Graduation day: Hand-cut dovetails 101

[Al Navas]

From my blog: (http://sandal-woodsblog.com/2008/12/10/graduation-day-hand-cut-dovetails-101/)

I started my hand-cut dovetail journey this past September. In this post I share my graduation from Hand-Cut Dovetails-101. What a terrific day!

As I have mentioned in those , I have been hand-cutting dovetails every chance I get. I prepared sycamore stock so that it would be at the ready when I have a little (or a lot...) of time to practice. Today I cut dovetails in three little practice boxes, with minimal paring on the pins. Oh - I almost forgot. I made these pins first, a first for me. And it worked great! In addition, I did not mark angles; I learned from Frank Klausz that I can simply start cutting, and lay out the pin pattern by eye.

You can view the entire session given by Klausz right on this blog. Simply; I split the session into three episodes, for easier viewing, and for ease of downloading.

In the following photo you can see some of the boards, ready to go, on the left of the stack of little boxes I made:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-1.png

My purpose in learning to hand-cut dovetails: I must make some tiny drawers for a Krenov cabinet waiting in the wings. The drawers in that cabinet will be quite small. These little boxes are close in size to the drawers that will go in the Krenov-inspired cabinet: : 2-1/2 inches tall, 6 inches wide, and 4 inches deep.

Today I got a little adventuresome, and added walnut to the mix - and skinny pins on the sycamore boards. I was able to get this one done with a bare minimum of paring the pins. I have not planed nor glued these yet:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-2.png

I have also been making even smaller boxes, such as the one below, with one large tail on the side boards:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-3.png

As you may have noticed in the second photo above, I overshot the depth when cutting the tails. The walnut is dark, and I found it difficult stopping at the proper depth - a problem that continues to plague me. So I tried a little chalk on the line, and now the line pops out beautifully:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-4.png

Here is how I went about making the line stand out we well. First, I mark the thickness of the pins boards on the tails boards with something suitable, preferably a marker with a nice, sharp cutting edge:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-5.png

Next, I apply chalk to the line marked earlier:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-6.png

I then wipe off the excess chalk with a shop towel:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-7.png

NOW I can see the line much better - AND I was able to cut to depth much more reliably:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dts-boxes-8.png

Maybe it is time to buy a powdered wig, and wear it in the shop during my sessions cutting dovetails by hand.

As a big bonus, today I also received my dovetail chisels from Blue Spruce Toolworks (http://www.bluesprucetoolworks.com/about/index.htm) - they are terrific! I ordered them from David Jeske at the Woodworking in America conference in Berea a few weeks ago. These helped me pare the pins perfectly, in no time:

http://sandal-woodsblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/hc-dt-bluesprucechisels.png

Thanks, David Jeske!

I have enjoyed this journey. I hope you get a sense that, no matter your age, you, too, can learn to hand-cut dovetails. I am sure you will be able to do it quicker, and better than I have learned. But I am glad I have learned how to do it. However, I know I must continue practicing, so I am ready for that little cabinet waiting in the wings. It is all about muscle memory.

How do you think I did?


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[Ron Brese]

Al,

Most folks only show what they can do after they become accomplished at certain task. It was nice of you to document your learning process. Not only did you learn, we all did along the way with your post. By the way, where you tempted to try Mr. Frid's dovetail hammer trick? (grin)

Thanks again,

Ron

[Mike K Wenzloff]

Wonderful job, Al!

And I had to laugh (while sipping coffee) at "Maybe it is time to buy a powdered wig, and wear it in the shop during my sessions cutting dovetails by hand."

Good tip for everyone on the chalk thing. It does work well.

Take care, Mike

[Al Navas]

Al,

Most folks only show what they can do after they become accomplished at certain task. It was nice of you to document your learning process. Not only did you learn, we all did along the way with your post. By the way, where you tempted to try Mr. Frid's dovetail hammer trick? (grin)

Thanks again,

Ron
Ron,

I was glad to have the opportunity to document it. A member of our Woodworkers Guild was having so much trouble, I decided to show it was possible, even for someone over 60, like myself :D.

I still don't have a dovetail hammer, but will have to get one. Maybe then I would make Frank Klausz proud :cool:. That sure was a funny line during his presentation! I don't know whether planned or not, but he and Roy Underhill were a hoot!!!

In case anyone wonders about this, you can view a video of the Klausz session on my blog (I split the session into 3 episodes). Funny throughout! The "dovetail hammer" trick is used by some folks to make the joint a little tighter than it was actually cut; therefore, it gives the impression of greater skill than the craftsman actually may have... This works best with the softer woods.






Wonderful job, Al!

And I had to laugh (while sipping coffee) at "Maybe it is time to buy a powdered wig, and wear it in the shop during my sessions cutting dovetails by hand."

Good tip for everyone on the chalk thing. It does work well.

Take care, Mike

Thanks, Mike! I hope your keyboard is still working fine. And my eyes are thankful, too... I am sure others have found solutions, but I found this one on my own...:) I don't get to say that very often!


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[Mark Singer]

Al excellent progress! The Blue Spruce chisels are the best dovetail chisels I have found as well.

[Al Navas]

Thanks, Mark! I appreciate your comments a bunch.

I think the new chisels from Blue Spruce Toolworks will really shine when I start my graduate course, Dovetails-202: Half-blind dovetails. David Jeske's timing in getting these to me at this time was absolutely perfect :D .


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[David Keller NC]

Al - Thanks for posting, and for taking the time to post pictures. Some of us are too lazy to do that. :rolleyes: I'm working on a dough bowl cut from a poplar log using a shingling hatchet and an adze ala Roy Underhill, and now have the interior excavated and am working on the outside. When I walked down to the shop this morning, I had a pang of guilt - it sure would've been nice to have pictures of the process, but it's too late now.

FYI - Chris schwarz wrote up a post in his Lost Art Press blog (I think - might be in the Woodworking magazine blog) about using a "pounce bag" to make transfers between tails and pins. He filled an athletic sock with talcum powder, and gave the tail board a couple of whacks with it while balanced on the pin board and voila - a perfect shadow outline of the tails.

Seems this technique might work for you and be a little less effort than the chalk stick - I'd imagine you could just shake the pounce bag over your line, then give the board a couple of wipes with a slightly damp rag.

[Jim Koepke]

Today I cut dovetails in three little practice boxes, with minimal paring on the pins. Oh - I almost forgot. I made these pins first, a first for me. And it worked great! In addition, I did not mark angles; I learned from Frank Klausz that I can simply start cutting, and lay out the pin pattern by eye.

Great post, and great dovetails.

The tails can also be cut first with nothing more than a line to indicate where to stop cutting.

Me thinks the layout thing is just to get everything symmetrical and to make the hand cuts look machine made.

jim

[Al Navas]

Al - Thanks for posting, and for taking the time to post pictures. Some of us are too lazy to do that. :rolleyes: I'm working on a dough bowl cut from a poplar log using a shingling hatchet and an adze ala Roy Underhill, and now have the interior excavated and am working on the outside. When I walked down to the shop this morning, I had a pang of guilt - it sure would've been nice to have pictures of the process, but it's too late now.

FYI - Chris schwarz wrote up a post in his Lost Art Press blog (I think - might be in the Woodworking magazine blog) about using a "pounce bag" to make transfers between tails and pins. He filled an athletic sock with talcum powder, and gave the tail board a couple of whacks with it while balanced on the pin board and voila - a perfect shadow outline of the tails.

Seems this technique might work for you and be a little less effort than the chalk stick - I'd imagine you could just shake the pounce bag over your line, then give the board a couple of wipes with a slightly damp rag.
You are right, Dave. I believe that is the post in which The Schwarz thought he might have to get some stockings... funny! I will try the pounce bag, too. However, the chalk takes only a few seconds, and I am ready to roll. Thanks for the reminder!



Great post, and great dovetails.

The tails can also be cut first with nothing more than a line to indicate where to stop cutting.

Me thinks the layout thing is just to get everything symmetrical and to make the hand cuts look machine made.

jim

Jim,

Thanks! For these, I did cut pins first. And it worked for me! It is amazing how much time I save by not worrying about marking the layout first. Just mark the thickness of the boards, and start cutting pins. Chisel out the tails, transfer the pins to the tail boards, and start cutting...fast! I truly feel as if I wasted time making some tail markers some time back. But it was a good learning experience.


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[Thomas Knighton]

All to often, the new woodworkers see the dovetails that are the results of years of work and begin to dispair that they just don't have the "knack" for woodworking. Let's face it, the videos and articles make it all look so easy, and in theory it generally is. But in practice it's not that simple. So, with that in mind, I want to thank you Al, for doing just this. Documenting the journey to good looking dovetails helps us newer folks understand that ours aren't going to be the match for Frank Klaus the first time we try ;)

Tom
(who needs to find all of your blog posts about your dovetails to save for future reference ;) )

[Al Navas]

Thomas,

I am so glad that you have found my post reassuring, and helpful. And I appreciate you letting others know, too. That was the driving force for me to document the way, as otherwise it would look as if I could just "do it"...

The easiest way to find those posts is to Search by Category on my blog. This is on the right-hand sidebar of my blog, fourth item down from the top.


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[Mark Singer]

Thanks, Mark! I appreciate your comments a bunch.

I think the new chisels from Blue Spruce Toolworks will really shine when I start my graduate course, Dovetails-202: Half-blind dovetails. David Jeske's timing in getting these to me at this time was absolutely perfect :D .


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Al,
In a lot of ways half blinds are easier! Only the outside face shows...Mitered are the most difficult and houndstooth delicate , but not so bad

[Al Navas]

Mark,

Thanks for the reassurance! I am looking forward to the half-blinds as those are my ultimate target for the Krenov cabinet. I will be posting those as I come along, in Dovetails 201: Half-blind :) .


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[Mark Singer]

Mark,

Thanks for the reassurance! I am looking forward to the half-blinds as those are my ultimate target for the Krenov cabinet. I will be posting those as I come along, in Dovetails 201: Half-blind :) .


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I have built a few... Very challenging and every step is important..Just go step by step..

[peter kolb]

Al,I am about to purchase some dovetail chisels; what sizes do you recommend?
I would be using them on small boxes. Thanks for your help Peter

[Jim Koepke]

The chisel sizes should be as wide as the wood and as wide as the dovetails you will be using. Smaller is OK, bigger will not work for pairing between the tails.

For small boxes, 1/4 inch should be fine. If you are using 3/8 wood, then a 3/8 would also be useful.

jim

[Al Navas]

Al,I am about to purchase some dovetail chisels; what sizes do you recommend?
I would be using them on small boxes. Thanks for your help Peter
Peter,

I bought the 1/2-inch, and the 1/4-inch. But at some point I will have to get the 1/8-inch as well, for the skinny pin sockets. But if you are going to be making larger pins, there is no need for the 1/8-inch.

Jim is right, of course :) . I am sure he has cut a LOT more dovetails than I have.


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[Al Navas]

I have built a few... Very challenging and every step is important..Just go step by step..
Mark,

Every time I look at your Krenovian ( :cool: ) cabinet I fall in love with it all over again. It is wonderful! I should start the drawers at some point, as I have clients waiting in line for their own. Those, and some wonderful furniture for a special client, too.

By the way, I will have Klausz's full session video on Advanced Dovetailing on my blog before long. He made the mitered joint as the demo. It is fantastic how easy he makes it look!


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[peter kolb]

Al & Jim Thank you Peter