and balance just right.

Bob Lang

[Derek Cohen]

In regards to the new line of chisels I was wondering how long they will be? This second question may be difficult to answer but I am wondering how they are balanced. For example I have Stanley 750's and everlast and I prefer the 750's because they do not feel top heavy. The everlast feel a little too heavy at the top.

Hi Jim

This is not an answer ... because I only tested prototypes, and this was some time ago now (before WIA). Furthermore, the handles on the chisels I have are Bubinga, and Rob mentioned to me that they were not great examples (although they do look like the production versions in the pictures I have seen). Plus the blades have been worked on since I last saw them ......

... this is a lot like "this is my grandfathers' axe - but I have changed the handle three times and the head once" ...

Anyway, assuming that there is a close relationship is size, the handles of the new chisels should be longer than the #750 of both Stanley and LN, and slightly longer than those of Blue Spruce, my other reference.

In the picture below you will see that the LV handle is the same effective length as my re-handled #750 and a little longer than the BS. I really like this length. Actually, I found it really interesting that LV came up with a handle that compares so closely to the ones I made for myself. So I am biased!

In answer to your quesy about the balance, the balance point for the LV and my #750 was the same.

The chisels are 1" wide, except the BS, which is 3/4".



I am assuming that the handle still comes with a flat (Rob will tell you that my preference was for without the flat), which just goes to show that there will be so many different preferences, that it is impossible for anyone, even LV, to please all.

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Rob Lee]

Rob, this is all great information! Lee Valley continues to live up to their reputation of being innovative! I know we're all looking forward to the new PM products, but I was wondering if the plane blades were only for the Veritas line, or if there would be PM blades for the old Stanleys as well.

Hi Brandon -

There will be PM blades for the more common Stanley planes right away, with more following when we get our second run of the steel. Eventually (within a few months) we'll have PM steel as a choice wherever we have A2 now....

Cheers -

Rob

[Rob Lee]

In regards to the new line of chisels I was wondering how long they will be? This second question may be difficult to answer but I am wondering how they are balanced. For example I have Stanley 750's and everlast and I prefer the 750's because they do not feel top heavy. The everlast feel a little too heavy at the top.

Hi Jim -

We worked really hard on balance points with these chisels. Our target was to have the Centre of Gravity at or below the ferrule. Of course - a 1" chisel has much more steel below the ferrule than a 1/4" chisel - so there's only so much latitude in positioning COG, with having very different lengths.

Our initial design, while very robust, was quite handle heavy...:

image002.jpg

The present design feels quite "agile"...

Cheers -

Rob

[Rob Lee]

Hi Jim

(snip)
I am assuming that the handle still comes with a flat (Rob will tell you that my preference was for without the flat), which just goes to show that there will be so many different preferences, that it is impossible for anyone, even LV, to please all.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Hi Derek!

Yes.... they still have a subtle flat...

Cheers -

Rob

[Tony Zaffuto]

Rob,

I surprised you're out and about this morning! Figured you would have been celebrating all night after the thrashing you gave us last night! Are you coming to Harrisburg this weekend?

T.Z.

[Rob Lee]

Rob,

I surprised you're out and about this morning! Figured you would have been celebrating all night after the thrashing you gave us last night! Are you coming to Harrisburg this weekend?

T.Z.

Hi Tony -

We need every point we can get.... nice of you guys to start the rookie.....

Nope - will only be there by proxy...we do the fall Harrisburg. Too much risk of snow (seems funny saying that after the weather last week!).

Cheers -

Rob

[Brandon Craig]

Thanks Rob! I was about to buy a couple of irons, but I think I'll hold off and test out the new PM steel irons when they become available.

[Jim R Edwards]

Thank you so much for the visual comparison and thank you Mr. Lee for the additional information concerning the chisels. They look like very nice chisels and I think I will get some when the come out. I read your review on the small plow plane and that was enough to push me over the edge to buy one! I was going back and forth between the skew rabbeting plane and the small plow plane. I have a Record 778 and it works great and my current plow plane is a Stanley 55. It is ok but it feels awkward and its a bit heavy so I am looking forward to the small plow plane!

[bridger berdel]

It's hard for me to guess at the cost just yet, as our steel just came in, and we haven't got any metrics on yield by product yet. PM steels are expensive... and the PM scrap has the same value as regular steel scrap, as all of the cost is in it's fabrication, not the constituents. So.... whatever we make, has to account for what we throw away in scrap, shavings, and swarf....

Something like a chisel - we run bar stock as close to the net shape as possible, to minimise waste.... but there's still a lot of material wasted, and the bigger the chisel, the more waste there is (we turn the tangs down from the bar). Plane blades - we can nest the blanks to minimise waste... but we still need to actually run the products to see what the yield is...

how do these steels weld, or even braze/silver solder? it might be worthwhile to look back at laminated wrought iron tools from the crucible steel days for ways to use this expensive stuff more efficiently.

[David Weaver]

I think I read somewhere that the japanese makers effectively glue soft steel or iron to powder metal. Exactly what glue means, I don't know.

But I don't get the sense that it's the same process as forge welding wrought iron and white (carbon) steel.

[David Posey]

It seems likely that whatever process could be used to attach PM to softer metal would cause you to end up with an iron that is significantly thicker than most modern ones. This might make it difficult to fit into some tools, especially if you are trying to retrofit old Stanleys with this type of iron.

[David Weaver]

I guess it depends on how thick it is.

I bought a blue steel bench plane iron from stu a couple of weeks ago, and I don't know how it's put together, but it's only about as thick as a stock stanley iron (it's laminated).

Works a pearl with the chipbreaker probably fitted and fettled, though, (as does any stock thickness iron, of course). I don't see a reason they couldn't get PM in really thin pieces if they want to, though I don't know if it will be as critical as it would with hardened blue steel.

[Jack Curtis]

What part of PM (powdered metal) don't you guys understand? It could produce as thin a layer as possible. Right?

[Brian Kent]

Rob, when will you be coming out with a mid-sized truck?