Boneheaded Auction Buys

[Robert Strebler]

Anyone ever make a boneheaded auction purchase?

I just did. I purchased an 18" belt sander from a company that specializes in scratch and dent/customer returns. I figured it would be something that the previous owner couldn't adjust properly or just returned. Boy was I wrong.

When I got it home I found that it was pretty torn up. Both rollers were heavily used and worn because the previous owner had run it improperly adjusted, the feed belt, and the onboard tools were missing, some parts were bent as it looks like it had been tipped over at one point. Anyway, my new belt sander, the Craftsman version of the Grizzly g0458 and the Palmgren 18/36 ended up needing a bunch of parts. $150 in ordered parts later, if they are all it needs, I'll have a belt sander. We'll see if it even runs properly after adding the right parts. I could have bought one new for $850 with a full warranty.

My new rule on heavy equipment is that I won't buy unless I see it in person or have very good pictures.

For this to have been sold at this outlet, someone would have had to run it for a while, beat the hell out of it, and then return it to the store keeping some stuff like the belt. I have no idea how people can be so unethical and sleep at night as that's something I could never do.

$370 for the sander on the auction site. $150 in parts. I'm up to $520 now for a used belt sander that may or may not need even more parts. I could kick myself.

[Eric DeSilva]

Once upon a time, late at night... I bought a 25 year old ex-RAF airfield crash rescue ambulance built on a Land Rover Series II frame off e*Bay by mistake. Figured someone would outbid me 'cos I put in a really low bid. But noooo!

What a monster. Right hand drive... Each of the four tires was different. It had dual gas tanks, one under each of the front seats. You get some weird stares at the gas station opening the driver's door to fill up your ambulance... You get even weirder stares when you have to hand the hose through to the passenger so they can fill up their side. Electronics by Lucas (known by the Brits as "Lucas, Prince of Darkness"), totally ineffective windshield wipers (when they worked at all)... Barely made 55 mph with a tailwind.

Eventually, after a few years and very pointed calls from my neighbors (did I mention it was too tall for the garage?) I gave it away to a guy who did restorations and owned a farm. I'd call that a boneheaded buy.

[Gord Pat]

Thanks Eric , needed a laugh to-day.:)

[Pete Bradley]

Always a good reminder that not all "low priced" machines are really low cost.

Pete

[Tom Godley]

No point in chiming in..... Eric beats mine :)

[Bob Ross]

It could be worse EBAY 230299349527

That plane sells for $7.99 at Harbor Freight

[Chris Padilla]

It could be worse EBAY 230299349527

That plane sells for $7.99 at Harbor Freight

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=97544

Hmmm, one could make good money buying a bunch of these planes to sell to the unwary! :D ;)

[Chris Padilla]

And some more info on this!!

EBAY 230301222369

BTW, this is not a "real" eBay auction but more of a warning about the plane this guy bought (or maybe he didn't buy it...not sure)

[Mike OMelia]

Anyone ever make a boneheaded auction purchase?

I just did. I purchased an 18" belt sander from a company that specializes in scratch and dent/customer returns. I figured it would be something that the previous owner couldn't adjust properly or just returned. Boy was I wrong..

Was this from Liquidation.com?

Mike

[Michael Weber]

Electronics by Lucas (known by the Brits as "Lucas, Prince of Darkness"), totally ineffective windshield wipers (when they worked at all)... Barely made 55 mph with a tailwind.


Bumper sticker on the rear window of a Morris Minor about 1975.
"Do you know why the British drink warm beer?........ They have Lucas refrigerators" ;)

[Robert Strebler]

Was this from Liquidation.com?

Mike

Nope. It was from a seller on the big auction site. They spell out pretty explicitly that they are selling scratch and dent items and returns that may be missing parts or may not work. They haven't tested them so bid according to the risk. I have no one to blame but myself as I took the risk.

[Scott Schwake]

That plane sells for $7.99 at Harbor Freight

Not to hijack, but are those planes any good, for a beginner anyway?

Scott

[Ross Ellis]

I bought a book on the major auction site. It was $9.99 free shipping. I got a msg from the seller with the curious statement that my book would "be delivered by someone I know"?? The book showed up about a week later delivered by amazon. So I jump on their site. $4.99 clearance. I checked out his other auctions. All books that are clearance, marked up $4-5. I guess he sells 4-5 of them then gets on amazon and has Amazon ship them seperately so he neither handles the book nor pays shipping (over $25). A pretty clever way to make some $$ if you ask me.

Now I check other places before I buy anything from the auction site...

[Rick Gifford]

It could be worse EBAY 230299349527

That plane sells for $7.99 at Harbor Freight

Holy crap this one made me laugh! Always best to do your research first lol

[Jake Helmboldt]

Not to hijack, but are those planes any good, for a beginner anyway?

Scott

Even if they are junk they are worth the price for parts if they can be fitted to a #4 or other plane. The tote and knob would cost more than that alone. I'm thinking about getting one and using the Norris style adjuster and parts to make my own plane just for the heck of it. Probably a bunch of backlash, but for less than $10 out the door who cares?

[Pat Germain]

Other than E-Bay, I haven't personally purchased anything at an auction. That's because almost every auction purchase I've seen my friends make was a bad deal. Obviously, there are some good deals at auctions. But I think auction houses are fooling people into believing all auction sales are good deals.

My coworker purchased a Mercury Sable at an auction in the mid-90's. Boy, what a lemon on wheels that was! She went through many repairs to include a tranny rebuild.

My friend here in Colorado bought his daughter a used Nissan at an auction. It was a nice car. When my friend found out the car needed new CV axles, the good deal became a ripoff.

I get the impression auctions with actual good deals aren't open to the general public. They are private affairs attended by retailers and serious collectors. That way, such people don't have to put with riff-raff like me bidding against them and spoiling their profits or collecting.

What really cheeses me off is when I bid on a nice hand tool on E-Bay and, invariably, some antique dealer wins the bid at the last second. There's something fishy going on there. I suspect the antique dealers are using some kind of bot, but I don't know for sure.

When I see the brace and bit I was bidding on for sale on an antique site for $250, it just makes me sick.

[Jake Helmboldt]

Pat, I've found just the opposite. I've seen (and gotten) some killer deals at auctions. I got a Jet lathe NIB from a storage center auction earlier this year. There was an entire shop's worth of machinery that was unused, most of which went for below retail, some way below.

At an auction of an old cabinet maker his 1950s Unisaw went for $150. The 8" Delta jointer for $300. Both were well used but in good condition. Boxes of chisels and hand planes for pennies on the dollar. Deals are out there, but you need to know what to look for, how to find the auctions, and know when to bail from the frenzy.

[Bob Ross]

Not to hijack, but are those planes any good, for a beginner anyway?

Scott

I cannot speak from experience. I went to Harbor Freight to buy a couple and they were out of stock. I was going to list one on ebay for $8.50 BIN and $5 shipping to counter the crook's listing.

They are good enough quality that one of the galoots on another forum contacted Ron Hock to see if he would make irons for it. He said he would if enough folks wanted them.

[David Tiell]

I agree with Jake. Deals are out there. I recently went to an auction and got an Incra 5000 miter gauge and Kreg pocket hole jig for $120 total. I wanted a Leigh D4 24" dovetail jig, but wasn't going to bid against a friend who had already gotten in on the bidding. He got it for $110. An 8' long Legacy machine went for $425. But people were bidding the S2S oak out of sight. It was already surfaced to 3/4", and it was selling for over $4.00 a b/f. You can buy 4/4 rough lumber several places around here for about $2.00 a b/f. You just have to be informed.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Other than E-Bay, I haven't personally purchased anything at an auction. That's because almost every auction purchase I've seen my friends make was a bad deal. Obviously, there are some good deals at auctions. But I think auction houses are fooling people into believing all auction sales are good deals.

My coworker purchased a Mercury Sable at an auction in the mid-90's. Boy, what a lemon on wheels that was! She went through many repairs to include a tranny rebuild.

My friend here in Colorado bought his daughter a used Nissan at an auction. It was a nice car. When my friend found out the car needed new CV axles, the good deal became a ripoff.

I get the impression auctions with actual good deals aren't open to the general public. They are private affairs attended by retailers and serious collectors. That way, such people don't have to put with riff-raff like me bidding against them and spoiling their profits or collecting.

What really cheeses me off is when I bid on a nice hand tool on E-Bay and, invariably, some antique dealer wins the bid at the last second. There's something fishy going on there. I suspect the antique dealers are using some kind of bot, but I don't know for sure.

When I see the brace and bit I was bidding on for sale on an antique site for $250, it just makes me sick.

Pat, it's called sniping, and as far as I know, Ebay has made nearly everyone a sniper. There is a bot to do it, but I think it can be beat by the humans doing it.

As the others said, find the right auction, and you'll win every time. The oposite can also apply though....

[Tom Veatch]

... it's called sniping, and as far as I know, Ebay has made nearly everyone a sniper. ...

I don't think it's eBay, per se, that's created sniping. For those who might not know, sniping is the practice of waiting until the last few seconds of an auction to place a bid. I think it's caused by people acting like eBay is a "face-to-face" auction and only bidding enough to exceed the current high bid. That's what you do at a traditional auction where there's an auctioneer and a bunch of folks standing around bidding. EBay isn't like that.

Sniping would be a useless exercise if eBay bidders would simply enter the maximum amount they are willing to spend for the auction item. A single bid of that amount is all that's needed. But, looking at bidding histories, I've seen single bidders entering numerous bids. If they would simply bid the maximum they are willing to spend, they would never have an auction sniped out from under them at a price below what they were willing to pay. They may not place the high bid, but if not, they can be assured that the high bid will be for more than they are willing to spend.

Ebay could end sniping tomorrow if they restricted each bidder to a single bid. But that's not in their best interest since their fees are based on the final sale price. And the sale price goes higher when people fall victim to the ideas that placing the high bid is somehow "winning" and "Well, gee, I only wanted to spend X for that, but the bid is X+1, so I guess spending X+2 isn't really all that bad and besides, that'll mean I WIN the auction."

IMO, you only "win" if you buy it for a price less than you're willing to spend. If you get induced to spend $1 more than that, then you "lose" even if you do walk home with the object.

[Chuck Saunders]

Ebay's desire like any auction is to get the highest bid possible. Sniping is a result of the auction being a fixed time auction. If they wanted to end sniping, all they would have to do is make the auction end x minutes after the last bid. I don't feel I should have to make my final decision on my first bid.

[Gary Herrmann]

One of the patterns I've seen on ebay is people with relatively low numbers of purchases bidding on, say, a vintage tool. They bid over and over again - each time increasing it by $5. Sometimes two of them will square off against each other and drive the price of a decent tool to ridiculous heights. Whenever I see that pattern, I leave the auction alone, it just isn't worth it to me.

Sniping can be annoying when you lose something in the last 3 seconds. But I'd be lying if I said I'd never done it.

[Scott Donley]

I know that I over paid a few times for lenses when I was doing large format photography.

[Tom Veatch]

Ebay's desire like any auction is to get the highest bid possible. Sniping is a result of the auction being a fixed time auction. If they wanted to end sniping, all they would have to do is make the auction end x minutes after the last bid. I don't feel I should have to make my final decision on my first bid.

Chuck, you are right of course. That's the way an auctioneer handles it; the auction isn't over until everyone quits bidding. And is certainly one way that eBay could handle it. With eBay, unlike a live auction, all (or most) potential bidders aren't present when the auction begins so a flat "X time after the last bid" would be to the buyer's benefit but not to either the seller or eBay so I don't look for that to happen. That could be addressed in the eBay format by "Auction ends at the posted time or X minutes after the last bid, whichever is later." That would more closely approximate a live auction. I suppose the "nibbler" bids could be curtailed by increasing the minimum incremental bids after the posted time has passed. I doubt there's a solution that would satisfy everyone.

I have sniped eBay auctions, but only because of "nibbler bidding". Some I've "won", some I've "lost", either because the high bidder's proxy bid or another sniper's bid was higher than my limit. As far as the final decision is concerned, live auction or eBay, I know my limit before placing the first bid and purposefully avoid getting caught up in the competition to "win" the auction.

[Dave Lehnert]

It could be worse EBAY 230299349527

That plane sells for $7.99 at Harbor Freight

Was there not a post a couple of weeks ago about someone selling a hand plane they thought was over priced and some contacted the seller about such?
Guess we know why people list things at crazy prices. They get it.

[Jake Helmboldt]

I agree with Jake. Deals are out there. I recently went to an auction and got an Incra 5000 miter gauge and Kreg pocket hole jig for $120 total. I wanted a Leigh D4 24" dovetail jig, but wasn't going to bid against a friend who had already gotten in on the bidding. He got it for $110. An 8' long Legacy machine went for $425. But people were bidding the S2S oak out of sight. It was already surfaced to 3/4", and it was selling for over $4.00 a b/f. You can buy 4/4 rough lumber several places around here for about $2.00 a b/f. You just have to be informed.

David, that was the same as what happened at the cabinet maker's auction. The wood was going for obscene prices, as if you can't find good wood any more. Meanwhile the tools were dirt cheap.

[Will Krautkramer]

My worst auction purchase was 400lb of old musty books, equipment catalogs and nudie magazines that the auctioneer bundled with some metal working tools that I wanted because no body wanted to buy the books. Got the tools and books for $1. Even had an elderly gentleman give me a $1 for one of the old playboys so i came out even on money but it took a lot of work moving all the books and getting rid of them. Hard driving 2 hours in a Chevy Malibu with stacks of books sliding every which way. Neighbors look at you funny too when there is a 5 foot stack of old Napa car parts catalogs on your front porch and your in the back yard burning piles of old nudie mags in the fire pit.

I used to know a couple of jerks who for a while were signing up for fake ebay id's and using them to bid up random auctions. I found it hard to believe they could derive as much enjoyment out of it as they did. Seemed rather childish. Hard to stop to as they used computers at school and the local library and set up fake emails and ebay accounts.

[Michael Morgan]

When I first got married I knew a kid who was always a real go getter. He had to be, he lived with his grandparents and both his parents were killed when he was little. Anyway he was always buying and selling whatever he could. He would go to auctions of all sorts and buy huge lots of stuff and try to sell it and make a buck. One time he asked me if I wanted to buy some paper rifle targets, there was 100 in a box and he was asking $6.00 per box, I said sure give me 10 boxes and i would use some and take some to the sportsmans club. I would always buy something off him even if i didn't really need it.

The next day he comes up the driveway in an old buick riv. with three huge long boxes tied to the roof. He said "Here are the first three, I will be back with the rest in a few more trips":rolleyes: The boxes weighed 100 lbs each and the targets were 8' x 8'. It took me years to get rid of them. I used them to start fires burning brush, and would call a couple buddies and say "hey you want a box of real nice military rifle targets?? I will drop a box off for you:D

[Curt Harms]

Ebay's desire like any auction is to get the highest bid possible. Sniping is a result of the auction being a fixed time auction. If they wanted to end sniping, all they would have to do is make the auction end x minutes after the last bid. I don't feel I should have to make my final decision on my first bid.

It has an end time but it will extend that end time if there are last second bids. The auction won't close until the advertised time and there has been no activity for 15 minutes.

Curt

[Harley Reasons]

IMO, you only "win" if you buy it for a price less than you're willing to spend. If you get induced to spend $1 more than that, then you "lose" even if you do walk home with the object.

I use a subscription based program called "Powersnipe". When I see a auction that I'm interested in, I do the research on the item, determine what it's been selling for and then decide what my top dollar bid will be for it. I then log onto Powersnipe and enter the auction number and my top dollar bid. Powersnipe then bids with 7 seconds to go up to my maximun bid. If the winning bid is lower than my maximum price I get the lower price. Also, if there are several similiar items up for auction and I only want one of them, I can set up a group and Powersnipe will keep bidding until I either win one or all of the auctions sell out at a higher than my maximum bid.
The cost is $45. per year, but it is a "set it & forget it" program that works. Seven seconds is used because no one has time to react and get a higher bid registered before the end of the auction. If another bidder is using Powersnipe on the same auction and has the same maximum amount, then the computer takes the date/time stamp of the first bidder to enter the auction

[David Keller NC]

Another one (and I think the original) is "esnipe". The service is free for the first few e-bay auctions, then you pay for "bidding points" that are based on the final sales price of the item. It's pretty cheap, and it's really the only way to win an auction for a hand tool that's highly sought after (like a Norris plane in good shape for example).

Personally, I wish I didn't have to snipe auctions to win them, but in a since, it's a good system, since you simply enter into the system the highest price you're willing to pay (as does everyone else), and the item sells to whomever is willing to pay the most.

[Andy Casiello]

I used esnipe also. Sometimes I'll manually snipe at an auction, but if I need to be away, or at work, I'll use esnipe.

I've had a few REALLY good deals on auctions - both ebay and live auction events. I've also bought a couple of problems however. I bought a Delta 14" 1HP, closed base bandsaw at a great price - $ 225. I hadn't expected to bid on it, so I hadn't looked it over very close. The bids were really low (duh - should have tipped me off). I ended up getting it for $ 225 plus the auction fee ($25). Then when I looked it over picking it up I noticed a huge crack in the table trunnion support. :eek: Thankfully Delta had them in stock, but it was another $ 80 I was expecting to pay. :rolleyes:

I guess these are the opposite of gloats. :D

[Pat Germain]

I use a subscription based program called "Powersnipe". When I see a auction that I'm interested in, I do the research on the item, determine what it's been selling for and then decide what my top dollar bid will be for it. I then log onto Powersnipe and enter the auction number and my top dollar bid. Powersnipe then bids with 7 seconds to go up to my maximun bid. If the winning bid is lower than my maximum price I get the lower price. Also, if there are several similiar items up for auction and I only want one of them, I can set up a group and Powersnipe will keep bidding until I either win one or all of the auctions sell out at a higher than my maximum bid.
The cost is $45. per year, but it is a "set it & forget it" program that works. Seven seconds is used because no one has time to react and get a higher bid registered before the end of the auction. If another bidder is using Powersnipe on the same auction and has the same maximum amount, then the computer takes the date/time stamp of the first bidder to enter the auction

Well, that confirms my suspicions that I've been losing to auto-bots. Don't get me wrong. I'm not saying it's evil to use Powersnipe. Shame on me for not learning about it myself. Obviously, I don't stand a chance against Powersnipe.

I was recently browsing a web site run by a woman who sells old hand tools. Her prices aren't great, but they are reasonable. I think I'll just buy things from her rather than waste my time on E-Bay.

[Tom Veatch]

I don't stand a chance against sniping.

No one will ever be outbid by a sniper unless:


the sniper is willing to pay more than the high bidders maximum proxy bid. In that case it's immaterial whether the bid was sniped or not. Or:
the bidder fails to enter their maximum limit as their proxy bid.
Some folks have the impression that sniping software continues to automatically increase the bid until it surpasses the existing high bid's proxy maximum. That is simply not the case. Nor can I conceive of anyone using software that would do that. I certainly wouldn't turn my bidding over to an agent that had no limit on the maximum bid that could be entered.

Sniping software simply automates the entering of a single proxy bid. The amount of the bid is set by the sniping bidder as the maximum amount the bidder wishes to bid. There is no difference between that bid and any other proxy bid. The only difference is that the sniping bid is entered in the closing moments of the auction.

If your proxy bid is the maximum amount you are willing to pay for the item and the sniping bidder is not willing to pay more than that, then your proxy will outbid the sniper. But, if, for whatever reason, you enter a proxy bid that is less than the maximum you're willing to pay, then it is quite possible for a sniper to outbid you and take the item at a price less than what you would have been willing to pay.

To protect yourself from a sniper simply make the amount of your proxy bid your maximum amount for the item. Then if you're outbid by a sniper, it will be for a price higher than you're willing to pay, and there's no difference between that and being outbid at a live auction.

[Jeff Caskie]

I second everything Tom states above. I used to 'snipe' manually before I ever heard about sniping programs. IMO anybody who puts a bid in before the last few minutes of bidding causes the price to rise for everybody, not the snipers. I feel that when somebody puts a bid in early, it allows many shenanigans to take place, often done by the seller, such as having their 'friends' bid and raise the price etc. Sniping helps to minimize this and keeps the price lower overall. It just automates the process so you don't have to be home during the end of the auction...

[Harley Reasons]

I second everything Tom states above. I used to 'snipe' manually before I ever heard about sniping programs. IMO anybody who puts a bid in before the last few minutes of bidding causes the price to rise for everybody, not the snipers. I feel that when somebody puts a bid in early, it allows many shenanigans to take place, often done by the seller, such as having their 'friends' bid and raise the price etc. Sniping helps to minimize this and keeps the price lower overall. It just automates the process so you don't have to be home during the end of the auction...
I agree that the primary reason to use an auto-bot for bidding is as I said in my previous post, it's a "set it & forget it" event.
If I really, really want something, such as an antique tool, antique tractor manual, etc. I've been known to enter a $250 bid for a $50 item just to ensure that I'm not going to be outbid.
Boils down to your own personal preferences on how you want to bid. I find that Powersnipe suits my preferences and has the features I'm looking for.

[Ben Rafael]

I use sniping software because if I put in my max bid hours or days before the close of an auction all I am doing is allowing the auction price to be bid up. The snipe software puts in my max bid at about 10 seconds before the auction ends.
I sometimes find things I want but do not want to pay much for, sometimes these items have no bidders. I've sniped them for bargain prices. BUT if I were to put in a low bid long before the close of the auction then shenanigans might have ensued and the seller or seller's friends can outbid me.

[skip coyne]

It has an end time but it will extend that end time if there are last second bids. The auction won't close until the advertised time and there has been no activity for 15 minutes.

Curt

are you talking about eBay ?

eBay auctions end at time specified , there is no "15 min activity rule "

I

[Harley Reasons]

are you talking about eBay ?

eBay auctions end at time specified , there is no "15 min activity rule "

I
I agree, I've watched the end of an auction and within a minute or two after the closing I've received an email from Powersnipe telling me I'm either a winner or was outbid.