The new SE Dual Angle Smoother from Bridge City Tool Works.
Not sure I even like it.
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The new SE Dual Angle Smoother from Bridge City Tool Works.
Not sure I even like it.
Attachment 336941
Bridge City makes some of the best tools available. That said, they are as much pieces of art as they are efficient, effective, and fully functional tools.
I am the proud owner of one of their TS-1V2 Try Squares. It sits in my toolbox, I side of the box it came in. I pull it out every once in a while to check the setting of a tool before I carefully wipe it off and play e it back in its box. I live it because it is absolutely positively dead-end, and because I own a beautiful piece of art.
It is a beautiful piece of art.
It isn't practical for using as a shop tool unless you are producing extremely high end work. What happens years from now when it needs a replacement blade?
jtk
BC have a unique take on tools. While they appear complicated, they are also pared down ... minimalistic construction. That is where they become an art form.
One cannot ask questions, such as whether they are value-for-money. Obviously they are not. While they are functional tools, they are also clearly not for everyday use.
I'd own this plane in a heartbeat if I could afford it. I'd use it too. Just not very often.
A similar concept plane has been designed and developed by Quangsheng (factory of the infamous WoodRiver). This is a redesign and rebuild of the Record #043 ...
http://www.workshopheaven.com/tools/...lades-zoom.jpg
This sold by Workshop Heaven (UK), only I believe.
Regards from Perth
Derek
I kind of agree with you on the tote design.
I kind of chuckle when I read the sig line at the bottom of your posts.
What comes to my sometimes warped mind, "If you can divide by fourths, eighths, sixteenths, thirty-secondths, sixtyfourths and convert them back and forth to decimal, you can work with inches."
Certainly the Metric system is so much easier but most Americans are likely still using a yardstick their father gave them.
jtk
That looks like a nice "budget" alternative for folks who can't quite afford a Holtey.
Seriously, not my cup of tea either aesthetically or functionally.
Note that those are rendered (ray-traced) images, not photos - based on that and the wording on the website ("will be produced" etc) it would appear that BCTW is basically doing a Kickstarter for extremely well-heeled tool geeks.
I have to say I don't like this one. It is too skeletal and "cold" looking. I have their scratch awl- bent it the first time I used it just to make a mark for drilling- and their small square, which has very visible glue showing over time. I cannot say I am very impressed with those two tools, especially for the price.
I think it's neat looking and I'd enjoy trying it out. I wonder how many BCT will sell and to whom?
Like others, my feeling is that this is really intended as artwork. I can imagine it being bought by a wealthy collector, someone who focusses on finely-made crafts in various media. Then, when Buffy and Muffy come over for dinner, the owner takes it out of the display case and makes a few shavings to show that "it works". Kind of an expression of industrial design as art work?
You don't need to be wealthy to purchase one, you just need $4222 + shipping.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthre...e-Seattle-area
dont think this is a kickstarter. You can buy one "used" from a creeker right now.
Edit: nevermind the link above is for a different plane. Good pictures of the planes body though, very similar.
I don't think their designer is particularly good. The designs are too extreme. Their block plane is way too "stretched out". All that complicated gizmo mechanism is not necessary. Their weird little brace and bit is just odd looking. Their combo square is a bunch of extreme looking angles.
People never seem to buy their tools to use. Ebay is littered with never used examples.
Yes,their tools are well made,but I can do without the extreme designs.
I think the front knob is totally out of place on this plane. It should have a skeleton form instead.
PLEASE,Barry!!!!! It is already weird enough looking without a skeletal front knob.
But,if anyone wants to buy it AND have a skeletal knob made,I'll do it for ONLY $3000.00!!!!:)
Actually,the existing front knob is the best designed part on the whole shebang. The REAR TOTE is just horrible.
The plane is a fine example of some art student gone BIZARRE. I wonder if the company was started by a wealthy trust fund guy gone bizarro World!!:)
Ha, another answer to the prayers of multi-challenged woodworkers. After all, they do have needs...
Metod
I think we're missing the point.
This is clearly pushing an aesthetic envelope. It's appealing to a particular person, not a broad audience.
It's haute couture, not H and M. It's Marilyn Manson, not Marilyn Monroe.
Ironically, I think at $422, we'd be less out of line with criticisms than at $4222.
They might, however, take a page from Hermes' Birkin bag, and just list the price as 'unavailable'.
We've discussed this before, if memory serves, and it was described as the "Terminator" plane.
In terms of a new and different aesthetic, it's interesting, though doesn't quite appeal to me. I'm far more interested in their JointMaker Pro table saw, but would love to have the occasion to try out all their tools.
One thing I'm surprised isn't advertised is that the skeletal tote affords one the option to make a custom handle in two halves which could then be joined together w/ Chicago screws or rivets --- if they'd include a pair of blanks for that (or sell blanks, or provide a CAD), it would be far more accessible, maybe even almost practical I'd think.
I own one hand plane and that is enough for me. However, I find the design and machining of this tool to be beautiful. If I had money to waste, I would buy one and build it a nice display case.
There is also a bit of continuance of previous design language for woodworking tools --- see the skeletal instances of the STANLEY No. 610 Hand Drill SWEETHEART (there's currently one on Jimbodetools) for a previous example of this sort of thing.
I enjoy original design as I like to see how other people think. I don't have a desire to own an item like this but I would sure like to spend a day with it to observe, touch, and plane some wood. Wish they would rent them as an option to buying them.
I think it is absolutely beautiful. Not practical, very expensive, probably not comfortable to use, but beautiful. They made a shoulder plane some time ago that I thought was the best looking plane I had ever seen.
Beauty is certainly in the eye of the beholder.
Michael
What makes anyone think that that straight stalk of a handle is beautiful,comfortable,or practical?
I agree with Bridger's post above this one.
I agree with your analysis of their market, but I wasn't joking when I said that it was "for folks who can't quite afford a Holtey". It's far from being the most expensive smoother.
Of course the Holtey is usable as a plane. I could swear I once saw something that looked a lot like the BC's tote in a museum exhibit about medieval torture (which is a roundabout way of saying: George is right. The ergonomics look absolutely awful).
I own a few downmarket Bridge City tools, as well as — for one frustrating week so far* — a JointMaker Pro v.2 with Precision Fence System. My first Bridge City purchase was a splurge on their Chopstick Master. I was shopping for a small "apron" plane, and it comes with one (their HP-8 Aluminum mini-block plane with depth skids), and one thing led to another. The Chopstick maker works, and is a lot of fun — a good, and possibly great, way to give some people not just an idea of what "Woodworking" is, but the actual (to me) profound experience of planing wood and the deep pleasure of making a complete, well-made, physical, useful, handheld object.
The HP-8 plane that comes with the Chopstick Master works as well as any top-notch contemporary plane, except that it is not comfortable in the hand (almost everyone who has used mine has mentioned this before I gave any indication that I agreed). Bridge City's aesthetic seems to favor looks over utility, as the Chopstick Master plane exemplifies. The depth skids are useful and worthwhile.
The Chopstick Master sells for c. 360 USD [corrected from 300]. I would argue that this might be high, but is in no way silly, atmospheric, or unreachable. There is nothing collectable about it. It is fundamentally a tool (the kit consists of the plane, an elaborate and ingenious jig, many chopstick blanks, and presentation sleeves for the finished chopsticks). You buy it to make things, and you make things with it.
The just-announced (afaik) SE Dual Angle Smoother is not sold as a tool. I don't doubt that it works well (and I don't doubt that it is uncomfortable in regular use). But the price, and the presentation, clearly indicate that it is not being sold to be used as a plane. A tool that is not used is not a tool — it's just a ... thing. It's not art, as I understand art: it is not intended to convey meaning. It is, we can say, an example of the tool-maker's art — but in that formula "art" means "technique". It is almost purely an object of exchange, nothing more, and nothing less — a "collectible".
To whet this to what I hope is an unmistakable divisor: as much as the SE D-A Smoother exemplifies the tool-maker's art, it even more exemplifies the tool-maker's marketing art — what used to be called "business acumen". The degree to which Bridge City's business model affects their tool design would make a telling story, imho. [This paragraph added.]
Personally, it doesn't interest me as a plane. Aesthetically, I think it has several problems, but I wouldn't discuss the aesthetics of an object from photos, and certainly not from a single photo, and _especially_ not from a computer rendering of a digital file (kudos to Patrick Chase who pointed this out).
Bridge City's 6-inch rule is a joy to use. I recommend it.
*Review being penned.
It makes my hands hurt just looking at it. Hit a knot with it, and that scrawny knob will break.
I'm failing to see WHY their 6" rule is "Unlike any other on the market". Looks just like a PEC rule. Is it the 1/16" grads + the 1/32" grads? The hard chrome is pretty standard also.
No other 6" ruler says "Bridge City Toolworks, Portland, Oregon" on it. By default, their statement is accurate. I could say my Jeep Liberty is "unlike any other on the market" because no other Jeep Liberty has the same combination of sawdust, beach sand, and rust spots as mine.
Since your post is in response to mine, I'd like to point out that the citation is taken from Bridge City's Website and not from my post.
"Unlike any other on the market" seems to be no more than bog-standard copywriting these days. Although I have, regularly use, and happily recommend their 6" rule, I have not compared it to others nor done any kind of market round-up of the genre. The rule is accurate and precise, easy to read, provides a quick ¾" parallel, and has a handy 1/32's scale on the short ends that I often use for setting marking gauges.
Wow. Tough crowd tonight. I applaud the makers and their effort. They have carved out a niche market and for all intensive purposes are succeeding. It shows an exceptional level of skill in manufacture, ingenuity and design - no one can question that. I would suspect you could hardly find a blemish on it. And thank, what ever you believe in, that you live in a part of the world where it's possible to at least be exposed to such freedoms. I would wonder if the plane is all that far off if you compared the ratio of wages to cost as to whether the plane is out of skew with what a Norris (or some other ground breaking plane was) cost 150 or 200 years ago...
At least in my case the reason I'm being harsh isn't because it costs so much - it's because it's obviously impractical.
Holtey planes cost double what the BC one does, and I would never pay that much for a simple fixture that holds a chisel at a fixed angle and adjustable projection, but they're also VERY respectable and usable planes. I don't think you can say that about the BC with its funky ergonomics, and that makes it purely a status symbol.
Here in this forum, I think the apposite question is: What market?
A market for tools?
Or a market for collectibles?
Those markets barely overlap.
The success of a tool is that is adopted by tool-users and/or copied by other tool-makers. I don't see this happening to the Bridge City items such as the SE Dual-Angle Smoother.
The success of a collectible is that it sells well. Note that the plane in question is being produced as a limited edition (a concept taken from fine-art printing, afaik). I do see the limited-edition SE Dual-Angle Smoother selling out its manufacturing run of 50 units:
Quote:
Only 50 of these exquisitely crafted tools wil be made and have a few units remaining. {sic.}
My metric for success is the accounting one - the business is an on going concern
They've been around a long time and plan to continue for a long time so they are a success. Maybe they don't make a lot of money and their market is very narrow, but then again I've never met a well paid furniture maker that makes furniture for all aspects (no one makes furniture for the cheap ikea shopper. You know the one, the shopper that ask why your furniture is more expensive than ikeas) of the market - ever. Met plenty of happy and content woodworkers but not because of the pay.