Shellac

[Mike Conley]

I purchased some shellac at Rockler to experiment with. I have never used shellac before and the salesman at Rockler said it is one of the harder finishes to apply.

Is it really that hard to apply?

What tips can you guys give me?

[Dennis Peacock]

Depends on what you are wanting to use it on.

French Polishing? Yep.....a toughy to learn and do well.
Padding? Not too bad but must be practiced to get good at it.
Brushing? Easy.....keep the brush wet, brush in one direction and you must work quickly to keep a "wet edge" so you won't have lap marks.

I am "learning to like" shellac.....but I have fallen in love with Lacquer.

[jerry cousins]

i've been using shellac for the past year and find that it's really an easy finish to apply (not referring to the french polishing). i use a 1 pound cut. wad up a piece of clean cotton (no wrinkles on the application surface), dampen it with denatured alcohol, put the shellac on it and make long strokes across the piece. kind of like an airplane landing and taking off - long sweeping movement. just keep replenishing the pad with shellac as needed (usually when you feel it dragging). i usually put on about 4 or 5 coats. each previous coat is disolved by the alcohol. but be a bit careful on the edges - it tends to build up. a soft sanding with 320 or 400 between coats helps. shellac is also an easy finish to repair,since the coats melt into each other, but it does not stand up well to water or hard use. for those pieces, i really use the shellac as a sanding sealer and then spray at least 2 coats of lacquer. and finally, a couple of coats of hard wax.

hope this helps

jerry

[Dr. Zack Jennings]

Practice, Practice
Shellac really is a nice finish. I think I read you can put shellac over any other finish and any finish over shellac.

A shellac finish can be built up to a mirror shine. All you need to refinish is steel wool, sythetic wool or a shellac pad and denatured alcohol. If there is any wax on the finish, I'm told, mineral spirits will dissolve it.

Some one recommended a first coat of 50/50....BLO & MS. Some say let this dry, others say no.... just start shellacing. I do this and it helps pop the grain and build the finish. I usually lightly sand the first coat with 220. Others say don't bother. Each coat of shellac disolves and blends out the previous coat. Don't be discouraged if the first few coats aren't looking good.

I can usually pad 2 coats in about 15 min. The first dries fast. Wait 2-3 hours and apply 2 more quick coats. Then go over night.

The Airplane trick: going in straight lines and lifting at the end doesn't work for me on long pieces. Works great on a small piece because you can keep a wet edge. Circles and figure 8's work well for blending. The trick you will learn from experience is: apply the finish very quickly to keep a wet edge. Keep your pad wet and your powder dry. [That's a joke]

Good luck.............. OH, Shellac is an inexpesive and very forgiving.

[Dennis Peacock]

The pro shellac dude would come to the rescue.!!! I'm not so sure about putting shellac over any other finish....but I am sure you can put any other finish on top of shellac.

BTW.....Where did you come up with this <b>Zack the Wack</b> anyway?

[Steve Schoene]

I love shellac. Padding as described is perhaps the easiest to pick up. You can build a little faster with a brush. But not just any old brush. The best brushes are designed for water color. I like the Winsor-Newton 580 series wash brushes. The fiber is Taklon Gold sythetic. Using two pound cut works quite well with this. You work quickly--no brushing back and forth like varnishing. No going back to touch a place you missed--you'll get it next coat. And you can just keep applying coats until you get it the way you want it. Needs very little rubbing out.but rubs out nicely.

And don't sell shellac short for protection. Most, not all of course, things that scratch shellac will scratch poly. But its a snap to fix the shellac, a real pain to fix poly. It won't dissolve before your eyes if you spill a martini on it, though perhaps not best to leave the spill overnight. (But what kind of parties do you have.)

[David Rose]

With fresh shellac the water damage is over rated. Now this is only a 15 month experiment so far, but... I padded a piece of maple about 6" square on all sides and edges. It has been in our shower area of the bathroom waiting for a change of some type. With a fairly decent build (padded very thinly but several coats) after 15 months of getting "dewey" every day, it still looks like new finish. I didn't raise the grain either and it is still down.

I am slow at padding as I use very light applications of 1#+ most of the time. My applicator is usually only as wet "as a puppy's nose" as some writers have said. On the first couple of coats I will go wetter, but then let it get drier as I go. If it starts sticking, mineral oil will stop that pretty well until the build of soft shellac is thick. At that point, allow an hour or so for that application to dry. At the next point that it seems to be building and trying to stick I allow an overnight setup. The advantage I find to the thin (dry) builds is that a very nice finish can be applied with no rubout.

Now if I can just find the right brush... Nylon is horrible and my badger brush is only a little better. I suspect it is mostly technique but I can't brush it yet unless I plan to cut it back. If you do cut it back, give it some time - like a week- to set up. You can cut it a little sooner but even using mineral spirits as a lube with good stearated paper you run some risk of damaging the finish.

Shellac continues to harden for some time. I've learned that even though it feels dry in seconds it is easy to damage for some days if not handled carefully.

One caveat to very thin padding is that it does not hide imperfections in the wood very much. Straight 220 grit marks will fill fine, but cross scratches or slight tearout or depressions will not.

I've only played a little with French polishing, but I thought it was super easy. Lots of work and time but the application was like glass right off the bat.

David

[Dr. Zack Jennings]

I agee with David's Comments

My comments about removing wax with mineral spirits were aimed at refinishing an old shellac surface that has had furniture wax applied, i.e. Johnson's Wax. Jeff Jewitt recommends Naptha for removing wax.........

Jewitt recommends a thin coat of BLO or Tung oil under shellac. Beware of one thing: not all tung oil finishes are tung oil, another debate. I would stick with 50/50 BLO and MS. I do want to explore Tung oil down the road but that's not pertinant to this thread.

The whole debate over waxed/ dewaxed shellac is a different discussion all together. If I remember correctly, spraying lacquer & water based poly should be put over dewaxed shellac. I haven't ever sprayed lacquer.

Shellac can be used as a sealer to prevent splotchy stain on pine but there are products especially made for that. Padding shellac gives a smooth even warm finish with out the possibilty of drips common with brush on finishes. That's a plus for me, a novice woodworker. That's why I like wipe on poly, too.

Caution: I apply finishes with surgical gloves. Be careful to avoid getting finish on your hand and leaving finger prints on the bottom of the piece your working on. DAMHIKT.........

In my limited experience, I have applied "wipe on" oil based poly over Bullseye Amber Shellac with great sucess. Zinsser products are premixed and available in my local paint store. There is a thread on the WC Forum where Michael Dresdner expounds on shellac:

<center>[B]Shellac Discussion on Another Forum (http://www.woodcentral.com/cgi-bin/messages.pl?noframes;read=63976) </center>

<center>More Info on Shellac.net (http://www.shellac.net/why.html) </center>

[Robert Goodwin]

Shellac may not be the easiest to apply, but IMHO it is the easiest finish to fix if you make a mistake. I love shellac. A little practice and you will be very satisfied with the results....


Rob

[Tom Gattiker]

I haven't used it much. However, I have found that the thinner the cut, the easier to apply. 1 pound cut seems pretty idiot proof, at least for this idiot.

[Paul D. May]

Mike,

Shellac is pretty easy once you get the hang of it (practice practice practice). I rareley use anything else anymore unless the surface will be taking a lot of abuse.

Padding/ french polish is 99% of what goes on my finished pieces.

Paul

[Greg Wandless]

Mike,

Checkout Homestead Finishes. They have a product called SHELLAC-WET that really does help the brushing charateristics of shellac. I tried it on my last project and it was a big imorovement .

http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/htdocs/Shellaccatalog.htm

It's at the bottom of the page.

I like shellac a lot. It dries fast so I don't have to woory about dust and you can put a number of coats on in an evening. It also has the depth that I like and it has that tactile appeal.

Try it a couple of times!

Good luck,
Greg

[Steve Schoene]

Be aware that the shellac wet works well, but that if you have used it in your shellac you should NOT put other finishes over it. They may not adhere well at all.

Also, Seal Coat is a dewaxed shellac that does have some additives that also improve flow out, but do not interfer with other top coats. Even waterborne poly could be used over it.