Ceramic glaze test - it's NOT cermark!

[Andrea Weissenseel]

Rodne, be sure to claim your patent for that

[John Barton]

A lot of patents are over broad and full of holes. And any inventor is allowed to reverse engineer a process.

I very much doubt that any person doing their own home brew version of marking using glazes is going to be sued or harassed.

Patents protect the commercial application of a specific application, not the idea. You cannot patent or protect the IDEA of using glazes to act as an agent to mark substrates using the laser. You an patent CERTAIN chemical compounds and thus prevent others from selling those compounds of using them in the course of producing goods for sale.

We have faced this sort of thing in the past on two separate occasions and both time we got the company making infringement claims to back down after we shot their patent full of holes.

Being granted a patent does not automatically make the patent valid in all claims. Patent examiners aren't running out to find out the state of the art in the industry and checking the claims. All they can really do is a cursory examination of prior patents and art and make sure there are no glaring conflicts.

So don't be afraid to share your techniques that you developed on your own.

[Steve Clarkson]

Don't forget that the only reason Cermark and Thermark got together was to resolve the patent issue between them.

[Dan Hintz]

I think this whole patent thing is somewhat rediculous - there is a patent for marking denim with a laser...what next - we gonna get sued for digging a hole with a spade....

You have no idea how true this is... I was discussing this exact topic with my SO last night over dinner as I've been contemplating becoming a patent examiner (not as exciting as my engineering work, but it would allow me to work from home and claim government bennies and retirement). I could write several pages on what's wrong with the system, and it wouldn't be just my opinion, it would be cold, hard fact as expressed by senior patent examiners, the head of the USPTO, and President Obama himself (though the President talks in the same way Reagan used to about patent office reform, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed).

As the system stands now, not only has "non-obviousness" been obfuscated as a requirement for a patent being granted, the junior examiners have found it's easier to deny every application that comes across their desk. If they grant one, the senior reviewer can turn around and deny it (and these "senior" guys are rarely even working in their own field of art, mind you)... if you get 10% of your grants overturned by "quality review", you get a permanent written ding in your record, which leads to lack of promotion. The examiners have found it's better (and more lucrative) to deny everything and fly under the radar, waiting for their year-end bonus and (hopefully) pay-scale increase. But not too, high... it turns out once you get beyond a certain pay grade, the bonus money drops significantly for each patent granted, so they're gaming the system by getting juuuust enough of a grade increase, but not go beyond a certain level (I believe making it to a grade 14 was a shot in the foot). Sad, but true.

[Dee Gallo]

Here is the result of my next test on beige coilstock: you can control the color changes to a certain extent by adjusting the power on the fly. It would be easy to make the colors appear if you pre-set the laser for each color and printed on thing at a time. But I didn't

The 600 dpi seems to give the best color results, the 300 dpi the worst.

I doubt if this procedure will be useful to anyone unless they were making an art piece where the muted colors are wanted. Maybe a nice foggy landscape? Or a beach theme, shells and what-not. Might make a nice background for a sign or plaque in combination with vinyl lettering.

It is scrub-proof, I rubbed the heck out of it under water with a green scrubber and dish soap... nothing came off.

cheers, dee

- still want to see the ceramic glaze results from Tim -

[Dan Hintz]

Sometimes "failed" experiments, or those that use incorrect initial assumptions, lead to some very happy results. True, the colors are muted, but it's a very unique effect, and certainly different than I would have expected. I'm curious to see what kind of result you'll get when you switch to using a piece of porcelain tile... I expect the color to remain a little more true (and vivid).

[Doug Griffith]

Hi all , check out this:
http://www.freepatentsonline.com/6238847.html
Seems in essence any compound you develop will be in conflict with the patent....

For those who like to read this stuff, here's a link to the USPTO. There is also an image. I always go directly to the source and avoid all the watered down pay-for patent sites. They get their info from here anyways.

http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-P...y=PN%2F6238847

[Dee Gallo]

Sometimes "failed" experiments, or those that use incorrect initial assumptions, lead to some very happy results. True, the colors are muted, but it's a very unique effect, and certainly different than I would have expected. I'm curious to see what kind of result you'll get when you switch to using a piece of porcelain tile... I expect the color to remain a little more true (and vivid).

Nope, I just tried a white HD tile and it did mark the tile, but not with color, just gray. It might be the overglaze is not a good choice of glaze, so I will wait for Tim's explanation before going any further.

dee

[Darren Null]

It was good. We now (as a board) own a faint red.. Now we just have to find vibrant cyan, magenta, yellow and black and we're a multinational corporation.

[Dan Hintz]

Dee, meant to ask and it's not readily apparent from your posts... was the glaze just a clear overcoat, or was it a solid color, like black? Was it a low fire or very low fire?

[Martin Boekers]

Tim,

Are you actually lasering the tiles are making the mask and the firing them?

Thanks,

Marty

[Tim Wooldridge]

Glazed Black fine font on beige Porcelain



12x12 Ceramic tile with black glazed elk silhouette


12x12 white marble tile with permanent black guiness logo

Beige porcelain with green tree silhouettes


12x12 biege marble tile with black bear

[Dan Hintz]

Okay, I have a few glazes on order to try out next weekend. Me and my machine already have a date with some bottles this weekend (and I'm not saying if I plan on personally emptying them before engraving ). I will get to the bottom of this, one way or the other... it has sufficiently raised my engineering hackles.

[Dan Hintz]

Glazed Black fine font on beige Porcelain

12x12 Ceramic tile with black glazed elk silhouette

12x12 white marble tile with permanent black guiness logo

Beige porcelain with green tree silhouettes

12x12 biege marble tile with black bear

Now you're just being a tease...

[Darren Null]

You have indeed put your money where your mouth is. I salute your impeccable dress an can I have a recipe please?