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Zac Altman
10-12-2008, 12:32 AM
Im looking through all of these photos and I find this:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3071/2675165474_9c1f035e7b_o.jpg

How did they make that front panel? it isnt done on a laser...is it?

Ross Lowry
10-12-2008, 7:40 AM
Possible, it might be plastic?
If you want to cut metal, then I think you need a yag laser.

Duane Parcells
10-12-2008, 8:29 AM
CNC Plasma cutter. Who makes the machine? Looks like Epilog in style.

duane

Scott Shepherd
10-12-2008, 8:32 AM
Looks like 1/8" thick white acrylic to me. Easily done on the laser.

Zac Altman
10-12-2008, 8:34 AM
CNC Plasma cutter. Who makes the machine? Looks like Epilog in style.

duane


It is an Epilog, but with a new frontplate.

Frank Corker
10-12-2008, 8:38 AM
I agree with Steve, it's an Epilog helix with a white plastic front cover.

Duane Parcells
10-12-2008, 9:31 AM
No more mystery.

http://www.etchstar.com/blog/etchstar-now-a-preferred-vendor-of-epilog-laser/

Scott Shepherd
10-12-2008, 10:22 AM
Did anyone else read any of the blog info? Apparently the guy who owns the company is a movie producer or something of that nature and he's secured deals with a lot of the big boys to be the only licensed company that can engrave all sorts of copywritten or trademarked items. On one month of the Blog, there's a short interview with the owner and he explains his idea and his market.

Star Trek, The Simpsons, Boy Scouts, Family Guy, etc. are all things he can legally produce (that we can't).

Very interesting.

Mike Null
10-12-2008, 10:53 AM
Steve

The Boys Scouts license is available but probably not worth the time. They work on the more the merrier the more money idea.

Doug Griffith
10-12-2008, 11:31 AM
Did anyone else read any of the blog info? Apparently the guy who owns the company is a movie producer or something of that nature and he's secured deals with a lot of the big boys to be the only licensed company that can engrave all sorts of copywritten or trademarked items. On one month of the Blog, there's a short interview with the owner and he explains his idea and his market.

Star Trek, The Simpsons, Boy Scouts, Family Guy, etc. are all things he can legally produce (that we can't).

Very interesting.

Seems like a bunch of hype to me. I've had a product line that legally incorporated images from Star Wars, Grateful Dead, Metallica, and many more. Getting the "opportunities" without having to pay exorbitant licensing fees required me to offer something unique to the market. Laser engraving is not unique. As far as exclusivity, that is VERY unlikely.

Cheers,
Doug

http://www.dogcollarlabor.com/smc/IMAGES/gratefuldead_big.jpghttp://www.dogcollarlabor.com/smc/IMAGES/gratefuldead_back.jpg

Here's that interview:
http://www.etchstar.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/etchstar_licensing_book.jpg

Ramon Carrizosa
10-12-2008, 12:06 PM
They work promotional events like movie and music premiers. They get invites to places like Sundance Festival, Cannes Film Festival, etc.. Owner is apparently well connected in the entertainment industry.

martin g. boekers
10-12-2008, 12:53 PM
[QUOTE=Doug Griffith;944129]Seems like a bunch of hype to me. I've had a product line that legally incorporated images from Star Wars, Grateful Dead, Metallica, and many more. Getting the "opportunities" without having to pay exorbitant licensing fees required me to offer something unique to the market. Laser engraving is not unique. As far as exclusivity, that is VERY unlikely.

Cheers,
Doug


Doug, I only have limited experience with licensing rights. MLB and college sports. Each contract seemed to be designed to keep the little guy out.
Take MLB for example if I wanted to sell a photo I shot at a game, first you have to fill out about a half inch high stack of paper work. Then you have to submit what you want to get licensed to see if it is approved. Included in the paperwork you have to have est of sales, set up an funded escrow account that they draw from (they get 25%) then on to how your going to manufacture it and where, how many people work for your shop, finacial records, references on & on. Oh, then if it does hightlight a particular player
you have to go through the Player's Association also!

If they do grant you a license, and approve all your paper work, then your ready to start, say sales are slower than anticipated, so you decide to make the print a little larger or presented framed, your first license doesn't cover that, now you have to start the process all over again.

I'm sure with proper connections some of these issues can be taken care of.
But how many of us have those connections?

I hope you'll share with us how you managed to get rights to produce products. Did you get a contract from the licensing organization?

You mentioned that you had a unique product, what was it? That way we can see what is considered unique.

Copyrights and licensing are there to produce money for the originator, but even more so that they control the marketing of their line's image.

Yes, exclustivity is rare but those rights are available an negotiable.

This has been my experience with commercial products, media usage is entirely different.

Say, If a bar opening in town likes the images I shot and wants to use them as decor (no selling to individuals) in the past I could do that with certain limitations. The images could not imply sponsorship or put that person or image in an unfavorable light. The bar couldn't display only Albert Pujols photos if he wasn't involved in it. That would imply by being enmass that he supports it. There still is much "grey" area out the concerning rights and in this digital age things are changing quickly.

If I was going to test the waters I'd get advice from a lawyer first.

Help us so that we can learn, from you experience.

Thanks,

Marty

Doug Griffith
10-12-2008, 6:32 PM
My product line was MacSkinz. These were digitally imaged, vacuum formed, hard shell skins/cases for iPods and Macintosh computers. They may not seem unique but when they came out (around 2001), they were. In fact, the only similar things on the market to date are vinyl clings/stickers which are cheap by comparison. I made a bad partnership decision that killed the line. Now the form factor has changed to where a vac formed skin wouldn't really work.

Your experience with licensing rights is right on. I ran into the same issues. I looked into college licensing rights, visited top dogs at Universal, email bantered with Marvel, talked with numerous band reps, etc... It is all about the same. Money talks and they need projected numbers.

Getting to the right people was tough. I worked my way up from the bottom. I started out with artists (I was the Art Director for Image Comics for almost 10 years which helped). Each artist had their built in fan base and self-marketed. One artist led to another until I was working with some pretty famous ones (Giger, Robert Williams, Ralph Steadman, Clive Barker, Jeff Soto to name a few). Everyone worked with me on a royalty basis (no licensing fees) at an equal level. This kept it fair.

From there, I got a lot of free ink and phone calls from big players (Lucas Arts included) started coming in. I had some names behind me which proved credibility. My ability to create one-off prototypes and send them to potential clients was a major plus.

One thing I can say is that every time I approached a rep group, association, studio, league, etc... there was so much politics involved that I couldn't finalize a deal. When I got a hold of the actual artist, band or most likely one of their wives, things worked out well.

I guess my suggestion would be to come up with something unique that self markets and can evolve, start at the bottom, be fair, and don't make bad partnership decisions.

Just my 2 cents,
Doug

martin g. boekers
10-12-2008, 11:35 PM
Thanks,
you are so right. There are so many rungs in our marketing ladder it's hard to reach the people that make the decisions.

I know that everyone and their brother or brother in law has this great can't fail idea, but for 99.9% of the time they have heard it all before.

I agree with licensing agents to a point, that they have to filter out the serious investors with the dreamers and that's part of what their application process does. They do miss out though on some potential by filtering out some of us that are serious and do have a product and a plan just because we have to make the decision about whether our time and money is better served else where!

As you say networking early or hit on the artists themselves are definite ways to increase your odds, and like you said pay attention to the wives, or husbands in the background they can be very influential and give you an inside track.

For those who haven't tried to license a national or international product this will help in better understanding the process.

Thanks for your 2cents worth and good luck on your future endeavors,


Marty