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Thread: LED shop lights

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
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    Los Angeles, CA
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    892

    LED shop lights

    I've tried the search function with no luck.

    Is there such a thing as LED shop lights? The kind you would hang from the ceiling, not the kind you hold in your hand or clamp to some surface.

  2. #2
    Ellen,
    There are several fantastic options out there for LED lighting. That said, there is still not a tremendous amount of options with regards to industrial/shop type lighting as the market seems to be trying to tackle the residential consumer first.

    The major hold back for LED, as you may be aware, is that you pay up-front for longevity. This is an extremely hard concept for the current average American consumer to swallow. They simply dont track what it costs for replacement bulbs annually and absolutely no (factual) idea what they spend on bulbs in a 10-15 year period which is where LED shines (no pun intended).

    I think you will wind up using conventional residential LED lighting for the near future if you are looking to LED for your shop lighting. This would be LED in cans, conventional fixtures, or LED equivalents to florescent shop lighting.

    That said, if you are one of the people who has the capacity to understand amortization, and the ability to cover the up-front costs of LED you are far ahead of the rest of the country.

    I would love to be optimistic that LED's will become cost compatible with CFL's or high end incandescents in the next year or two but I just dont think its there yet.

    It is still by far the smart decision over a decade or more, however in the world of BigMac's, and Happy Meals, it just aint there yet.

    Mark

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Bolton View Post
    Ellen,
    There are several fantastic options out there for LED lighting. That said, there is still not a tremendous amount of options with regards to industrial/shop type lighting as the market seems to be trying to tackle the residential consumer first.

    The major hold back for LED, as you may be aware, is that you pay up-front for longevity. This is an extremely hard concept for the current average American consumer to swallow. They simply dont track what it costs for replacement bulbs annually and absolutely no (factual) idea what they spend on bulbs in a 10-15 year period which is where LED shines (no pun intended).

    I think you will wind up using conventional residential LED lighting for the near future if you are looking to LED for your shop lighting. This would be LED in cans, conventional fixtures, or LED equivalents to florescent shop lighting.

    That said, if you are one of the people who has the capacity to understand amortization, and the ability to cover the up-front costs of LED you are far ahead of the rest of the country.

    I would love to be optimistic that LED's will become cost compatible with CFL's or high end incandescents in the next year or two but I just dont think its there yet.

    It is still by far the smart decision over a decade or more, however in the world of BigMac's, and Happy Meals, it just aint there yet.

    Mark
    Fluorescent tubes often have ratings of 10,000 hours. LEDs with equivalent brightness cost lots more -- perhaps a hundred times more. To have an equivalent value, the LEDs would have to last a million hours or so. (That's a hundred years of 24/7 use.) LEDs might actually do that, but nobody in a home shop will live long enough to use that lifetime. The key issue is not failure to understand amortization, but rather the fact that LEDs are too expensive.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Feb 2003
    Location
    Washington, NC
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    Everything said so far is right on. I wanted to replace my overhead porch lights, but hard to accept $50 -$70 or more each for LED's equivalent to the incandescent PARs I have now. I think part of the problem is production costs. Once they get those under control with better and quicker manufacturing and higher production the prices will start coming down.

  5. #5
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    Nov 2007
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    Penryn, Ca
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    Really looked into LED lighting for a different application and came to the same conclusion that waiting another year or so would be a good idea.
    Look at CFL's, when they first came out the price was through the roof, now with local power company's help I have bought them as low as $ .50 each.

    Give it time and they will be there, They are getting the color of the light pretty good now.
    Cheers

    J
    o
    h
    n
    ________

    Stupid Hurts.............

  6. #6
    When we designed our home 5 years ago, we simply went with can ceiling lights in every room. Since then we have tried pretty much all the alternatives including incandescent spots, floods, compact florescent bulbs of different size/shape/manufacturer and the result has been the same. Generally poor lighting and or frequent replacement.

    Last year, I decided to replace the bulbs in the kitchen, my wife's sewing room and the media room. The kitchen and the sewing room got "cool" LEDs and the media room got "warm" LEDs.

    Even at $95 a pop, I will eventually replace all the bulbs in the house. In addition to no longer buying conventional replacement bulbs and dragging ladders in and out the house to replace them, the quality of the light from the LEDs far surpasses anything I have ever used in the past. Working or just being in any of the three rooms with LEDs is a more satisfying and pleasant experience than the rest of the house. Lighting quality is really a big deal, IMHV.

    And I do not eat Big Macs.

  7. #7
    Here's a question, to Mark and Bob I guess. Does the color range of the LED's render decent colors to your eye? When I first looked at small LED fixtures as replacments for pod/ under-counter lighting in our kitchen almost 10 years ago, they all seemed a bit blueish in lighting output. Has this changed over the years? Bob was referring to two different color outputs like a regular FL bulb Kelvin range option, for his house, so it seems so.
    Second, I too think the costs could go down for the purchase price if they are widely accepted. In the automotive industry, they are poised to displace Halogen and Incadescent completely if things really take off. We've already seen designs for headlights with 36 or more LEDs in them, and already have LEDs for tail lights, brake lights and turn signals and interior lighting of vehicles on the street. You end up with such a rugged light, and such low amperage costs along with smaller wiring to get the same or more light output in a given space. Should be an interesting next 5-10 years in the housing industry or home replacement market.

  8. #8
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    3,562
    Recently I received some information from one of the vendors that I have used for lighting, 1000bulbs.com. According to them government testing shows that many of the current LDSs do not last as long or provide as much light as claimed by the manufacturers. They provide a list of questions (http://www.1000bulbs.com/pg/LEDCustomerQuestions/) that customers should ask before purchasing LED lighting.
    Don Bullock
    Woebgon Bassets
    AKC Championss

    The man who makes no mistakes does not usually make anything.
    -- Edward John Phelps

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Callan Campbell View Post
    Here's a question, to Mark and Bob I guess. Does the color range of the LED's render decent colors to your eye? When I first looked at small LED fixtures as replacments for pod/ under-counter lighting in our kitchen almost 10 years ago, they all seemed a bit blueish in lighting output. Has this changed over the years? Bob was referring to two different color outputs like a regular FL bulb Kelvin range option, for his house, so it seems so.
    Second, I too think the costs could go down for the purchase price if they are widely accepted. In the automotive industry, they are poised to displace Halogen and Incadescent completely if things really take off. We've already seen designs for headlights with 36 or more LEDs in them, and already have LEDs for tail lights, brake lights and turn signals and interior lighting of vehicles on the street. You end up with such a rugged light, and such low amperage costs along with smaller wiring to get the same or more light output in a given space. Should be an interesting next 5-10 years in the housing industry or home replacement market.
    Callan...

    The short answer is that both of the color ranges we are using are quite pleasing and the cool color, in particular, makes work in the kitchen and sewing room much easier to see what you are doing.

    Here's the longer and more authoritative answer. http://www.creelighting.com/ The LR6 are the bulbs that I bought. We have both 2700K and 3500K.



    ...Bob

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Bob Borzelleri View Post
    Callan...

    The short answer is that both of the color ranges we are using are quite pleasing and the cool color, in particular, makes work in the kitchen and sewing room much easier to see what you are doing.

    Here's the longer and more authoritative answer. http://www.creelighting.com/ The LR6 are the bulbs that I bought. We have both 2700K and 3500K.


    ...Bob
    Thank you Bob for the reply, I'll look into that link. As for Don's post below, I already agree with that for Compact FLs. We never see the full time/hour run with them that's stated as life cycle, but they DO last longer than regular bulbs and our electric bill is always way less than it used to be, esp. in the winter time when you run more lights even in the daytime to be able to see through the "gray gloom"
    Anyway, we switched over to CFLs for almost all bulbs in our house, and I'll look at the LED bulbs that I didn't know had made it to the market to see what they're like. Thats the SawMill Creek for you, lighting the way

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Bullock View Post
    Recently I received some information from one of the vendors that I have used for lighting, 1000bulbs.com. According to them government testing shows that many of the current LDSs do not last as long or provide as much light as claimed by the manufacturers. They provide a list of questions (http://www.1000bulbs.com/pg/LEDCustomerQuestions/) that customers should ask before purchasing LED lighting.
    I read that egram too (I replaced my photo lights with humongous CFLs I got from 1000bulbs). I don't doubt the results- there are a lot of companies trying to cash in on the "Go Green" movement.

  12. #12
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    Sep 2009
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    so. jersey
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    Cheap light

    LEDs are great!They are just not there yet.Where leds can be economically used they are fantastic.The power companies do not want high yield low wattage lamps. For you and I, were stuck right now,but better things are coming.In the mean time we're stuck with existing lighting. I have large fixtures and monthly bill to match.How about we figure a way to store daylight in the closet and let out at night. Good luck/Ed

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Ed Griner View Post
    The power companies do not want high yield low wattage lamps.
    I have a hard time believing that. One, our power company pays down the cost of CFLs here. That is contradictory. Two, using less power means the power company can add more customers without expanding infrastructure. That yields a higher profit margin. Three, the power companies arn't keeping the semiconductor industries from producing LED's. They are unrelated industries.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Callan Campbell View Post
    We never see the full time/hour run with them that's stated as life cycle, but they DO last longer than regular bulbs and our electric bill is always way less than it used to be, esp. in the winter time when you run more lights even in the daytime to be able to see through the "gray gloom"
    Another thing to remember is when companies rate the life of a bulb in hours it is not a rating to failure. Its a rating to a reduced light output. I cant remember exactly but its something like 70% I want to say.

    This of course make all bulbs look worse as they actually fail FAR before they "actually" fail in the mfr.'s eyes.

    As I recall LED's when first introduced they were often touted at 100,000 hour life, then this was reduced to 50,000 hours, and it seems many now have leveled out in the 35,000-50,000 hour range. There are still some high end bulbs that claim 100,000 due to heat sinks and so on but there isnt long term data.

    In my initial post I am sure it sounded like bulb life is the only factor when it isnt. It is of course a good way to get consumers to see one of the value's. There are of course all the other issues, less power, hazardous materials, and so on.

    LED's may or may not be the future but they are most definitely one thing, another step on the path to something better. They are simply one facet on a giant diamond. Too often people are looking for the single magic bullet.

    We have to keep taking steps, and sadly the path will likely never end.

    Mark

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    so. jersey
    Posts
    190

    Power companies

    What I said was basically the more you burn the more they make.Anything to improve their bottom line.Why aren't power lines in an underground tunnels? Just think no more ugly poles to run your car into,no overhead wires,trees could fall wherever they want,ice storms wouldn't knock out power,like what is happening right now in the Delaware valley area.All decisions are directly related to the power companies bottom line.Thats one example. Ed

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