New Universal vls4.60 VS. Epilog

[Joseph deCroy]

Hello Everyone,

Looking to purchase my first laser engraver. It will mainly be used for the typical (if there is such a thing) trophy and awards materials.

Based on the research here I've narrowed it down to ULM and Epilog. I attended a seminar sponsored by a local Epilog distributor and Laserbits. they used the 45watt, which I liked but research suggest it's overkill for my applications (unnecessary expense). The Mini 24 35-watt seems to be the best fit considering application needs and machine cost.

However, I recently came across a distributor in Texas (online) running a special on the ULM vls4.60 50-watt for abt. $15.5k. Like the Helix, it's overkill, but the cost is in comparison with the Mini 24.

So, being new to the laser world I need some of your experienced user input, as well from any ULM or Epilog rep.

Putting aside the servo vs. stepper motor debate and the laser tube debate -- what "useful benefits" would you suggest I'd be giving up going with one unit over the other - especially take into consideration this is for a inexperienced user?

Also, how important is "ips"? Epilog states their machines run at 80 ips, but I can't find where ULM states their speed.

I must admit I'm hesitant on the ULM for a couple of reasons. It's been a couple of weeks and I've still not seen the information packet I requested. I re-requested incase there was an error not on their part. And the deal is from an out of state distributor. Epolog was very quick sending out their packet and the distributor is in my area. My hope (wishful thinking) is that if the ULM is a better deal I can find a distributor closer with a similar deal.

My gut tells me I'll end up with the Mini 24, but I'd like to get some of your input before jumping in.

Thanks inadvance,

[Scott Shepherd]

I did a fairly extensive review of the two machines some time back. It's located here :

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=67576&highlight=PLS4.60

I wouldn't base any decisions on how fast a salesman gets you information. You want a machine that does what you want, when you want, and has the service to support it. Whether some saleman you'll probably never talk to again after your check cashes responds quickly enough probably isn't a good measurement on how to select a brand.

Figure out which machine suits your needs best and go for that one.

[John Noell]

"Which one should I buy" is a very common theme here. Bottom line is that there are a great many happy owners for both brands. My 2 cents - more power means you have more options in the future. Unless you are POSITIVE you will NEVER do anything other than what you now plan to do, get the biggest size and greatest power you can afford.

[Mike Mackenzie]

Joseph,

Where are you located?

You can get a download pdf spec sheet on that system from here.

http://www.cemlasers.com/Product-VLS4-60_10_1.aspx

Also the rated speed on these systems is 75 ips if this makes a difference there are only a handful of materials that you can engrave at full speed. And the difference between 75 and 80 is not even a couple of seconds.

The VLS system is a great deal larger bed size,more laser power and very easy to use for less $$.

[Mike Null]

I would not limit my choices to only those two brands without examining the features and software of others.

I would also do some searching on this site for threads relative to these and other brands.

Put resale value into the equation. That may help you justify features that you are not now considering.

[Joseph deCroy]

I did a fairly extensive review of the two machines some time back. It's located here :

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=67576&highlight=PLS4.60



Scott,
An excellent comparison review and that may be an understatement. I had previously read and printed the review, but I didn't know how closely matched the "pls" was with the new "vls".

[Joseph deCroy]

Joseph,

Where are you located?


Mike,

I'm in SoCal, not too far from your office, looks like you're the local rep around here. I'll contact directly you for more info.

[Scott Shepherd]

It's my understanding (and it's not from much more than a few conversations with folks), that the only difference between the VLS and the PLS is the PLS has the control panel LCD on the machine, where as the VLS does not.

Perhaps Mike M. can verify or correct that statement.

[Joseph deCroy]

Also the rated speed on these systems is 75 ips if this makes a difference there are only a handful of materials that you can engrave at full speed. And the difference between 75 and 80 is not even a couple of seconds.



Correct me if my understanding of "ips" is incorrect, but in this case the Epilog would be able to go 5 inches per second faster than the Universal machine, is that correct? Moreover, I would think that on most jobs, due to the limited size of the tables that wouldn't be a major purchasing factor for someone starting out with only a few small jobs like myself. However, I would guess that a business running the machine all day long that could be a purchasing consideration.

Now, if running jobs is done as a percentage of maximum speed and most jobs are not done at full speed then the difference between "ips" ratings between the two machines becomes even less of a determining factor for small jobs (considering wattage is the same on both machines). For instance 20% of 75 is 15-ips and 20% of 80 is 16-ips.

Am I understanding this "ips" term correctly?

[Mike Null]

I think you have a handle on the meaning of ips.

There are machines such as the Trotec Speedy 300 which can raster at 140 ips. But actual raster speed is directly related to power so if a 30 watt machine with a speed of 40 ips can raster a job well at 100% speed and 100%power then you would need 60 watts of power to operate a machine at 80 ips to get the same result.

So, in reality, more power equals more speed. That said, in the business you are planning to enter, any of these machines would perform raster engaving adequately.

[Scott Shepherd]

Exactly, and also know that it takes a certain amount of power to get through the cap sheet on materials. So if you have a 45W machine, it may or may not be possible to get through that cap sheet at 100% speed and get the result you want.

In my case, 5 seconds on a 3 minute job doesn't matter. I don't run my business on seconds. If I ran a production operation, then I'd certainly be on the opposite end of that statement. It all depends on your business and what you plan to do with it.

[Mike Mackenzie]

Joseph,

Both of the above are very accurate answers to IPS question. The only other difference between the PLS and VLS is the laser tube capacity on the VLS you can only put up to a 60 watt laser tube. On the PLS you can put up to a 75 watt on the single tube systems and up to 150 watts on the dual tube systems. The PLS also has 3 different methods of focusing on the VLS only two.

Did you request your literature from the factory? I was checking the data base and did not see you in there and that is probably why you did not get the package yet.

If you PM me your address I will send you the package from here.