Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Plate Paint Flaws

  1. #1

    Plate Paint Flaws

    Not having a lot of experience with doing plaques and lacquered brass, I'm wondering how often you come across product with paint flaws. I made an engraving mistake and bit the bullet on one plaque plate which I thought was pitted but still salable. The replacement came, and after I engraved it I saw a very noticeable paint bubble and a hair in the lacquer that I first thought were dirt but clearly are flaws in the paint. Does this happen frequently to you guys?

    I'm intentionally not posting the name of the vendor because they are providing good service and have sent me a third plate without charge. Even so, I have a customer that is getting agitated because of the delay, and I'm trying to figure out whether this kind of product flaw is a common occurrence.

    Thanks,

    Rob
    Last edited by R. A. Mitchell; 05-08-2009 at 1:00 PM. Reason: grammar - the bain of my existence
    Robert Mitchell

    Epilog Helix 75
    Corel 11, X4 Adobe CS3
    PC, MacBook Pro

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Louisiana
    Posts
    61
    I have had similar problems with black brass steel, where there might be a paint bubble or scratch, even though the cover is still on, and shows no sign of damage until you take off the cover. I thought it was just a random occurence until I saw that a couple of sheets following had similar blemishes or marks on them. Well, at least I know I'm not alone on this.

  3. #3
    Have seen the same things. Alumamark has given me similar problems in their gold colors. It'll engrave black except for a small dot in the middle of something. You look at it and can see something raised in the material coating.
    Lasers : Trotec Speedy 300 75W, Trotec Speedy 300 80W, Galvo Fiber Laser 20W
    Printers : Mimaki UJF-6042 UV Flatbed Printer , HP Designjet L26500 61" Wide Format Latex Printer, Summa S140-T 48" Vinyl Plotter
    Router : ShopBot 48" x 96" CNC Router Rotary Engravers : (2) Xenetech XOT 16 x 25 Rotary Engravers

    Real name Steve but that name was taken on the forum. Used Middle name. Call me Steve or Scott, doesn't matter.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Corvallis, Oregon
    Posts
    443
    You will be lucky if you can get 75% usable material out of a sheet, due to flaws, bends, etc. You need to calculate this in your material pricing. It's the nature of the business.

    Mark
    ULS X-2 660, Corel X3, Haas VF4, Graphtec vinyl cutter, Xenetech rotaries (3), Dahlgren Tables, Gorton P2-3, New Hermes pantographs (2), and recently, 24" x 36" chinese router. Also do sublimation, sand blasting, & metal photo. Engraver since 1975.

  5. #5
    I understand your point. The plate I was using had a decorative border on it and was cut to size. I didn't get the large sheet and cut it myself. I assumed the "finished" plates would be of a higher quality than I apparently should have.
    Last edited by R. A. Mitchell; 05-08-2009 at 2:26 PM. Reason: clarification
    Robert Mitchell

    Epilog Helix 75
    Corel 11, X4 Adobe CS3
    PC, MacBook Pro

  6. #6
    Yes, that will happen. I'd estimate 5% of the time . That may be a little high. But you'll learn to check them before you engrave.
    Mike Null

    St. Louis Laser, Inc.

    Trotec Speedy 300, 80 watt
    Woodworking shop CLTT and Laser Sublimation
    Evolis Card Printer
    CorelDraw X5

  7. #7
    You can't really check them until you take off the protective mask, can you? By that point, unless you have extra stock, there's not much you can do.
    Robert Mitchell

    Epilog Helix 75
    Corel 11, X4 Adobe CS3
    PC, MacBook Pro

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Suwanee, GA
    Posts
    3,656
    I have seen a small number of plates unusable. I'm pretty impressed that it's not a higher number considering how difficult it is getting a blemish free finish with gloss black. I always order about 10% extra when I use them, for my mistakes and their flaws.

    Perhaps you could show the customer what you rejected, on their behalf, and stress to them the importance you place on their order by not accepting sub-standard parts.

    Gary
    I have done so much with so little for so long, that I can do almost anything with practically nothing...

    Trotec Speedy 400 80 watt 8/2015
    G. Weike LF-30, 30 watt galvo fiber - 1/2016
    G. Weike LF-30, 30 watt galvo fiber - 3/2015
    Fargo HDP5000 Card printer


  9. #9
    Gary - I agree with you. I have a gloss black car that I dote on, and it is very difficult to keep it clean and protect it from marks. Everything shows on it. So I understand the difficulty in producing glossy black plates.

    Even so, glossy black plates aren't anything new, and the people who sell them must know what others expect in an end product. Reject rates running anywhere from 5-25% based on what people report in these posts is a pretty high failure rate. Perhaps it is unavoidable, but it is valuable to know that such a problem exists.
    Robert Mitchell

    Epilog Helix 75
    Corel 11, X4 Adobe CS3
    PC, MacBook Pro

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2006
    Location
    Corvallis, Oregon
    Posts
    443
    The plates with the screen printed decorations are quite delicate... our biggest problem with them is how easily they are scratched. The screen printed decorations (and the black centers) are done with poor quality inks... no where near the quality and durability of the roller coated inks applied when the metal is finished at the factory. You will also see this frequently when drag engraving... the decorative inks will chip out, leaving a rough line. This gets worse with age. I have a big stack of them that are pretty much worthless except for the brass in them.

    They cost about $4 each when I was buying them, many times the cost of a plain plate.

    Mark
    ULS X-2 660, Corel X3, Haas VF4, Graphtec vinyl cutter, Xenetech rotaries (3), Dahlgren Tables, Gorton P2-3, New Hermes pantographs (2), and recently, 24" x 36" chinese router. Also do sublimation, sand blasting, & metal photo. Engraver since 1975.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Location
    Innisfil Ontario Canada
    Posts
    4,018
    I have not seen any flaws in the black brass coated steel I have been getting, the only surface problem I've had was due to mishandling at the suppliers. I had one sheet where it look like it had been pulled from a stack, and even the plastic was rolled back by the friction, and the plate was all scratched. The plate was replaced right away by my supplier, but I can't see how someone could actually pack something that looked like that and not notice it.
    I had one problem with some mystery engraving plastic substituted for the Romark I actually ordered from a supplier I no longer use, (it smoked black while engraving, and was covered in black marks under the protective plastic)they charged me for the replacement sheet of Romark, along with shipping charges, and refused to credit me for the sheet of crap they originally sent. I blessed them with a chargeback for the replacement sheet and shipping charges, and have never used them since.
    Last edited by Bill Cunningham; 05-09-2009 at 11:16 PM.
    Epilog 24TT(somewhere between 35-45 watts), CorelX4, Photograv(the old one, it works!), HotStamping, Pantograph, Vulcanizer, PolymerPlatemaker, Sandblasting Cabinet, and a 30 year collection of Assorted 'Junque'

    Every time you make a typo, the errorists win

    I Have to think outside the box.. I don't fit in it anymore


    Experience is a wonderful thing.
    It enables you to recognize a mistake when you make it again.


    Every silver lining has a cloud around it




  12. #12
    I occasionally get small bubbles or contamination. JDS always replaces them without question. I just ran about 50 and don't recall having any flaws.
    Mike Null

    St. Louis Laser, Inc.

    Trotec Speedy 300, 80 watt
    Woodworking shop CLTT and Laser Sublimation
    Evolis Card Printer
    CorelDraw X5

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •