If you could buy any cordless drill, which would it be?

[Mike Heidrick]

We are going to do a woodworking club cordless drill review tomorrow at lunch (monthly woodworking meeting). I am looking for input on what the forum community would purchase if you could buy any cordless drill and why. Also if you have cordless impact, and cordless screw driver preference please list that as well. Cordless battery models only please and preferably ones available in the US. Rough cost if you know that too.

Mikie

[Rob Sack]

Hilti, hands down. Expensive but powerful, reliable. and very well balanced.

[tim rowledge]

Festool C12

[Randal Stevenson]

You need to decide better criteria then just cordless drill/driver/impact. For the ocassional use, tight areas, or someone like my sister or mom would use, I recommend something like the Bosch/Makita 10.8 or 12 v versions.
Now, since I had budget constraints, knew that Nimh could be rebuilt (as well as nicad), and Lithium were new(ish) at the time, I chose a Panasonic 15.6v for home. Anything more strenuous, and I grab a corded drill personally (concrete work, metal work, etc). If budget hadn't been a constraint, and you could find more rebuilders ready to go, I may have gone either Panasonic Lithium ion dual kit (driver and drill), or Makita, from experience. (Bosch is also good, but harder to find it or batteries locally)
For heavy duty construction type stuff, I would probably go Milwaukee, 24v or greater.

For general woodworking, I am happy with my Panasonc 15.6 for lots of screws. For light/few screws (mostly clamping and glueing projects) I grab the Bosch 10.8 ps 20 and ps 40 (would love the ps30). The Panasonic was under $200 and the Bosch was a Borg $99 deal (ps20 through free rebate).

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Interesting question. Of the people I know around here, I'd say 90% own at least one 18 volt Dewalt. Many own two drills or more though. From my own narrow frame of reference, maybe use the old reliable Dewalt 18 as a baseline?

I'm kind of interested in the Euro drills. Hilti, Festool, etc.

[Stephen Edwards]

I've been using Dewalt for years in all kinds of applications. The next one that I buy will be Grizzly. I've never read a review on their drills.......haven't been able to find one. But, for the money, their guarantee and customer service that has been very good for me and the quality of large tools that I've purchased from them, it's worth a shot at roughly half the price of the better known drills.

My Two Cents........

[Ken Milhinch]

Impact driver - Dewalt 18V
Drill/Driver - Panasonic 15.6V
I own both, along with Metabo, Porter Cable and others, but I am currently considering adding a Milwaukee 18V to the stable.
(I have a shop full of Festool, but I think their drills suck)

[Doug Shepard]

Another Panasonic 15.6V fan

[Todd Crawford]

Milwaukee 18 V for me.....

[Fred Belknap]

I know it's a dirty word but I have a 18volt B&D that works great for me. The chuck comes off and you can then put in quick connect bits and drivers. I have some others but it is my cordless drill that I reach for first. I can get new batteries locally for around $25. If my memory serves me right drill and charger with two batteries were less than $60.

[Bob Slater]

Dewalt 18 volt XRP has taken a pounding and shows no signs of quitting. The batteries don't last all that long though.

[Curt Harms]

I think for typical woodworking tasks and users with smaller hands the Bosch 10.8/12 volt or similar Makita are a good choice. I have the PS40 and the PS20 (Buy one get one free) I wish the PS20 turned about half again faster, turns 400 rpm, 600 rpm+ would be better for drilling pilot holes/countersinking. Someone with larger hands might find this form factor uncomfortable & cramped to use but I find them quite comfortable and powerful enough to drive the typical #6 or $8 screws. 1/4" lags? Don't think so.

HTH


Curt

[Gary Herrmann]

I use my 18v Dewalt a lot, but I'm reaching for my Bosch PS40 and PS20 nearly as much lately. Very light, can get into tight spaces and hold a charge very well.

[Dan Bowman]

For certain jobs, like hanging cabinets, my Bosch PS40 can't be beat. Powerful, light weight, gets into tight corners, and the impact drives hangers into studs like they were butter

[Hank Knight]

Panasonic, hands down. I have Bosch, Panasonic and Makita. The Panasonics win on all fronts, ergonomics, battery life and power. My first Panasonic, an old 12V NiCad I bought 16 or 17 years ago, is still going strong.

Hank

[Larry Edgerton]

Hilti, hands down. Expensive but powerful, reliable. and very well balanced.

I agree with you except for the reliability. I have three of their smaller SB10's that are the perfect cordlesses, but they have cost me a fortune in batterys. I was buying six batterys every year, and Hilti stuff is expensive. This year I bought four Makita lith-ion kits. The Hiltis still work if they had batterys.

I really miss the spindle lock.....

[Don Bullock]

Well, I realize that I'm really going against the flow flow here. This year I bought a Craftsman 9.2 volt set with the drill/driver and right angle drill/driver combo set with two batteries for $99 plus 10% off on the Craftsman Club. I also have the Craftsman 7.2V NiCd Screwdriver that I got on a Craftsman Club deal, but I don't remember the price. The price was right for all three and they work very well. Yes, I'd rather have a Festool or perhaps the Panasonic, however, I easily got the LOML to write a check for these and she wouldn't have been happy with me if I spent more on drills right now.:D

[Bob Johnson2]

Got a 15 -20 year old Makita 9V 6093, use it every day has yet to fail, I have gone thru a few batteries though. Recently bought a Bosch I driver with the swivel head that I like for close quarters.
At work we have the Milwaulkee V28 drill drivers, the 0724-20 or similiar that get beat on pretty hard without fail.

The Makita 9V ($100) is a bit awkward to carry but has plenty of power for around the house without the heavy weight of the V28's ($400). Depends on your $$ and need.

Contrary to most, I prefer the keyed chuck of the Makita over the twist lock. Bits slip on me in the twist lock, guess I'm getting old.

[Mark Grotenhuis]

The Makita 18V impact drivers are hands down best in class. The Makita 18V drill/hammerdrill is very nice however I have had some problems with the keyless chuck staying tight on bits. The fit, balance and operating time is still better than: Dewalt (bulkier, shorter run time), Panasonic (shorter run time, prone to plastic cracking), and Milwaukee (much heavier but runs just as well). I've never used the Hilti, I'm interested to see how that one performs.

For me its a close call between the Milwaukee and the Makita Drill.

[Craig McCormick]

Bosch

azcraig

[John Williamson]

Check the Ridgid line. Lifetime warranty (after registration) that includes the batteries.

[Joe Jensen]

If I could only have one, it would be a Panasonic Driver/Drill, Lion. I am not a fan of using giant 18V drills for everyday use. I actually have multiple, the Bosch 10.8V PS10, PS20, and PS40. Panasonic 15.6V NiMH Drill/Driver, a Panasonic 14.4V NiMH impact driver, and 2 older Bosch Nicad drills. I use the drill or driver that is the lightest, but has the power needed for the job. For driving, 90% of the time the little Bosch is enough. For drilling, none of the Bosch 10.8V spin fast enough.

If I could I'd swap the Panasonic 15.6V for a smaller drill. The newer Lion 14.4V have the same torque and they are smaller.

[Paul Greathouse]

After having the chance to handle most of the major brands and talk to the company reps at a local lumber yard tool show, I would pick the new Milwaukee 18V Lithion drill/driver if buying new. It had the best fit and finish, seemed just as rugged as any of the others and had a charge indicator to let you know how much battery it has left at any given time.

I know when building my pole barn the battery indicator would a have been a lift saver. I used a pair Dewalt 14V XRP's for that job, they worked flawlessly and still do but it was a pain to climb up on the roof to attach sheeting and find out that the battery is dead after screwing a few screws.

For a "driver only" I would pick the Bosch PS20, I bought one last year and it is the handiest driver I have ever used. I originally bought it for attaching drawer slides in tight spots but was so amazed with its power that I now use it for pockethole screws and most anything else that needs driven. Someone else commented that it may be small for someone with large hands. I'm 6'5" and weigh 245lbs so you can imagine how large my hands are. The little Bosch fits perfectly in my hand. I only wish it came in a high rpm version for drilling,

One tool that the OP or anyone else hasn't mentioned is cordless hammer drill. I have a Porter Cable 14.4 hammer drill/driver that is great for drilling small to medium sized holes in concrete.

Also thought I would mention that at the tool show I attended, the Dewalt rep said that in the first quarter of 2009, Dewalt will introduce a Lithion battery for their older drill/drivers. It will be smaller than the original batteries which will be a blessing. I may be using the old XRP's for longer than I had expected, I will have to see what price the batteries and charger go for.

[Brian Kincaid]

I own two drills:
Dewalt 18V XRP drill/hammer with 3 speeds, highest being 2000RPM
Porter Cable 14.4V

I reached for the porter cable 100% of the time when driving screws, etc. until the batteries went south.

Now I really like the Dewalt, especially with the high RPM. The torque adjuster (I don't really know what it's called) is useless for the first speed setting where you need it to not strip out screws. The lowest setting will take the skin off your hands.

So, if I could buy any drill I think I would stay with the DW, plus I use the same batteries for my cordless:
Circular saw (weak)
Sawzalll (good)
Flashlight (good)

[Aaron Berk]

I run Craftsman 20v Lithium Ion and LOVEM!!! My last drill before the craftsman was a Milwaukee 18v hammer/drill with a metal chuck. The Milwaukee was a great deal but when the battery life went out on me I didn't want to spend the big bucks to get a new one. I went corded for awhile and the came across a GREAT deal on a Craftsman drill,cir saw, and light combo. Normally close to $400 I scooped it up for about $80 store return in light used condition. I've since added an impact driver and sawzall into the 20v lithium combonation and would HIGHLY recomned the 20v Craftsman lithium to all my friends. With that being said....... above all else that I've learned in my commercial/private business ..... go Lithium with what ever you chose, you won't regret it. The run times vs charge time on my lith-ion batteries is phenomanal!
Blessed Be
Aaron

[Eric DeSilva]

Right now I've got an older generation Dewalt 14.4V drill, the 18V Makita LiOn drill & impact driver, and the Bosch 10.8V driver & impact driver. I rarely use the DW, but the damn thing just won't die. I should probably donate it to a good cause somewhere, 'cos its just too heavy to reach for.

If I was stuck with *one* only, it would have to be the Makita 18V drill. Drills, screws, holds a charge, battery goes on forever, its light, and its powerful. Mind you, I love my Makita 18V impact driver, but its not nearly as versatile as the drill for obvious reasons. (I'd happily get rid of all the other crap that came packaged with them--the battery sawzall and other stuff, totally underpowered and useless).

That being said, the Makita is not the one in my hands most of the time. For 90% of what I do, the little 10.8V Bosch guys are hard to beat. Uber-light, super handy... I'd have a hard time giving them up too...

[Prashun Patel]

We are going to do a woodworking club cordless drill review tomorrow at lunch (monthly woodworking meeting). I am looking for input on what the forum community would purchase if you could buy any cordless drill and why. Also if you have cordless impact, and cordless screw driver preference please list that as well. Cordless battery models only please and preferably ones available in the US. Rough cost if you know that too.

Mikie


To be honest, you really can't go wrong. There are so many good ones out there, and everyone seems to love their's. I love my Makita Compact 18v LiIon as rabidly as the others love their Dewalts et al.

A more meaningful review of cordless drills would be which ones to AVOID ;)

[Steven DeMars]

18 volt bosch hands down . . .

[Greg Narozniak]

I own four Dewalts 18V drivers(3 Drills and one Impact driver) and I reach for the impact more and more since I got it. In the 8+ years I have had them I have gone through some batteries but the drills just keep on going.

I had looked into getting the batteries rebuilt but I saw that the Orange Borg had the impact driver on sale for $179 with 2 XPS yellow top batteries. I bought that and sold the case and the driver for over $100 and in essence I got two brand new batteries for less than $70. I was happy with that deal.

The other impact driver that I have (The one I actually kept) came with 2 "low Profile" 18v batteries that run pretty good and it makes the unit a lot lighter.

[Jim Becker]

If I had to buy a non-Festool drill/driver, it would likely be Panasonic, although I have been very pleased with my Dewalt 14.4 which is on it's second life with rebuilt batteries. But I love my Festool TDK 12v and would by the C-12 if I ever needed a replacement.

[Charles Shenk]

As a general contractor who uses these drills daily here's my opinion from about 10 years of heavy use. I have owned DeWalts (internal gears break down), Milwakees (not bad but tend to be big and heavy and the batteries are average but the metal chuck gears last forever), and Makitas (the new small 18v ones are pretty good but the batteries have to be charged often.)

The drill to own above all others is the Festool-
1) built the best
2) best batteries by far
3) most power by far
4) best accessories

[David Christopher]

I bought a Dewalt years ago then had someone give me a craftsman 19.2 and (59$) and after I bought the li on batteries ( 159$ 2 batteries and charger) I would never buy a Dewalt again because the batteries suck and they are over priced for what you get

[John Dykes]

Yankee 2100 - 12" swing.

Oh wait... wrong forum.

[Jerry White]

I'm afraid my experience does not include very many brands, but I do have a recommendation.

For my needs, I prefer something smaller than the 18 volt size, so I generally go for the 12 volt drill/drivers. I have a Panasonic EY6409 drill/driver and a Panasonic EY7202 impact driver set that I have really enjoyed using. Very good quality tools, great power and battery life, and the electronic clutch on the impact driver is a very nice feature. I would readily buy these tools again.

I also have a DeWalt 12 volt drill/driver (batteries rebuilt once) that has have given good service, except for the original battery quality. I would look for something a bit better before I would buy this one again.

I think I would like to investigate the Bosch 10.8 volt drill/drivers for use when a smaller tool would be handy.

[Vic Damone]

HILTI.

After spending time and money on replacing batteries on the more common brand drills Hilti's repolarizing charger (or what ever it's called) can repair what some term as battery memory. After many years of ownership I'm still using the original batteries.

A drills ability to start smoothly from a dead stop to very slow speed, a good chuck, overall quality, and a second battery when the competition was only offering one, short charging time, made the extra cost of the Hilti a sensible choice.

I've since purchased their driver with the same satisfaction.

[Eric Schniewind]

For general household/remodeling needs and hobbyist uses, I find my 14.4V DeWalt has sufficient power. For heavy duty drilling, which seems to be infrequent just grab a corded drill. Wait a minute, I don't have one anymore....see how infrequent?

What I hate about DeWalt is that the battery clips, at least on mine, are a friggen' pain. I have learned how to wrestle it out each time, but each time I feel like I have surely busted the plastic flanges. Poor design. I don't know if they've improved it over the last 8 years since I bought it, but I hope so. I wouldn't buy it again.

Although when one of my batteries died, I opted to send it out to be rebuilt for $47 rather than buy a whole new drill. Reuse, refurbish, recycle.

I once used a friend's Bosch 24V cordless a few years ago. The thing weighed a ton and seemed to be doing all my 14 V could do.

My contractor friend just bought Ryobi's. Cheap and good enough. He'd replace them after a few years of hard work but that's probably when the batteries would crap out.

[Heather Thompson]

Also thought I would mention that at the tool show I attended, the Dewalt rep said that in the first quarter of 2009, Dewalt will introduce a Lithion battery for their older drill/drivers. It will be smaller than the original batteries which will be a blessing. I may be using the old XRP's for longer than I had expected, I will have to see what price the batteries and charger go for.

Saw this post and thought that the tool gods had looked down on me and smiled, called Dewalt to find out not in my case (18 Volt +), I have a 12v drill that kills batteries in a very short time. The factory rep that I talked to was very rude, dismissed me as a dumb female, DeWalt will never see another penny of my tool money. :mad: If this was not a family site I would express myself in a more colorful fashion.

Heather

[Per Swenson]

I hold the belief that cordless drills and drivers and there faults and merits are subjective.
In shorter words, the abuse you subject them to.
And I abuse them.
I have personal tools and company tools.
No one, not even old geezer Bob has permission to use either
the Festool TDK or the Hilti driver.
Hunter and Bob get to use the Makita's.
This year has been quite slow. Prior to the economic downturn,
the useful service life of the Makita's running 8 hours a day 6 days a week
is 6 to 8 months, including the constant drops from ladders and scaffolding.
And folk's that's pretty dang good.
If I may offend the Panasonic Fans for a moment, there is a rumor
floating around amongst the hard core that Panasonic is resting on their
Laurels. Hearsay? Of course. But when a company focuses on advertising and marketing rather then research and development, what you get is last years drill that resembles a overpriced track shoe.

Per

[Ray Schafer]

From previous posts, I understand that the term "Lifetime Warranty" for Ridgid is not what you expect. I have not confirmed it for myself, but in a previous thread, the statement was made that it is a warranty for the "expected lifetime of the tool or part."

[Juan Lauchu]

I have the older T model of the Festool drills and it is a great drill. But I can hardly wait to get this new Lithium Ion drill that is coming out. I use those eccentric and 90degree chucks ALL the time and can't imagine doing much with out them. They have been so incredibly handy. So... my vote is for the new to be released (due out in March) Festool T12!
(They also have a T15 coming as well).
Happy Holidays!
Juan

[Peter Quinn]

Makita 14.4V 1/2" drill and 14.4V impact driver. Both great tools. I don't care to drag around an 18V for most things, just overkill, and makita makes a comfortable powerful cordless drill.

In the 'Pocket class', I've bought and returned several from Bosch, Rigid and Milwaukee. I finally got a Metabo 7.4V pocket driver installers kit, cost around $200 (nearly as much as my full sized drill driver combo kit), best pocket driver period. Powerful, sensitive clutch, very comfortable, nice accessories including a drill chuck and a right angle chuck as well as a great set of driver bits. From hardware installation to jig building, this thing lives in my tool box at work now and gets used constantly. Maybe too pricey for the casual user but a must consider for pros and avid tool junkies.

[Hank Knight]

If I may offend the Panasonic Fans for a moment, there is a rumor floating around amongst the hard core that Panasonic is resting on theirLaurels. Hearsay? Of course. But when a company focuses on advertising and marketing rather then research and development, what you get is last years drill that resembles a overpriced track shoe.
Per


Per,

I'm one of the Panasonic fans; and I hate to admit it, but I think you're right. For years Panasonic's claims to fame were the small form factor of their drill/drivers and their battery technology. This year, Bosch, Makita and others have come out with really tiny, powerful 10.5 V drill/drivers and impact tools. I just bought a Makita combo set (drill/driver and impact tool) and I think I'm really going to like them, if I can get over the built in runout on the drill/driver. They seem to have plenty of power for my workshop applications, but probably not for heavy-duty construction work. I would have thought Panasonic would have been on top of this new product trend, but I got tired of waiting. Maybe they'll wake up. I still think their stuff is top drawer.

Hank

[John Thompson]

Makita 10.8 V palm impact driver and Makita 18 V... both Lithium...

Sarge..

[Mike Heidrick]

We had a great turn out at the meeting today. The biggest comments came on the Makita impact and the Bosch 10.8 PS20 driver and PS40 impactor. A lot of talk about teh quality of rebuilt batteries and Many in the group said they had great luck with having interstate battery rebuild them.

Thanks for all the input. It was very handy and I passed on a lot of your (all the forums) comments to my club. Thanks again.

[Kelly C. Hanna]

Already bought it....got the Makita 3.0 AH LXT set with a cordless impact, drill, sawzall and flashlite. Best set I have ever used and I doubt I'll ever part with it.

While there may be a better set somewhere, there won't be for the deal I got off Amazon last month....$332 to the door! I bought two extra batteries on closeout from HD's and I am now good to go.

[Eric Roberge]

I know that some don't like the Ridgid, but mine has held up great. Not sure about the validity of the warranty, but Best drill I've had next to my Porter Cable. My PC lasted 10 years on the original batteries. My 7year old still uses it to this day.
Anyway, the Ridgid has held up well over the past 2+ years.

[Matt Schell]

I have been very happy with my older model dewalt 14.4xrp, when one of the batteries totally died on me I bought a floor model 14.4xrp kit with drill charger and two batteries for 100 bucks (cheaper than buying two batteries)

I was surprised to see that my older dewalt is more compact, ligher and feels much more solid than the brand new one, plus the old jacobs chuck feels much better the dewalt in house made chuck on the new one.

Long story short I grad the old drill with the new batteries and the shiny new one usually stays in its case.

PS The old one sounds much better also

[Paul Greathouse]

Saw this post and thought that the tool gods had looked down on me and smiled, called Dewalt to find out not in my case (18 Volt +), I have a 12v drill that kills batteries in a very short time. The factory rep that I talked to was very rude, dismissed me as a dumb female, DeWalt will never see another penny of my tool money. :mad: If this was not a family site I would express myself in a more colorful fashion.

Heather

Sorry about that Heather, the guy I talked to didn't specify what volts would be available. I took it to mean it would be all sizes.

[Wayne Cannon]

Lots of votes for the DeWalt 18v. Personally, I prefer the smaller and lighter 14.4 v drill or impact driver -- it still has all the moxie I've ever needed, without the extra weight.

If you going for the Lithium Ion batteries, though, I would probably go for the 18v, since they're even lighter than the 14.4 v.

[Jeffrey M Jones]

I certainly realize that there are a lot of Dewalt fans out there. As an aircraft mechanic in the Corps I have been using different government and contractor supplied industrial and commercial tools for years. Though the Corps is the bastard child when it comes to defense dollars, we actually got really high end tools. Primarily we used Dewalt but there were other power cordless drills we got ahold of... snapon, bosch, makita, and ryobi junk. I have to say that after using dewalt so much that I cannot think of a drill made by a company that I hate more. I hate Dewalt drills and drivers. I would rather use the other junk we had. After having loads of experience with different drills my favorite drills are milwaukees. I have the p.plus 14.4 and an 18 volt driver-hammer-impact. If my house caught on fire, I would be sure to run into the garage to grab them. The batteries are reversible, they are ergonomic, well balanced, and they take the NiCad it comes with or the new L-ion fits right on. The charger charges both lion and nicad and 14.4 and 18 so you only need 1 charger for everything. If you have never picked one up go feel it and youll notice that it feels solid. I cannot say enough about them they are awesome tools. I think a 14 volt will run ya about 160 and the 18 about 220.

[Paul Steiner]

Dewalt 18v hands down. Plenty of power good balance. However I do like to use it in conjunction with a my 18v impact driver. Lastly Dewalt is common and has many tool choices. I can go too any big box store and get a battery or another tool that runs on the same battery. I know that I will use the same battery system for a long time and I will not have to change my entire collection because the batteries change. There are many drills out there that you can no longer get batteries for, dewalt will not be one of them.

[Kevin Groenke]

Primarily we used Dewalt but there were other power cordless drills we got ahold of... snapon, bosch, makita, and ryobi junk. I have to say that after using dewalt so much that I cannot think of a drill made by a company that I hate more. I hate Dewalt drills and drivers. I would rather use the other junk we had.

+1 big time

Anybody who prefers DeWalt must have never used a Festool, Bosch, Makita, Panasonic, Milwaukee, Metabo or Hilti, they're all light years ahead ergonomically. The only worse are Ryobi and Hitachi.


My go to's:

Drill/Driver - Panasonic 15.6 NiMh
Compact - Makita 10.8v

Haven't needed to try the new LiIon.

[Mike Hoyt]

I have a Milwaukee 18v Li-ion for tougher jobs and even then at only 4 lb you could use it all day long. Charges in 25 min and enough torque to drive 5 inch lags no problem. For smaller jobs and just screw driving I am using Milwaukee's 12 volt Li-ion driver. What a great tool that is, since I picked that up I find myself reaching for that time and time again.

[Per Swenson]

+1 big time

Anybody who prefers DeWalt must have never used a Festool, Bosch, Makita, Panasonic, Milwaukee, Metabo or Hilti, they're all light years ahead ergonomically. The only worse are Ryobi and Hitachi.


My go to's:

Drill/Driver - Panasonic 15.6 NiMh
Compact - Makita 10.8v

Haven't needed to try the new LiIon.


I must confess.
My loathing for Dewalt tools in general does not stem from poor ergonomics.
weight or even job site bragging rights. Lets face it a tool is a tool. Heck I'll McGyver it, as the object is to put food on the table.
No. My animosity towards Dewalt stems from the color yellow.
You see they focus grouped yellow and found that this was the color
that wives and significant others most approved of.
In other words for the hobbyist and homeowner, want to avoid a argument at home?
Buy the yellow one.
I don't find that fair. It smacks of misogynistic subliminal advertising.
I do not begrudge any one from making a buck, after all this is still America.
But Folks, you would not be reading SMC if you didn't have more then a passing interest in quality tools. Quality comes from research, development,
and the exploration of new technologies. Not from the advertising budget.
Any one wanna buy this soap box?

Per

[Kirk Poore]

I've been very happy with my 18v L-I Milwaukee compact. I think it was about $160 or so at HD. Charges fast, lots of use out of a charge, charge remaining light on each battery, chuck seems pretty good, etc. The full size 18v was much more, and this was going to be a step up power wise from what I'd been using, so I took the less expensive option and still got a significant improvement.

Kirk