Fairness Question on Classified Sale

[Mike Henderson]

I had an unusual situation occur recently in making a sale through the classified section of the forum, and I would like your opinion so that I can avoid the situation in the future.

I listed a router plane on Monday. The first response was from someone who asked me to hold the plane until Friday, when he could make payment. I responded that I wouldn't do that - that I'd accept the first response that provided payment. He understood and replied that he'd check back on Friday to see if it was still available.

The second response was from someone who wanted the plane but couldn't pay until he arrived home that evening. Because of how I had responded to the first response, I felt it only fair that I respond the same way to the second person, and did so, saying essentially the same thing - I'd sell to the first person who provided payment.

I then received two more responses and sent my PayPal ID to the first of those two, who paid me via PayPal.

Do you think I handled this in a fair manner? The only difference between the first two responses was the time period. I felt that if I wouldn't wait several days, I had to take the same approach to several hours.

How would you have handled it?

Some issues I see:
1. What if someone wanted to send a check, while someone else was willing to pay via PayPal. The PayPal payment closes the sale immediately, while the "check in the mail" doesn't close the sale for several days. Would it be fair to favor the PayPal buyer over the check buyer, even if the check person responded first?
2. How much time should a person be given to provide payment via PayPal? Would you wait until tomorrow if you had other buyers ready to provide payment today?

A seller should probably specify a policy when listing the item so that everyone knows how things will be handled. Perhaps from the discussion in this thread we can come up with a policy that we can all follow.

Mike

[Derek Gilmer]

Back to back like that I see why you made the choice. But waiting til afternoon doesn't seem unreasonable to me. The person might be on phone checking the forum and can't get to paypal or paypal is blocked at work and they can pay when they get home.

It is similar to someone sending a message saying "I'll take it, what is your paypal address to send payment" while checking the forum at lunch. Then not being able to check again until after work to see your reply to send payment.

On the check thing, if it was a contributor or someone with a decent number of posts I'd wait for the check.

[Mike Cutler]

Mike

It's always a balancing act, and what makes it even tougher is that the people here on the board are pretty much straight up folks, and you're trying to do right by them.
A few years back I sold a few of my planes, and about the only ethic I abided by was to honor the first commitment of payment, and specify a time frame, I kept it to one working day.
I then PM'd back the other folks that expressed interest, and told them what their relative position was should the original commitment fall through.
I don't know that I like a formal policy as I did hold one plane for a few days, but it was an extreme case. The memeber was in the armed forces on active duty and serving in Bagdhad at the time. I guess there are some delays in the ability to correspond, and effect payment, from there. Which I found understandable given the circumstances. And yes, He did buy the plane. ( It was kinda cool shipping something to Bagdhad too.)
I also recieved payments by check, in addition to PayPal, and still it was based on the first commitment. I didn't favor one payment method over another.

[Jeff Hamilton Jr.]

Just my personal opinion.

We are, fortunately or unfortunately, in a world of immediacy. Further, it is not unusual (in my personal experience) for folks to "change minds" in the course of trying to negotiate a price on an object. It seems an unfair burden on the seller to "wait" under the above circumstances rather than taking a completed payment as THE conclusion of the sale.

Therefore, I believe PayPal is really the only reasonable way to conduct transactions here. We feel like we all know each other - but really don't - and PayPal gives some level of protection to both the buyer and seller. It is not difficult to open an account and is certainly easy to use.

If someone makes a personal choice to use a check, then it would seem to me they do so at the risk of losing the purchase. Is the seller supposed to forgo other "sure" sales while awaiting the Post Office? Then the bank clearing the check? What if the check NSF's?

Simply put, the first party ready willing and ABLE to conclude the transaction should prevail.

[David Weaver]

First with paypal payment is how I'd specify it. Not because I'm trying to be cruel, but one of the things that prevents me from posting a lot of stuff on the classifieds here is that there is too much back and forth once you do it. Too many people who say they're interested, but they're going to look around for a little first and will get back to you, etc. I understand they're not intending to make things complicated, but I will sell paypal only unless I know someone I'm dealing with, and whoever can pay it immediately.

If someone can't pay, then I would ask them to send a PM again when they can. There's no lay away, or you'll just convince yourself that it's too much of a hassle to sell, anyway.

It's already a pain dealing with taking pictures, describing something, packing, etc. It can be an hours worth of screwing around in total for something that we might be better off (time-wise) throwing away than yielding a few bucks on.

So, anyway, I'd specify all sales as paypal only, first to pay gets it so you're not spending your day keeping a list of who might do what.

[Dan Hintz]

Tough call. Personally, I look at who is offering to purchase it. If it's a relatively new poster, I generally won't wait more than an hour or two before expecting payment in my PP inbox. If it's someone I recognize or has been here a while, I may be willing to wait a day or two for payment. I want to be fair, but I also don't want to create an atmosphere where someone can hold up the purchase of an item for long periods of time when they were not serious about it in the meantime.

Take my recent lathe purchase from Bill Grumbine. It's a $7k purchase, but he knows me and is willing to wait a while for a check to arrive. I told him I'd get a check in the mail in the next day or so, but if I was a bad person I could hold that sale up for a week or more. If he didn't know me, I would expect to pay a non-refundable deposit at the very least.

[Bruce Page]

There’s an old adage “A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush” and based on a few sales through Craigslist falling apart I can easily understand not wanting to wait a week. That said, as a buyer that committed to the purchase, I don’t think it is unreasonable to expect the seller to hold the item for a few hours.

[glenn bradley]

I agree that the interval between the events makes your decision sound. If the follow asking for you to wait till "this evening" had been an isolated event I would have done so. Given your situation I feel that you acted appropriately. I still have an item that I denied to one person because another had said he would buy it . . . still waiting . . . never again, sorry .

[Mike Henderson]

If the fellow asking for you to wait till "this evening" had been an isolated event I would have done so. Given your situation I feel that you acted appropriately.

I agree and would have waited if I hadn't refused the first person.

Mike

[Jim Koepke]

"I will gladly pay you next Tuesday for a hamburger today."

I have had trouble with checks, caused by my bank making a mistake. They were checks I sent and it took quite a bit to clean up the mess. I imagine my name may be on a few lists of sellers.

Paypal has not been a problem for me.

There have also been a few times where I held an item for someone that never came up with the funds. The tools were set aside and for a few weeks every time I saw them setting there made me wonder if it would ever close. Finally I gave up and put the tools back with my users.

These are the kinds of difficulties that keep me from selling for income. My selling is limited to raising money for a new toy.

jtk

[Brian Elfert]

Whenever I have purchased something locally on Craigslist it has always been the first guy to show up with the cash gets it. Rarely will anyone hold an item unless they seller can't meet right away to make the sale.

Too many people won't bother to tell a seller if they aren't going to be able to complete the sale at the agreed upon time. If the seller holds something for 24 hours and the sale falls through the seller may have missed several other buyers who would have purchased immediately.

[Jeff Monson]

I think you did the right thing Mike. Selling on classifieds through the internet is a tough thing to be consistently fair on. If I had a dollar for every "I'll take it" pm's that I have received on other forums, I could buy a nice steak dinner. I've adopted the same policy, 1st to pay gets what I have to sell.

[Matt Meiser]

I don't think what you did was wrong, nor do I think holding it until the evening would have been wrong. I'd definitely be inclined to take into account whether I know the person or not. If I was "holding" it until evening, I'd probably just hold off responding to further PM's until then. Also if I didn't receive the payment as promised, I'd probably send a PM giving a very brief grace period.

[Van Huskey]

Your sale thus your conditions period.

Everyone is different but one thing to keep in mind from the potential buyers POV is he/she probably isn't sitting at the computer all day wating for the reply. I would say waiting 24-48hrs for payment would be "normal" but again your sale your rules.

The funny thing is in reality I would do something similar to Dan. I would give everyone that has replied to this thread for example extra time compared to a name I didn't recognize. If it was Mike Cruz I would hold it maybe 2 minutes... Just kidding if Mike wanted something of mine I would hold it for as long as he liked, because he held something for me for months before I could pick it up and wouldn't even take payment in the meantime.

Being totally honest (maybe I shouldn't be) if I had something for sale here and got a PM from a name I never see and then before I responded got a PM from a name I see all the time, and feel a "friendship" with like the people in this thread I would feel rather compelled to respond to the "friend" first, no it wouldn't be fair but if my grandfather called me just after that "unknown" persons PM and said he wanted what ever I was selling he would be the one to get it. Once I say I will sell it to you I will provided you pay in a resonably prompt manner, until I say I will sell it to you I suppose I "reserve the right to refuse service".

[Anthony Whitesell]

For the situation you ended up in with the first four callers, I do would have done and expected the same response.

As to your first question, about waiting for a check versus paypal. I'm not sure what I would have done. I would have waited for the check to clear before the plane was headed out of my hands.

For question #2, now that I see it in writing, if someone tells me they will pay when they get home is better than some saying they will pay and not tell me when. Taking into account caller #1, I still may have ending up going to the slow paypal caller not knowing when they would pay.

Here's a third question: What would you do if caller #2 (I can pay this afternoon via paypal) had said I can pay you CASH this afternoon? Would you have waited?