Home- made bora care & timbor

I think my last post re Bora-Care fell under the radar, so here it is again, with the additional formula for Timbor as well. If you store wood outdoors, these formulas are life-savers, and making it at home saves BIG bucks.

Mods, maybe you could make this post a sticky?

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TYPICAL CHOICES FOR PREVENTING / KILLING PPB’s, TERMITES, ETC:

Pyrethroids: They are very effective at killing the pests, but they are more dangerous to mammals (lethal to cats), Also phyretroids are not good at preventing reinfestation, since they completely break down within 4 months. Additionally, it is extremely dangerous to mill lumber that has been treated with pesticides. (And illegal to sell lumber or furniture treated with the stuff, without written disclosure.)

Diatomaceous Earth: Not proven to be effective, and very dangerous to breath / mill.
It also dulls tools when milling. Just a bad idea, all around.

Heat: If you can kiln-dry or in some other way heat your lumber to over 130 degrees F (probably 150 F or hotter is best) for a period of at least several hours, you will kill all bugs & larvae. However, This is pretty hard to do with an existing stack. Additionally, your lumber can still get re-infested with new PPB’s.

Timbor: A powder which you mix with water. It is inexpensive, but only useful for prevention, not for killing existing PPB larvae or termite infestation.. Also, Timbor can leave a white powdery residue. This residue can be washed off, but it’s extra work. Worse, this residue can sometimes appear even after your piece is finished:

Because Timbor does not contain glycol, after some months the tiny salt crystals often resurface on the wood, looking like a white powder, and they are visible under the clear topcoat. Not that nice.

This residue can be washed off, but it’s extra work.
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* Bora Care:
Bora Care penetrates the wood deeper and faster than Timbor, and typically penetrates completely through. Additionally, without glycol after some months you will have the tiny salt crystals resurface on the wood, and they are visible under the clear topcoat. Not that nice. - So Bora Care is the stuff to use on raw wood.

Boracare is even better when sprayed on green wood, because borates love water and therefore will spread into the wood faster and more evenly when the wood has high moisture content.

Boracare does NOT interfere with later glue-ups of finishing, though sometimes (only if you over-apply it) you may get a white powder that can simply be washed off with water.

Once applied, Boracare continues to work FOREVER.

USE ON FINISHED WOOD:
Glycol penetrates rapidly through all paint, varnish, and oil finishes (except epoxy and polyurethanes) without lifting or damaging those finishes in any way. You can treat all of the wood without removing any finish.
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HOW TO APPLY BORA-CARE :

Boracare can be sprayed or brushed on.

Itmust be diluted 50 / 50 with water, just before application.
## After diluting it, you must use it within 24 hrs !!!!

You must coat EVERY bit of exposed surface on your lumber.

Boracare needs to remain liquid as long as possible, so as to get deep into the lumber. Therefore, it’s best to apply it when ambient temperatures are not extremely high.

note: Wetting dry wood before applying BoraCare is not recommended.

Once the bare wood becomes dry to the touch, it can be finished or glued.
It typically dries clear, however if over-applied it can leave a white borate residue on the surface. This can simply be washed off with water and the surface allowed to dry. Unlike Timbor, Bora-Care rarely deposits any residue after the first day or so, due to the binding power of the glycol.

Once applied, Boracare lasts FOREVER. You never have to re-apply it.
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COVERAGE:

You will be making the same solution that they sell online. Both must be diluted 50 / 50 with water, just before application.

1 gallon of pre-diluted Bora Care will treat 800 BF.

( One gallon becomes 2 gallons before spraying, still covering 800 BF.)
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HOW TO MAKE BORA-CARE :

Bora Care is a 40% solution of sodium octaborate in ethylene glycol; 27% borate content. You can easily make your own:

All percentages are by weight.
60% borax - 40% boric acid (by weight) gives the maximum solubility of borates in water.

A gallon of glycol weighs 9.3 lbs (confirmed) so that means:

1 gallon glycol (9.3 lbs) + 3.72 lbs Borax, + 2.48 lbs boric acid.

However, an internet formula has it different: (Possibly because some bound water in the borax gets boiled off) THAT formula says:
1 gallon glycol, 4.5 lbs Borax, 3.5 lbs boric acid.
see: http://alsnetbiz.com/homeimprovement/homemade.html


To make a stable solution you mix the ingredients and heat till boiling gently.
Boil off water until a candy thermometer shows 260°F.
This removes most of the water of crystallization in the borax.

WARNING: If you use ethilene for a glycol do not breath the fumes as you boil the mixture !!!
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This solution has a borate content of 26%. It is stable at 40°F
Again, this is the same solution that they sell online. It must be diluted 50 / 50 with water, just before application.
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COST:

note: “Borax” is boric acid salts. Just buy “20 Mule team Borax” at the supermarket.

Boric acid costs about $4/lb. online. / $3/ lb in 25 lb buckets.
(sometimes boric acid roach poison, 99% boric acid, is cheaper)

Ethilene Glycol costs ~$100 + shipping for 5 gallons. = $20 + / gallon
Borax costs 54 cents/ lb. 3.72 lbs = ~ $2
Boric Acid costs $3 - $4 / lbs, depending on quantity. = $9 - $12
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TOTAL COST FOR 1 GALLON: $31 - $34, + shipping.

- OK, maybe with the powder added, it will equal a LITTLE more, but you re also boiling off some bound water in the Borax, so it will probably be close to a gallon.

Again, this covers ~ 800 BF, once diluted with water.

COST PER BF: About 4 cents.
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WHAT GLYCOL TO USE?

I DO NOT recommend using antifreeze for glycols. It contains antioxidants that will retard the absorption of the mixture & take MANY days to dry.

Try to get pure Ethilene Glycol or Polietilene Glycol or Propilene Glycol for cheap.


Ethilene glycol is not that bad as you will read on the internet UNLESS YOU EAT IT OR DRINK IT. The other two - Propilene and Polietilene - they are used also in the food industry, so they are safe. Also, since ethilene is a boicide it will add to the borates to control the pests, be it insects or mold & mildew.


So, ethilene is the more effective glycol to use on INFESTED wood.

WARNING: If you use ethelene for a glycol do not breath the fumes as you boil the mixture !!!

BUY Ethilene Glycol HERE:

http://www.dynalene.com/br-Ethylene-Glycol-Dynalene-EG-5-Gal-buy-online-p/dy-eg-4.htm
5 gallons for $100 - It probably weighs about 35 lbs.
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IS GLYCOL SAFE?

Glycol's toxicity to humans is low enough that it has to be deliberately ingested (about a half cup for a 150 lb. human); many millions of gallons are used annually with few precautions and without incident. It should not be left where children or pets can get at it, as smaller doses would harm them, and they may be attracted by its reported sweet taste that I have confirmed by accident. The lethal dose of borates is smaller than of glycol, but the bitter taste makes accidental consumption less likely.

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HOW TO MAKE TIMBOR :

Tim-Bor®: Solid sodium octaborate; dissolves in water to make approx. a 10% solution containing 6.6% borate. (B2O3) It's basically the same as Bora Care, but without the glycol. The real stuff costs about $3/lb. plus shipping.

Home-Brew Water Solution of Borates:

All percentages for this recipe are by weight.
(60% borax-40% boric acid gives the maximum solubility of borates in water)

65% water, 20%borax, 15% boric acid

Borax costs 54 cents/lb. (supermarket),
boric acid costs about $4/lb. in drug stores (sometimes boric acid roach poison, 99% boric acid, is cheaper in discount stores);

total cost ~ 30 cents/lb.

To make this solution mix the required quantities and heat until dissolved.
The boric acid, in particular, dissolves slowly.

This solution is stable (no crystals) overnight in a refrigerator (40°F.), so can be applied at temperatures at least that low.

I've seen it, and do appreciate it. I use a lot of Boracare, but clients probably wouldn't break even paying me to make it versus buying it.

Good info!

does this work to prevent other insects beside ppb?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by David Hawxhurst

does this work to prevent other insects beside ppb?

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It's hard to find much data on this. (If you do, please post it here.)

Borate solutions definitely kill PPBs, ants, termites, carpenter bees, and roaches, so it's likely that it kills anything with an exoskeleton. What I've read is that they don't even have to ingest it, just come in contact with it.

One big unknown is Ash borers. One study tested Timbor, but not Bora Care. It found Timbor fairly useless against borers, but that's probably because Timbor can't penetrate bark very well. (I am guessing now.) Glycol-based Bora Care penetrates hardwood much better than Timbor, so maybe can also get through bark. I dunno. Someone should test this.

It has also been suggested to mix in some sugar, which evidently entices borers to eat the stuff. This is not necessary with PPB's.

Thank You,
I will be making this in the future. I have a 100 year old farm house I need to protect.

I want to thanks the mods for making this a sticky!

Hopefully we can add more information & ideas as they become available.

You've typed ethelene, ethilene and ethylene. Which is it?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Todd Burch

You've typed ethelene, ethilene and ethylene. Which is it?

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Ethylene glycol.

Some folks use Propylene Glycol instead, because it's completely non-toxic. However, it also doean't penetrate as well. Ethylene Glycol is toxic, but as long as your are reasonably cautious there's no danger. Plus, it bio-degrades very quickly into harmless components, so it won't poison your ground water.

NOTE:

I've submitted a revised set of documents about all this to the powers-that-be. It explains a few things more clearly, and also has some important updates which I added after recently making my second batch of Bora Care.

Hopefully, they can find the time soon to re-do this thread with that new info. In the meantime, if anyone has specific questions, feel free to ask here.

How about it mods… Let's see the new updates! I need to make some bora care.

Thanks, Todd

I am building a new tractor shed 20x 45 it will be made of ruff cut red oak and hickory do you have any suggestions on what I can spray on it before I put on the roofing that would be a long term ?

Allan,

What is it that you would like done? I can easily just make THIS thread a sticky. Does that work or do you need a way to constantly update/modify your post without rewriting it every time? As you might be aware, there is a time limit in which a non-Admin/Mod (i.e. you) can edit a post. I believe it is 24 hours. As a Mod, I can edit any post any time. Let me know. Post in here or PM me or whatever. Happy to help!

:)

just came across a product called solubor made by 20 mule team. it has 20.5% boron and is 98% disodium octaborate tetrahydrate. from the msds it is exactly the same as timbor. the msds for timbor dose not list the % of boron. i ca get solubor for $75/50# localy. anyone heard of it or tried it?

Could you post a way to measure the boric acid and borax with a measuring cup? Don't have a scale that will measure accurately. Also, cooking up the mixture, do you just heat till it reaches the temperature listed, or does it have to boil for a certain amount of time?

Hello folks,
I have followed the instructions to make the product that uses Boric Acid , Borax, And propylene glycol.
The glycol was a bit syrupy....and I didn't expect that. the resultant product was also syrupy....But that is the way it is.
i added water (50%) as suggested and sprayed it on a beam that needed some dry rot control. I drilled holes in the beam and squirted the liquid in.
I waited for the stuff to dry and now I need to fill the holes with sawdust mixed with carpenter's glue. Then I am ready to paint when that is dried and sanded level.
But I have noticed the termite/borer/ wood rot liquid has dried a clear film over the previously painted beam and is shiny.
I wonder if painting over it will be a problem down the road. Should a person beware of anything? Any experience with this from any users? Allan Speers???
thanks just send me an email when you have time...I don't always get around to checking all the forums I am registered with.
my email is raelph5@gmail.com
Raelph

Since I am online this morning, I thought I would give an update one year on. So far the repair job has been positive. Paint over shiny area has held. Filler in the holes has shown no outward problems. Wouldn't know anything had every been wrong with the timber. But I must admit it was quite a bit of work making the product, drillng holes, application, putting in the filler, sanding the excess , and priming painting....but one would have heaps of other work to do to try and make it right if one had tried replacing the timber....and all the possible unexpected problems which might arise.
So pretty happy with the product made and project finished. Propylene glycol was pretty expensive where I purchased it , but prices are getting better.... and much cheaper than buying Boracare from USA and having to pay for shipping of that product. Borax and Boric acid added expenses that are much higher here in Australia (no 20 Mule Team here)...still cheaper than buying from USA (haven't seen Boracare available in Australia)
.....All in all a good experience.

Does anyone have an opinion on using Zerex Original Green Antifreeze for the glycol in order to reduce environmental impact. I give my shavings to a friend for composting.

I am interested in using regular antifreeze as it is a good bit cheaper and will not require shipping. Does anyone know what percent ethylene glycol it is and if any of the other ingredients are typically going to cause any health risk after fully dried. I added a little antifreeze to my timbor mixture and the boards still seem a little damp 4 days later. I do not see the typical powder reside either. As long as they eventually dry I would think drying slowly would allow for better penetration. Also what about using used antifreeze from a shop. my mechanic said he is glad to supply me. Sure it will be half and Half, but if I heat it and then add the timbor/solubor would it really be such a problem. I mixed a little antifreeze with my timbor that was made with hot tapwater and it seemed to stay mixed together just fine. I did not see any powder settling out even days later

Thanks

Talked to my local COOP, and they could get solubor. Ordered a 50 lb bag, and they put it in my truck a while back. Was told to put a pound in a gallon of water, and either roll or spray it on both faces and all edges, ends. The ethylene glycol is to slow the drying to make it sink in a bit better, but not necessary. Also was told to boil the water to make the powder stay suspended.

Hi Allan & Everyone.

I know this is a bit of an older post and I thought I would chime in. Allan is it possible to send your updated info? I know it has been a while but it seems that your updates never made it. I have done some further research on Bora-Care (BC) (see here https://patents.google.com/patent/US5645828A) and it seems that this is what they are using:
60% Glycol - comprised of 48% Ethylene Glycol by weight & 12% PEG 200 (polyethylene glycol) by weight
40% DOT (Disodium Octaborate Tetrahydrate)
While Borax, Boric Acid and DOT are all Borates it seems that DOT is the one Nisus uses in BC because of its better solubility and because it also has the highest concentration of borate(?) Sorry I am not a chemist so I apologize if this is incorrect. So it is not to say that using a mixture of Borax and Boric Acid will not work it just appears that BC prefers DOT as it is the most versatile.
They do heat the mixtures and also filter before bottling the final concentrate.
I believe they add a small amount of PEG 200 to help act as a carrier for the DOT to penetrate deeply into the wood.

I thought I would add this in the hopes that it may help. I am horrible at math! and am wondering if anyone out there could confirm the amounts by weight I would need to make this version of the formula. In other words to make 1 gallon of this Brew how much Ethylene, PEG 200 and DOT do I need to mix?

Thanks Everyone!

William

PS - I have added some paragraphs that I have copied from the Patent that Nisus wrote up about BC. It is a long read so I thought by clipping some of the more important bits may help others to come to their own conclusions.


https://patents.google.com/patent/US5645828A

https://www.researchgate.net/publica...ood_structures

In a particularly preferred embodiment in accordance with this aspect of the present invention, the aforementioned at least one short chain polyalkylene glycol is polyethylene glycol and is present in an amount of between about 4% and about 23% by weight; the aforementioned at least one short chain alkylene glycol is ethylene glycol and is present in amount of between about 27% and about 76% by weight and the aforementioned glycol soluble boron containing compound is disodium octaborate tetrahydrate and is present in an amount of between about 20% and about 50% by weight. In a more preferred embodiment in accordance with this aspect of the present invention, the polyethylene glycol has an average molecular weight of about 200 and is present in an amount of between about 8% and 15% by weight and more preferably between about 10% and 13% by weight. The ethylene glycol is present in an amount of between about 35% and about 62% and more preferably between about 45% and about 54% by weight. The disodium octaborate tetrahydrate is present in an amount of between about 30% and 50% by weight and more preferably between about 36% and about 45% by weight.

In accordance with another more preferred embodiment of this aspect of the present invention there is provided a solution including polyethylene glycol in an amount of about 11.9% by weight, ethylene glycol in an amount of about 47.5% by weight, disodium octaborate tetrahydrate is present in an amount of 40.6% by weight and water which is present in an amount up to about 10 times the volume of the combination of the other three ingredients.

In a most preferred embodiment in accordance with this aspect of the present invention there is provided a composition including polyethylene glycol in an amount of about 11.9% by weight, ethylene glycol in an amount of about 47.5% by weight and disodium octaborate tetrahydrate in an amount of about 40.6% by weight.

It has been unexpectedly found that the addition of water in a substantial amount to the compositions of the present invention including the glycol soluble boron containing compound, and a mixed glycol solution including at least one short chain polyalkylene glycol and at least one short chain alkylene glycol actually facilitates the deep, complete, and rapid penetration of the boron active ingredient into the treated wood (substrate). This is particularly unexpected in view of the teachings of, for example, Bechgaard which discloses a preferred composition of 40% active ingredient (disodium octaborate tetrahydrate) dissolved in 60% ethylene glycol. According to Bechgaard, the presence of water in combination with the aforementioned composition may be a necessary evil for reducing the viscosity of the resulting composition to allow it to be easily applied to tree derived products.

Polyethylene glycols and polyethylene glycols having an average molecular weight of about 200 are preferred over polypropylene glycols, polybutylene glycols and glycols having a higher molecular weight because of their generally lower relative viscosity and their general solubility in water. For example, E200 polyethylene glycol has an average viscosity of 187 centistokes at 32° F. and 40 centistokes at 77° F., whereas E300 polyethylene glycol has an average molecular weight of 300 and an average viscosity of 343 centistokes at 32° F. and 69 centistokes at 77° F. Furthermore, E200 is the most hygroscopic of the glycol series just described.

It is most preferred that polyethylene glycol having an average molecular weight of about 200 be used exclusively. However, the admixture of certain amounts of other average molecular weight polyethylene glycols and, indeed, other polyalkylene glycols is specifically contemplated. Such mixtures may be particularly useful when a particularly porous wood derived substrate is being treated.

The term "at least one short chain alkylene glycol" is intended to mean an alkylene glycol having a chain length of about 2 to about 4 carbon atoms. These would include, ethylene glycol, propylene glycol and butulene glycol. However, the most preferred compound for use in the present invention is ethylene glycol. Due to the relative volatility of ethylene glycol it may be useful, in accordance with the present invention, to use a mixture of ethylene glycol and one of the other short chain alkylene glycols disclosed herein.

In accordance with the present invention, the preferred glycol soluble boron containing compounds include disodium octaborate tetrahydrate, the potassium, ammonium, and sodium salts of boric acid, boric acid, "borax" and boric oxide and mixtures thereof. The term borax includes compounds having a general formula of Na2 B4 O7 ·x H2 O wherein "x" is a whole number from 0 to 10.

It has been found, however, that a concentration of 500 parts per million (ppm) boron (2400 ppm DOT active) is generally effective for preventing or eradicating a broad spectrum of infestation. This is approximately the amount of boron provided by a solution comprising polyethylene glycol in an amount of about 11.9% by weight ethylene glycol in an amount of about 47.5% by weight and disodium octaborate tetrahydrate present in an amount of 40.6% by weight when diluted 1:1 by volume with water when applied to a 6"×12" board, having a density of about 30 lbs/cu.ft. and a moisture content of about 15%. (Application is to each side of the board, including the ends, until the point of run-off.)

In accordance with the present invention, the at least one short chain alkylene glycol may be provided in an amount of between about 27% and about 76% by weight of the undiluted formulation, and more preferably between about 35% and about 62% by weight thereof. In a more preferred embodiment in accordance with the present invention, the alkylene glycol is present in an amount of about 45% to about 54% by weight of the undiluted formulation and most preferably, the amount of alkylene glycol useful in accordance with the present invention is about 47.5% by weight of the undiluted formulation.

More preferably, the mixed glycols are present in an amount of between about 6.5 and 10 parts per part boron provided as a glycol soluble boron containing composition. In a particularly preferred embodiment in accordance with this aspect of the present invention, the polyalkylene glycol is a polyethylene glycol having an average molecular weight of about 200, the alkylene glycol is ethylene glycol and the amount of boron contained in the composition is about 1 part per 7.12 parts of the mixed glycols and the ratio of the polyethylene glycol to the ethylene glycol is about 1:4. In a preferred embodiment in accordance with the present invention the undiluted composition should include between about 4.0 and 10.5% boron and in a most preferred embodiment, the composition should include about 8.32% boron by weight.

In general, the undiluted formulations of the present invention can be made by both batch and continuous processes. One method of manufacturing the compositions in accordance with the present invention includes the steps of providing an amount of at least one short chain polyalkylene glycol and at least one short chain alkylene glycol and charging these glycols to a sealable vessel; agitating the mixed glycols and, preferably, raising the temperature thereof. The glycol soluble boron containing compound is then added to the vessel under sufficient agitation to break up all lumps such that a homogeneous mixture is formed. The temperature of the mixture is then raised to between approximately 160° and 180° F. with agitation. Finally, the solution is removed from the vessel and filtered.

In a preferred embodiment in accordance with the above described method, the short chain polyalkylene glycol is polyethylene glycol having an average molecular weight of about 200 and is present in an amount of between about 8% and 15% and more preferably 10% and 13% by weight based on the weight of the undiluted composition; that is based on the combined weight of the short chain polyalkylene glycol, short chain alkylene glycol and the glycol soluble boron containing composition. The short chain alkylene glycol is preferably ethylene glycol present in an amount of between about 35% and 62% and more preferably between about 45% and 54% by weight based on the weight of the undiluted composition. The glycol soluble boron containing composition is preferably disodium octaborate tetrahydrate present in an amount of between about 30% and 50% and more preferably in an amount of between about 36% and 45% by weight, based on the weight of the undiluted composition. Furthermore, in accordance with a preferred embodiment of this method, the amount of water provided ranges from between about 0.50 and 5 times the volume of the other three ingredients; namely, the polyethylene glycol, alkylene glycol and glycol soluble boron containing active ingredients and, more preferably between about 1 and 4 times the volume of the other three ingredients.

Therefore, a preferred composition in accordance with the present invention includes between about 6.90% and about 3.05% polyethylene glycol, between about 27.54% and about 12.19% ethylene glycol, between about 23.54% and about 10.40% disodium octaborate tetrahydrate, and between about 42.01% and about 74.35% water by weight based upon the total weight of the composition.

The formulation diluted in accordance with Table I included about 11.9% by weight polyethylene glycol having an average molecular weight of about 200 (PEG 200), ethylene glycol in an amount of about 47.5% by weight (EG), and disodium octaborate tetrahydrate in an amount of about 40.6% by weight (DOT). All weights reflect the undiluted formulation. % EBC is the % of equivalent boron content by weight.

In all of the foregoing, it is particularly advantageous to use a formulation comprising polyalkylene glycol having an average molecular weight of about 200 present in an amount of about 6.90%, ethylene glycol present in an amount of about 27.54%, disodium octaborate tetrahydrate present in an amount of 23.54%, and water present in an amount of about 42.01% by weight, based on the total weight of the composition diluted 1:1 with water. Formulations diluted with 2-4 volumes of water may also be particularly useful.

Can I review something. when applying Bora Care (homemade of course) raw timber is noted.
However, somewhere I seem to have read that Bora Care can penetrate paint. IS THAT TRUE????
THANKS