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Thread: ABC fire extinguishers.

  1. #1

    ABC fire extinguishers.

    It was that time of year again for me to have my fire extinguishers recertified. When the guy was here checking on them I told him about the fire that I had in the lasers recently and how I reached for the extinguisher but didn't use it. He told me that the chemicals in the ABC extinguisher are very very corrosive to aluminum and could cause more damage to the lasers than the fire would. He told me that CO2 would be the way to go.

    I just figured I would post this so everyone here would know the risk of using a ABC extinguisher in there lasers (ABC extinguishers are the most common because they are cheap and work on electrical fires, grease fires and wood fires)
    Universal M-300 (35 Watt CO2)
    Universal X-660 (50 Watt CO2)

    Hans (35 watt YAG)
    Electrox Cobra (40 watt YAG)


    Glass With Class, Cameron, Wisconsin

  2. #2
    How did you put the fire out? A few years ago I had a fire in mine from the creosote build up in the exhaust. I grabbed my ABC and used it when there were flames inside the cabinet of my 24x36 machine. It put the fire out quickly. After making sure the fire was out I used my shop vac and then my air compressor to clean everything out of the laser. Pulled off the covers and blew the whole thing out. Had about $1500 worth of damage that was caused by the fire but none from the corrosion. I think if I had left it there waiting for the insurance company adjustor I probably would not have had the same results. I just don't know how you could have put the fire extinguisher down unless you had a CO2 as a backup.

  3. #3
    I grabbed the head of the laser and pulled it out of the way (well still running, not a good idea I know) then grabbed a towel and beat the fire out. The reason I didn't use the fire extinguisher is because the fire wasn't out of control at that point and I didn't want to deal with cleaning up whatever came out of the extinguisher. At that point I knew nothing about the corrosiveness of the powder in it. Although even knowing it will cause damage I would still use one if I had an out of control fire. I just put this up here so people who decide to can get prepared in advance of having a fire by getting an extinguisher that will do less damage.
    Universal M-300 (35 Watt CO2)
    Universal X-660 (50 Watt CO2)

    Hans (35 watt YAG)
    Electrox Cobra (40 watt YAG)


    Glass With Class, Cameron, Wisconsin

  4. #4
    A small Halon extinguisher will be most effective with least damage to the lasers from using it.

    Kim

  5. #5
    Join Date
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    I have a NitroStrike mini foamer (AFFF) extinguisher to use as a first response to fire. It is a water based foam. If that doesn't work then I'll use the dry-chem.
    Shenhui 1440x850, 130 Watt Reci Z6
    Gerber Sabre 408

  6. #6
    Halon, that was the other one he suggested, I couldn't remember the name of it until you posted it, Kim.
    Universal M-300 (35 Watt CO2)
    Universal X-660 (50 Watt CO2)

    Hans (35 watt YAG)
    Electrox Cobra (40 watt YAG)


    Glass With Class, Cameron, Wisconsin

  7. #7
    Join Date
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    they've replaced Halon with something else now .. doesn't work as
    good, but Halon is a CFC. CO2 can 'cold shock' electronics, which Halon
    won't do. And while it isn't as good as water on common combustibles,
    it will still work on class A fires. It is as good as CO2 on class B.

    If you can still get a Halon extinguisher, and know where to get it refilled,
    then by all means.. get one. It is better than CO2. They stopped making
    Halon almost 20 years ago, but there's still over 20 years left in stockpiles
    and it can be recycled.

  8. #8
    Join Date
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    Halon is a banned substance and only 'grandfathered' installations are permitted in the USA (don;t know about elsewhere). CO2 is what Epilog recommends.
    Longtai 460 with 100 watt EFR, mostly for fun. More power is good!! And a shop with enough wood working tools to make a lot of sawdust. Ex-owner of Shenhui 460-80 and engraving business with 45 watt Epilog Mini18.

  9. #9
    Join Date
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    Halon has been replaced by Halonite I believe. Either one was great for putting down a fire quick but Halon would kill you in the process I was told. I do remember that it worked great for cooling down warm beers at the end of a rough day. The CO2 extinguisher will do the job and save you money over the Halonite (and will also cool off the beers).
    Some people go their whole life wondering if they made a difference in the world, Marines don't have that problem.(R. Reagan)

    Epilog Helix 60 watt laser
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  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Westminster, MD
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    Quote Originally Posted by Joe Hillmann View Post
    It was that time of year again for me to have my fire extinguishers recertified. When the guy was here checking on them I told him about the fire that I had in the lasers recently and how I reached for the extinguisher but didn't use it. He told me that the chemicals in the ABC extinguisher are very very corrosive to aluminum and could cause more damage to the lasers than the fire would. He told me that CO2 would be the way to go.

    I just figured I would post this so everyone here would know the risk of using a ABC extinguisher in there lasers (ABC extinguishers are the most common because they are cheap and work on electrical fires, grease fires and wood fires)

    Joe,

    Do a Google search for Halotron extinguishers. That's the replacement for halon-- clean, no cold shock potential like CO2, no Purple-K or other potentially corrosive dry powder to clean out of the optics or exhaust or anywhere else. Not cheap, but a lot less than a new machine.

    duncan
    Old gray geezer/woodworker/hiker/canoeist...
    40 watt Epilog Mini-18 in a solar-powered shop...
    Corel X5, X6, GS 2017, GS 2019; BoxIt, FlexIt; Photoshop CS6, 1-Touch Photolaser
    Stinger I CNC, VCarve Pro

  11. #11
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Neil Pabia View Post
    Halon has been replaced by Halonite I believe. Either one was great for putting down a fire quick but Halon would kill you in the process I was told.
    Actually, no .. that was one of the features of Halon.. it WON'T kill you. CO2 can, as it
    displaces the available oxygen. In a gas flooded room, CO2 can cause suffocation. Halon
    might make you light headed. In very high concentrations it could cause arrhythmia, but
    it isn't likely that anyone would have access to that much Halon.. certainly not from
    a fire extinguisher (or 10) The most common health risk from Halon is frostbite.

    John .. the manufacture of Halon was banned in 1994, but the existing supply can still
    be sold and recycled. Extinguishers can be emptied, recycled and refilled. High pressure
    tanks can last for decades and kept in service. (but parts are getting harder to find)
    Airlines and military still use them because it is one of the most effective fire suppressants
    in a closed environment with minimal health risks. So while they can't be manufactured
    anymore, you can still buy, sell and use them.

  12. #12
    As I was retiring from the plastics industry in 2007, we were replacing our Halon Bombs with an FM200 agent. Don't remember who makes it but I'm sure Google does. I had maintenance and fire protection responsibility for the largest thermoforming plant in the states under one roof and we used a variety of extinguishing agents, depending on the hazard. Our computer rooms were protected by halon systems backed up by delayed action water sprinkler system. For our major electrical, we would place a CO2 extinguisher (or several) close to large electrical panels and drive systems and then have dry chemical not far away. The CO2 cause less damage but are not rated as effective as dry chemical. First attack was with CO2 to save the equipment, second level was dry chem and 1-1/2" hose lines to save the plant. You would be hard pressed to dump enough CO2 in an office area to inhibit breathing unless you had several 20 lb. bottles. Dry chemical will make you find a door quickly. I've been rendered unconscious from taking a direct shot from a dry chem in the face - not fun. We put close to 2,000 pounds of dry chem on that little fire.

    As you decide what to use, be sure to educate yourself with the fire extinguisher rating system. It is a relative system devised to let one compare the effectiveness of one type or size of extinguisher to another based on fire class.

    I operate out of our residence and my first defense is a spray bottle of water. Next line is a dry chem.
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  13. #13
    Thanks, Randy. That was a clear and handy overview outlining the best options for me. I'm sure others will find it instructional as well.

    cheers, dee
    Epilog Mini 18/25w & 35w, Mac and Vaio, Corel x3, typical art toys, airbrush... I'm a Laserhead, my husband is a Neanderthal - go figure

    Red Coin Mah Jong

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
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    Connecticut
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Stone View Post
    Actually, no .. that was one of the features of Halon.. it WON'T kill you. CO2 can, as it
    displaces the available oxygen. In a gas flooded room, CO2 can cause suffocation. Halon
    might make you light headed. In very high concentrations it could cause arrhythmia, but
    it isn't likely that anyone would have access to that much Halon.. certainly not from
    a fire extinguisher (or 10) The most common health risk from Halon is frostbite.
    Guess I was misinformed, I was told that it sucked all the oxygen out of the room and put down the fire. I really only used it for cooling beers.
    Some people go their whole life wondering if they made a difference in the world, Marines don't have that problem.(R. Reagan)

    Epilog Helix 60 watt laser
    Corel Draw X5
    EngraveLab 8

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Location
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    No mention today of the little kitchen fire extinguisher in a spray can..... The kind they are selling for a grease fire. Fluid without the air blast... http://firstalert.com/videos/tundra Saw it for the first time on a Thread here 2 years ago...

    AL
    1 Laser, 4 CarveWrights, Star 912 Rotary, CLTT, Sublimation, FC7000 Vinyl, 911 Signs, Street Signs, Tourist Products and more.
    Home of the Fire Department "Epoxy Dome Accountability Tag and Accountability Boards".

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