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Are these the same basic saws? Cannot find any info indicating if the 35670 is the hybrid? The SC saw is on sale at Woodcraft for $900(after rebate). How does the fence on the SC compare to the Beisemeyer on the 22124?
When I checked the 22124 in the store, the fence was very difficult to slide but not sure if cleaning and waxing the surface it slides on would have made a difference.
All comments will be appreciated.
Thanks
Whit
Very, very close cousins. Both are supported by the same folks. When you call the Steel City number it is the same person who answers the phone when you call the Orion number. Many parts are interchangeable according to the folks at tech support.
Both have cabinet mounted trunnions, snap out splitter/guards, same switch, motor, etc., etc. I have heard the SC fence is a 'better-than-Bies' but I have no personal experience except with the Bies. I am told SC machines the fence faces after assembly to provide faces that are flatter and more assured of a 90* to the table (I have had no trouble with the Bies).
As far as the C-man unit you looked at in the store, the ones I have seen are horribly assembled. My fence slides very easily (none of the ones I've seen at Sears did) although it is quite heavy steel. There are some owners of both here (I have the 22124). I'm sure they will chime in.
You can often get the 22124 on sale / craftsman club / holiday special, etc. which I don't believe will happen with SCTW although they do $100 rebates and such. For example I got my saw way below list with free shipping and the two year warranty during a memorial or labor day sale). The miter gauge is about as good as any 'included' gauge I've seen but I never put mine together as I already had an Incra. The included Lietz combo blade is very nice.
SCTW has a five year warranty which is good for peace of mind depending on whether they send someone out or you have to ship. Sears is a 1 year in home with a longer period that can be purchased ($60 for 2 years, I think. Its been awhile).
I was in the store a couple of weeks ago (Woodworker's) and was playing with the fences on all of the cabinet saws they had displayed - PM, Jet, Delta, Woodtek, and SCTW. The fence on the Steel City saw was about 100% better than the next best one, which was Delta with a Bies. It moved - glided - down the rail and locked in just where it needed to be. Even the Bies had to be tweaked a little to get it to where it should be. Check out the warranty on the Craftsman. The Steel City machines all have 5-year warranties, and those guys are serious about their customer service.
Yes, SCTW is manufacturing machines for other labels, but they are in their own manufacturing facility in mainland China. They built their own plant rather than go into one of the cookie-cutter plants so they could have control over the QA of their machines.
If you're looking for a serious saw for serious work, buy the Steel City. You will NOT regret it.
No, we don't have a Steel City saw - yet. If the Unisaw ever needs replacing, it will be with a SC saw.
Nancy (91 days)
I haven't had a close up inspection of that SC, but the guts look identical from a glance, and if you look at the parts list, many of the numbers are identical. SC owns Orion, so it's very likely they're very similar. SC claims that they've beefed up the trunnions for the 3hp model and use those trunnions on all their 1-3/4 hybrids too. The fences are not identical, and SC offers two versions. I'd guess that these two saws come from the same place.
The 5 yr warranty and $900 price tag are pretty attractive if you've decided against something like a Griz 1023.
FWIW, I've been very happy with the 22124. I slid the rails 10" to the right for 40" capacity, and have added a router table. A good blade and good alignment do wonders for cutting thick wood. The Biese glides pretty nicely once adjusted and waxed. I adjusted the trunnions when I got it, and haven't touched them in 2-1/2 years.
Here's a look at the guts of these two saws:
SC:
Attachment 72344
22124:
Attachment 72345
Hi, I just finished assembly of my 22124. My fence slides just fine out of the box. The only thing that I have done to the table is to clean it and put on a light coat of Boeshield. I havent waxed it yet. About three weeks ago one could have had the 22124 for about $800 with club discount. I had purcahsed mine a few weeks before and was able to get a one price readjustment unfortunately that was a week before the saw dropped another $100.
My only complaint is with the craftsman club. I had called to get my number. I got it and was asked if I wanted a replacement card. I said yes. I got it and it said member since 2004. Well this is the first time I ever got the card. Plus I havent gotten any of the club advertisments either. Does anyone get them in the mail or can you only see them online. If I would have gotten mine in the mail I would have been able to save the other $100.:confused:
My CC membership has had problems for the last year. Despite repeated calls informing them that I no longer get the sale annoucments and their assurance that everything is fixed; I still get doodly-squat.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay Radke
Got my CC card after about 6 months of waiting. Got one flyer early this year. One. Thats it.Quote:
Originally Posted by glenn bradley
Sears can be rather inept at seemingly simple things. :rolleyes: You get what you pay for in employees and training policies! But the good news is that it occasionally works in our favor! Sometimes the online discounts exceed the advertised discount with no rhyme nor reason. :D I've seen similar errors on Amazon too.
Example 1: Labor Day 2006 - 20% off all Craftsman tools for $400 purchases ( or something to that effect)...the Rikon made 22400 12" BS was on sale for $280, I added the Bosch made 1617 router kit to the order to qualify for 20%. A 30% discount was ringing up at checkout. I ordered the saw for store pickup, sold the router for my cost, and got the BS for $190. :)
Example 2: A month or so ago, Sears was offering 10% Family and Friends discount on top of the Craftsman Club discounts. Their Ryobi made 19.2V Drill & Impact Driver kit with one hour charger and two batteries was on sale for Club members for $100 (regular price $150...) ....I was expecting it ~ $90....it rang up at $73.39! :) It's no Makita, but it sure suits my needs (and budget!).
My 22124 for $594 had some irrational logic applied too. ;)
So be patient, take names, talk to more than one manager if necessary...there are some pretty good deals to be had!
Whit, sorry for the tangent but at least you get a free "bump" out of it!
Thanks to all who responded to my questions. Guess I will just wait for the best deal.
Whit
Morning Whit...Quote:
Originally Posted by Whit Whitfield
Steel City owns and operates Orion which Mark Strahler. president and CEO of Steel City helped found. He played a big part in the design of the Sear's zip-code saw. The zip-code and the SC hybrid are basically the same saw.. but the SC hybrid carries a little tigher machine tolerances on the table and guts.
I have a Uni-saw with a Biesemeyer fence. The Biesemeyer is an excellent fence and I personally felt it was the best on the market. Well.. until I checked out the Steel City Industrial fence at the IWF show last fall in Atlanta.
If you push on the SC fence... you best rush to the end of the rail or it could end up in the next county before it stops. The design is excellent and it's one "slick" operator.
Sarge..
one issue to consider is customer service, in case you ever need an in-home repair on your saw. i can't comment on SC, but i have had experience with sears. i bought the craftsman sander station several years ago along with a 3 yr extended warranty. a pulley failed after 2 years. sears came out to fix the machine and this was the beginning of a 10 mo "homerian" odessey to get it fixed, including 5 visits by 4 different repairmen, at least 20 phone calls, and about 15 hours of my time calling and waiting for repairmen that showed or didn't show. their warranty service was absolutely the most dysfunctional customer service unit i have ever dealt with. based on this experience, i will not buy another sears tool again unless it is small enough to be carried back to sears for servicing.
Since we are Sears bashing I couldn't resist....
When my current nightmare ends, I might post the whole story in off-topic. The short version is on Sept 3rd I took advantage of a great sale on Gladiator garage cabinets and so far I have nothing except a worthless credit card after Sears "accidentally" charged the same (wrong amount) 13 times, a phone log with over 20 calls to Sears, half a dozen calls to my CC company, flat out (documented) lies from Sears, and numerous trips to the store. I have spent probably a full day or more so far on this, and I am no closer to a resolution than I was two weeks ago.
I will give this warning, buy your stuff in the store if you are gonna buy something from them. I have been told by everyone I talked to at Sears that this is a bug in their system that they cannot find, and that it happens all the time. The girl I spoke to on Friday said she had just been talking to someone who got charged 26 times.
Its 8 o'clock, time for my morning ritual (call Sears).
I've seen both of these machines listed on the Steel City web site
and the specs look very close to me. What is the difference?
I see that one distributor is selling the 35601 for $799 after rebate.
Hello,
I've had my craftsman 22124 for three years and love it. No problems at all to speak of. I got it for $799 on sale. But the Steel city version has a couple new options the CM doesn't. A granite top! It was introduced earlier this year at the Vegas WW show. They say the advantages are no rust, and a more consistently flat surface vs. cast iron. Unless you use magnetic accessories this may be of interest to you. If I remember correctly, the granite top did not add much more to the price. The other option that may be offered in the near future, if not already, is a real riving knife and a better, safer guard. These are supposed to be required as standard equipment on future table saws by all manufacturers but some have started to unclude them already (Take a look at the new Bosch TS). Other than those things and the fence there's probably not much difference between the Steel City and it's Orion -built precursor. By the way, they are also offering granite surface as an option on the bandsaw and the fences of the jointers.
As for my biese' fence, It works great. It's adjusted so I can slide it easily, but not too easily. I prefer to bump it for micro adjustments. To help it slide easier I've found that regular paste wax works better than other products like Boeshield. It seems to leave a slicker surface. I've also had rust spots form while using boeshield while I haven't had any using paste wax. So now, I regularly wax and buff all of my surfaces and wood jigs. That's what works for me. The Steel City fence may be better in some respects but why would anyone have a problem with a bomb-proof commercial grade Biesemeyer fence?