Small Box Bottom....ways to attach?

[Jeff Mohr]

Okay...so this is sort of a newbie question...

I've been making some dovetailed small boxes and box joint boxes and I'm getting a little frustrated with the bottoms. I've been using a 1/8 or 1/4 dado cut and putting in the bottom that way. My problem is I've been cutting the dado all the way to the end and that leaves a little 1/8 or 1/4 hole on one side that needs to be plugged. I know there is a better way then coming back and plugging the little holes....but not sure what it would be.

Is a stop dado/double blind dado my best option? What is the easiest way to perform such a maneuver? Any tips/links/books would be great!

I know there are other ways to attach the bottom so I'm game for some other options as well. So far another option I've used was to put in little risers on the inside bottom and then rest the bottom on those. That works, but isn't the prettiest sometimes. Plus...not a fan of cutting the risers. I supposed I could just attach the bottom to the bottom but I really don't want is showing and I know that is not a good way if any weight will be applied if the box gets a little big to a tool chest size or something like that.

Remember...we were all beginners once....and I know this is a rather easy problem but I am hoping someone can help. I can do the dovetails...that's worth something, eh?

[Dewey Torres]

Jeff,
Never knock yourself for asking newbie questions. You are right on two accounts:

1) Yes we all were newbies (I still am a newbie to everyone who has more experience than me so I will likely always be a newbie).

2) A stopped dado is what you need only do it with your router vs your table saw preferably on a router table by carefully lowering the work over the spinning bit and sliding it each way where it meets stop blocks on each side. If you do not have a router table you can get similar results with a plunge router and an edge guide.

Once complete you may have to square the ends with a chisel or maybe it if fits perfect you will not:

http://www.workbenchmagazine.com/main/wb296-stopdado01.html

The above video will show you. Watch the whole thing.

http://www.newwoodworker.com/stopdado.html

Another link for an alternate way.

[Michael McCoy]

I picked up the box slotting bits at Lee Valley last year and they have easily become my favorite bits. You just set the bits for the desired inset, clamp the box frame together, and take it to the router table.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&cat=1,46168,46176&p=47818

[Tom Veatch]

...box slotting bits at Lee Valley last year and they have easily become my favorite bits...

Michael,

How do you handle the corners? Since the bits leave a radiused end in the slot, do you chisel the slots square or knock the corners off the box/drawer bottom panel?

I'm building some small drawers for a minature chest using 1/4" thick material. I've been looking at those bits and wondering if you'd care to comment from your experience how well you think they would work for material that thin?

[Brent Ring]

I picked up the box slotting bits at Lee Valley last year and they have easily become my favorite bits. You just set the bits for the desired inset, clamp the box frame together, and take it to the router table.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&cat=1,46168,46176&p=47818

I just built 15 serving trays and had the same problem, plugging holes. I will be purchasing one of these when I batch thru some more again. Great Idea.

Has there been any problem as you come to corners with the bit catching and throwing the piece around at all?

[Jeff Craven]

My solution was to miter the last dovetail:
http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/8209/img8242xa7.jpg

This is the finished bottom:
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5408/IMG_0083.jpg

[Michael McCoy]

I just built 15 serving trays and had the same problem, plugging holes. I will be purchasing one of these when I batch thru some more again. Great Idea.

Has there been any problem as you come to corners with the bit catching and throwing the piece around at all?

I've lost track of how many small boxes I've made and have yet to run across any problems.

As for the corners, I round them off slightly on the disk sander so it's fast.

[Lee Schierer]

I agree with Dewey do this on your router not your TS. If you do use the TS for cutting a blind cut, never lower work onto a moving blade, it is extremely dangerous. Instead raise the blade up into the work and make sure the work is locked in place with a stop block behind it.

Making the slots slightly longer than needed on each end, but not so long that they cut through the ends of the stock will take care of the round end of the slot.

[Jeff Mohr]

Thank you for all the suggestions and thank you for that link to those bits from Lee Valley. Just might have to get me a few of those!

[eric auer]

Or use this http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=57678&cat=1,41182

Make a mark with a chisel where you need to stop, Plow away, clean up.

[Mike Henderson]

Michael,

How do you handle the corners? Since the bits leave a radiused end in the slot, do you chisel the slots square or knock the corners off the box/drawer bottom panel?

I'm building some small drawers for a minature chest using 1/4" thick material. I've been looking at those bits and wondering if you'd care to comment from your experience how well you think they would work for material that thin?
I agree with Michael - that's the easiest way to make a groove to put a bottom in. I just take a narrow chisel and square the corners after I cut the groove on the router.

I might point out that Michael's technique is especially good for a dovetailed box. When you make the dovetails, one side may "slip" up or down compared to the other side just because of the way you make your dovetails. When you assemble the box (not glue it, just put it together) before you cut the groove, the groove comes out perfect. If you were to cut a groove in each piece separately, what would you reference to? Almost always, the groove won't line up when you put the box together. But with Michael's technique, you're guaranteed perfect alignment of the grooves. You just have to "square" the corners.

If you're using 1/4" stock, your groove can't be more than 1/8" deep.

Mike

[PS: some people like to round the corners of the bottom. I don't like that because you can go too far and have a hole in the corner. It only takes a minute to square the corners.]

[dan lemkin]

Yeah,

Thanks for all the great suggestions. I don't have a router table/shaper yet, but ordered the lee valley bit 1/4" and will give it a spin... That looks perfect.

Thanks a lot for the info/advice.

I was going to wait until I got my new sawstop contractor saw and add a router base/lift to the 36" table... (again saving space)

Any recommendations on doing or not doing this? Affordable lift kits you like?
I was going to get a dedicated router body to put in the lift - if you have recommendations on this as well.

Thanks
dan

[Porter Bassett]

If you're just looking for something to get the job done, bolt your router to a piece of MDF, turn it upside down, and you've got a quick-n-dirty router table that works.

[Cary Swoveland]

Jeff,

As you referred to yourself as a newbie, it may be worth reminding you that, if the bottom is solid wood, you can't glue it in place. The cross-grain dimension will change with the humidity, but the lengths of the sides will not. You could put a dab of glue in the middle of each end (so a line joining them is parallel to the grain). That will keep the bottom from moving, maybe from rattling.

Cary

[al ladd]

For production work, use a slot cutter with router held horizontal, making a little "tablesaw" with a 1.875" blade. They're available in any kerf size you want --best for small boxes is 3/32. For dovetails you can stop the cuts very close to the ends where needed safely and quickly. Then round the bottom over near ends as needed. Sand two sides of the bottom a little thinner to handle any misalignment issues. Works for me! As on, for instance, this: http://www.alladd.com/koa_and_ebony_dovetailed_jewelry_box.htm

[Jeff Mohr]

Again...thanks for the comments. As soon as Jan rolls around I'm in the shop again and going to test some of this out!

[glenn bradley]

I use a stopped dado on the router table. I have an 1/8" spiral bit for smaller boxes which I use a delicate touch on and have never broken. My 'usual' bottom for small boxes is 1/4" BB ply rabbeted to make an 1/8" tongue all the way around to fit in the dado.

Kinda like: