Hobbyist Shop Design

[James A. Wolfe]

I've decided (since my wife says I can) to build the stand-alone shop I've been whining about for years. Now that I'm allowed, I need guidance on how big to make it. I need to balance the cost with usability. I don't want to build a gymnasium but I also don't want to spend a large amount of cash and then cry because it's too small. My tools are the average you'd expect in a home workshop and some will likely be upgraded. I don't earn anything from my shop (quite the opposite) so it is strictly for hobby use. Once sized, I'll lay out the interior. I've read a lot of great ideas here but I need a little help deciding how big to go.
Thanx,
Jim

[John Keeton]

My tools are the average you'd expect in a home workshop and some will likely be upgraded. Once sized, I'll lay out the interior.
Jim, the two quotes above should be answered before you plan the size. I built my present shop in preparation for building my home. The size was more a factor of "left over space" from the storage area needed. The building is 24x40, and my shop is 24x24. It is adequate, but has gone through a few changes in the last 4 years.

Since building the shop, I have upgraded my tools, and changed my layout. I wish I had been able to do that in reverse as I think it may have changed my thought process.

I am also just a hobbyist, but in retirement that may change. I would encourage you to give some long range thought to your "ultimate" tool needs, and do some layout ideas with tool placement based on the type of work you do. Someone that works with 10' stock and does large casework pieces may have quite different space requirements than someone that does turning or builds boxes.

[Jim Becker]

My shop is currently 21' x 30' minus a stairway footprint. It's adequate, but doesn't give me the room I'd like to have for a separate finishing area and, perhaps, a dedicated assembly area, even after I move the lumber storage upstairs as I plan to do this fall sometime. If I were allowed to reclaim that last garage bay (and had a place to put the lawn, garden and landscape stuff that is in there) I'd be able to capture what I need. But that's not going to happen as long as Professor Dr. SWMBO is around... ;)

I'd also like a higher ceiling than the existing 8', but again, it's not something I could retrofit.

[Anthony Whitesell]

I'll make some suggestions based on things I wish I had in my basement workshop.

1. Dedicated finishing area and moderately separate finishing prep area (ie., an area to use for sanding that doesn't store a lot of tools and is easy to clean)

2. Ceilings (and light fixtures) high enough to rotate a sheet of plywood in any direction which would make the minimum 9' (4x8 sheet of ply wood is ~9' corner to corner)

3. Layout the tools and work areas then size the building around them. Because I had walls and electric in the basement when I purchased the house, I have re-arranged the layout 5 times and redone the electrical twice (going on a third).

4. Don't forget that ripping, cutting, planing, jointing, etc. a 10 foot long board requires 20 feet of length (10' infeed, 10' outfeed). One thing that I don't often see mentioned in the tool layout is to keep the infeed/outfeed of the tools in the same orientation (east/west or north/south) otherwise the shop will be very large.

[Scott Wigginton]

Think a lot about layout and future tool expansion.

You can work better in a well designed small area than in a poor layout in a large area. I recommend reading A layout kit for small shops (http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/FWNPDFfree/011174022.pdf). A lot of the ideas will work well in a larger shop. It printouts for tool to include infeed/outfeed area all ready for engineering paper (1/4 in = 1 ft scale).

[Don Bullock]

Jim, the two quotes above should be answered before you plan the size. I built my present shop in preparation for building my home. The size was more a factor of "left over space" from the storage area needed. The building is 24x40, and my shop is 24x24. ...

I would encourage you to give some long range thought to your "ultimate" tool needs, and do some layout ideas with tool placement based on the type of work you do. Someone that works with 10' stock and does large casework pieces may have quite different space requirements than someone that does turning or builds boxes.

I didn't realize that the shop/garage I'm having built is the same size that John has. My building will end up with about a 24' x 20' shop and a garage/storage area of the same size. About half of the garage/ storage space will be available for the shop when needed. In a "crunch" the whole building is available for shop projects because there are no interior walls. As with John, the space on my building site along with setback requirements dictated the final building size. My budget also was a big factor in determining the size and how it is being built. http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=93028. What I've noticed already is that the design I did on paper is not going to be the "best" arrangement for the shop. After actually standing in the space I can better visualize where I want things. As has been mentioned, planning for future tools is also a big consideration. A more important thing to consider is whether or not your tools will be mobile. A shop with "stationary tools" and ducting for dust collection will need to be bigger than a shop using the same tools on mobile bases. At this time all of my large tools are mobile as well as my DC. It remains to be seen how well my shop will work for me, but in my case it was the best I could do. I'm sure that I'll wish I had a bigger space and all stationary tools with a central dust collection system, but that was impossible given my space, needs and budget.

[Charles Seehuetter Panama City]

Jim,

Build as big as you can afford to and have the room to build in. You'll never seem to have enough room. As everyone else has said, try to plan your layout as much as you can first. Research and look at other shops as much as you can. You've gotten a lot of good advice here and you'll get more. We built ours this past summer and love it but I wish we would have put in a bathroom.

Here is a link to ours in Florida.

http://picasaweb.google.com/chuckinpc/NewWorkshop#

[Tony Bilello]

"Think a lot about layout and future tool expansion".

In addition to that, a lot depends on what kind of woodworking you intend to do.
Right now I am a hobbyist who will take on a small job from time to time, most boat work. But even as hobbyist I need space to enjoy my No. 2 hobby. I was renting a 12 X 36 Bay 15 feet high. I quickly added on by sharing an adjacent 12 X 36 bay with a friend. This seems to be working out for me. If I were to build, my bare minimum would be 20 X 30 with a garage bay type door where I could unload plywood directly from my truck/van onto my table saw. 10 ft. high would be my minimum, 14 ft would be better.
So, my ideal hobby shop would be 24 X36 X 15. Of course that is not always practical.
Like most things in life, you have to deal with what you got. Too small of a shop gets dusty too fast and too crowded to work in. Constantly moving things around to make a workspace is neither fun nor safe.
I wish you much happiness in whatever you decide.

Tony B

[Art Mulder]

Jim, how big is your current shop? I think that would be a big contributor to what you "need".

I have a basement shop - about 11x25, but I lose a large chunk of one end to storage. Personally, I would be tickled pink if I could get all the non-shop storage out of there. I'd be over the moon to have 15x25.

have fun, post pictures.
...art

[John Keeton]

A more important thing to consider is whether or not your tools will be mobile. A shop with "stationary tools" and ducting for dust collection will need to be bigger than a shop using the same tools on mobile bases.

Don, my DC is stationary, as are my TS and BS. But my planer and jointer are mobile. I have DC drops in the open areas of my shop and I use quick connects when the planer and jointer are in use - usually at the same time, of course. It works out very well as most of the time I have a lot of open area and don't feel cramped. I have a corner of my shop that I roll the tools into when not in use. That same corner has some wall cabinets in it, so the floor area gets double use.

[James A. Wolfe]

Thanks for all the suggestions thus far. Land is not an issue since I live on 15 acres but money will be a big influence. My Best Beloved is pretty accommodating to my hobbies but there is a limit. Looking at the cost between steel, pole barns and stick built has me leaning toward stick built. Ive laid out the first draft in Visio and it looks workable in the 24x48 building. An area 12x24 will be dedicated to storing widgets and wonkles that must be kept so my working shop area should be around 24x36. I plan on 10' ceilings and will use room trusses to gain some additional storage above. I work in my basement now and this will be a huge increase. I mostly build small things like boxes but I'll try my hand at casework in the new shop. I'll be checking out as much stuff as I can on the net and getting bids for the parts of the project I plan on farming out.
Thanx,
Jim

[Jim O'Dell]

You never fully understand an area by looking at it on paper. It just doesn't "live". If you want, take some of the plastic barrier tape you can get at the borgs, and use it with some large nails as stakes to mark out the perimeter. Then mark the tools with the same tape, or cardboard boxes if you have some. It will allow you to walk through an operation and see how it will flow for you. Maybe do several possibles on paper and re-arrange to see how each work. Wouldn't cost much, and the information would be invaluable. Of course, if someone comes over to visit while you're doing it, they may try to get you committed!! :D Jim.

[Don Bullock]

You never fully understand an area by looking at it on paper. It just doesn't "live". If you want, take some of the plastic barrier tape you can get at the borgs, and use it with some large nails as stakes to mark out the perimeter. Then mark the tools with the same tape, or cardboard boxes if you have some. It will allow you to walk through an operation and see how it will flow for you. Maybe do several possibles on paper and re-arrange to see how each work. Wouldn't cost much, and the information would be invaluable. Of course, if someone comes over to visit while you're doing it, they may try to get you committed!! :D Jim.

It's funny Jim, but since my shop is at least up I've thought of the cardboard box idea. I've even considered laying out areas on the floor with tape. While I am very good at visualizing things specially in my mind, nothing beats standing in the real space.

Pictures of shops like those that you and others have posted as well as the ones I've seen on magazines and books really help, but even they don't help as much as seeing a shop in person. I'd love to be able to see some shops as I get ready to set mine up. Unfortunately I just don't have that opportunity right now. As soon as we move I do plan to take advantage of the shop tours offered by the woodworking group in the area I'm moving to. Perhaps that's something that James needs to check into.

[Jim O'Dell]

I agree, Don. For me, I'm especially "visually challenged". Although I followed my drawings pretty much in laying out my shop. But I did sit in it quite a bit while cleaning all the left behind junk, and just try to see what would work. There was an old table the owner used for welding that I used for my table saw. A card table would work too. Especially with a couple of short 2X4s to make up the total width. Tape on the floor to show where my multifunction base cabinets would be, make sure I had space to walk between them and the TS. I did end up moving my DP, and repositioned the BS a little after getting the BS here. I may eventually regret building the router table as big as I did, or at least not integrating it into the TS extension somehow, when and if I ever get a decent sized jointer. I can make them work (will have to share a connection to the cyclone), but will have to move the router table about 10' or so to pull the jointer out to hook it up and have room to run wood down tables.
To the OP, make plans on making all your table heights the same. I reused the welding table that was left here. It was actually just a metal frame. I now use it with a torsion box on top as my outfeed/assembly table. My router table is also the same height as the TS, and works as an infeed table...makes cutting sheet goods down to size manageable by myself. Also the multifunction cabinets along the west wall are the same height, and again allows wood that runs to the left of the blade up to about 3 1/2' something to ride on. But even these things are not perfect. If I'm using my miter sled on the TS, I am limited in length of what I can cut to about 8' at a 45 miter. But my sliding miter saw will fit into the middle of the multifunction cabinets and I have 10' of cabinet on each side, plus windows at both ends. (Now if I would have mounted the windows about 4" lower than I did, I could open them and let wood stick through them, like I planned on. :(:o:o)
So, take your time, quadruple your measurements and verify heights of equipment for anything special you attempt. But mostly take your time. Jim.

[Thomas Canfield]

James,

I would encourage you to build as large as you can and keep in mind the next person. My wife encouraged me to build a nicer shop that I would have done to help with the resale value of the property later. I think it was so that if I "croak", she can sell off my tools and have a nice open air conditioned area for her hobbies. Double pane windows (mine are sliding 6' wide) are nice for light and do not increase the heat/cool load too much. A high ceiling (10') minimum wall allows moving aroung without bumping the ceiling and you can use surface mount 8' flourescent lights (I added protective sleeves to the tubes anyway and lights are 12 to 14'). And one biggie is to put in twice as many outlets as you think you need and put them on multiple circuits so that no 2 together are on the same circuit.

I recently added a battery back-up light in my shop after being caught by a local power failiure in the back of the shop early one morning and having to feel my way out. It will probably never happen again, but the $30 for the light will be worth it if it does.

[Dave Zeigler]

I recently added a battery back-up light in my shop after being caught by a local power failiure in the back of the shop early one morning and having to feel my way out. It will probably never happen again, but the $30 for the light will be worth it if it does.

That is a terrific idea! Thanks for sharing it.

I'm still in the process of finishing the interior of my shop with insulation, OSB, paint and lighting. It is a great time to wire in emergency lighting.

I've been working in my shop into the dark hours, now that the days are rapidly getting shorter. Making the walk from the detached shop to my house is interesting on those moonless nights. The idea of navigating the shop in the dark isn't very appealing.

Sooner or later I will put in some motion sensor exterior lighting to resolve the stumble back to the house. So much to do, so little time and money.

Dave

[Eric DeSilva]

Maybe you can benefit from my experience, which was rather haphazard. I moved into a new house a year ago, and finally got a dedicated shop area--probably 24' x 30' with 9' ceilings. Has two pillars in the middle, so the TS was the only placement that was really dictated. Over the last year, I've acquired a bunch of other "new to me" tools, including a cyclone DC, BS, jointer, planer, shaper, OSS, 12" disk sander, 18/36 belt sander, as well as a bunch of work tables. Since I was returning to the hobby after 25 years, I think its safe to say that I didn't realize all of my equipment needs (OK, *desires*) at the outset, and certainly wasn't in a position at the time to develop a really functional plan for a shop. Sure, I laid things out on paper, but there is a big difference between fitting stuff in and actually working on it. As I have done more and more work in my shop, however, I've gotten a much better handle on my work process, where I want to stand to do certain things, what I need around me, etc.

The net result of my, well, lack of vision, is that I've rearranged my shop countless times. Each time I've gotten it wrong, although each time its been a little less wrong. For a while now, I've been fighting against the fact that I never really finished the shop--several walls are batting nailed to concrete and aren't framed/drywalled. I just ran some 220V lines and bodged together some ducting to get to the machines I had at the time.

Now, I'm about to embark on a major overhaul that will include framing out the walls. Yes, I do have an idea about where I want certain major tools to go, but I'm actually not stressing out about that now. Instead, I've figured out that if you have a good ducting plan for DC and waaaay more outlets (inc. 220V) that you ever think you will need, the rest will fall into place. (I should mention that I did do the lights right at least... its like daylight down there).

So, my advice is not to try too hard to figure out where each piece goes, but rather to develop a layout that gives you light, access to DC, and access to 110V and 220V power from any location you might put a tool. You can plan to the nth degree now, but you probably won't get it all right.

Unless, of course, you are uber-organized, know exactly how you work, and know exactly what you want. In which case you should just ignore me.

[Anthony Smaldone]

Hi James,
I built a stand alone shop 11 yrs. ago. The shop measured 20x20 with 9 ft. ceilings. I put a storage agea above with a staircase leading to it. The storage was a good idea, and I used the area under the stairs for storage and a sharpening station. In the shop I had a combo table saw and shaper, a Lathe, a combo jointer/planer, radial arm saw, and a lumber rack. The DC was up in the storage area and worked fine. After about 3 yrs. I was sorry I didn't go larger. You will find that lumber storage becomes a problem. Project storage is a big issue. If you finnish your work, them you will be spending as much time as I did trying to clean up and cordon off an area to spray.
I'm not saying the space didn't work, it did. It was a lot of work though.
Back then I was a little tite with money and that was the size I decided on. The truck load of lumber and plywood cost me $4,000 give or take.
Probably twice that now.
Good luck with the build...I was fun for me

Anthony

[Anthony Watson]

I've decided (since my wife says I can) to build the stand-alone shop I've been whining about for years.

Congratulations! My first "shop" was an 8'x12' shed that held every tool I owned. Working on practically any project meant pulling the tools out into the yard and building outdoors. Then trying to get everything back in the shed before it rained, including the project I was working on.

I built my new shop back in 2001, which is disguised as a two-car garage. Other than doing repairs, the cars have never spent a night in there. :)

In my case, there were a number of factors to consider when planning the size of my garage shop.

1. What distances do you have to maintain from the property lines and easements?

2. What distance does a standalone building have to be from other buildings (it's 8 feet here, for fire protection reasons).

3. Are there topographical features (hills, valleys, creeks, trees, etc.), or underground utilities (sewer drainfields, wells, etc.) you need to keep a distance from.

4. Are there "access" issues to consider. For instance, I needed to maintain space in front of the garage to turn cars around.

5. Are there height restrictions in your building zone?

These factors alone may govern the size of your shop (unless you own acreage). We have about two acres, but the area I had available for the garage was backed up against a hill, and had to leave room for a house between it and the septic system. This left me with a building area approximately 25'x30' to work with.

Since walls are usually constructed with plywood sheets, keeping the measurements to a 4' multiple will minimize waste and speed construction. So, the final size of my shop is 24'x28', with two 8' garage doors on the short gable end.

Another factor to consider is the construction of the building itself. We wanted to do all the construction ourselves, and I wanted an open space inside without any posts or beams getting in the way. While this would be easy to do with trusses, I also wanted a large usable attic. I was able to span the ceiling with 2x12x24' @ 16" OC. That's about the longest span you can achieve with standard lumber (If you want a wider building, you can use wood I-beams or look into attic-trusses).

With average organization and putting everything on wheels, I have found my 24'x28' shop to be a very workable size. I have 9-1/2' ceilings which allow me to easily flip a plywood sheet or 8' boards end over end.

I can even roll everything to the outside walls and pull two cars in the garage when needed.


I need to balance the cost with usability.

Back in 2001, doing all the work ourselves, it cost us $13,000 to build my 24'x28' garage. We splurged on many items like 2x6 walls, full insulation, insulated garage doors, good lighting, etc. I'm sure we could have easily built it for less than $10K if we had to. Of course, that was seven years ago... :)


I don't want to build a gymnasium but I also don't want to spend a large amount of cash and then cry because it's too small.

Keep in mind the heating and cooling costs if you plan to work out there year round. The bigger the space, the harder it is to heat. I have a 4000 watt electric heater that just barely keeps the shop warm on all but the coldest days. It's really undersized for the space though.

Anthony

[Ray Schafer]

Just make sure that you price in the hot tub and the big screen TV. These are very important for after a long day of woodworking.