Wanting to order a Veneer Press

[Samuel Brooks]

I have a current project that is a 12" x 44" project plus 4 sides that are all smaller then the top and I have been looking a veneer presses.

I think I have found what I am looking for but I am trying to decide between a few options.

Option# 1 (http://www.veneersupplies.com/product_info.php?products_id=704{13}47)
$109.00 pump-tt: Vacuum Pump rebuilt $139.00 - 20.00 discount 3.15 CFM
$109.85 bldskitcont: Project: CRS Continuous Run Pump Kit with Vacuum Clamping for Clamping Kit
$66.50 dmvbg2x4: Dura-Max Vinyl Vacuum Bag 2' x 4'. This is kind of small but form what I have read it will cover some of the most common project sizes.
$65.50 esscombo: 8-Piece Veneering Essential. Some Cold Press Glue veneer saw, tape etc.

$364.40 Plus Shipping.

Option #2 (http://www.veneersupplies.com/product_info.php?cPath=60_64&products_id=1683)

This option would run around the $350 range as well.
Project: V2 Standard Auto-Cycling Venturi System. But I would have to use my Porter Cable 2.6CFM 6-Gal oil-less compressor with this. This is the one that came with the Brad Nailer Combo a few years ago. It is really LOUD :(. Which is why I was interested in the CRS. I know that would be a great time to upgrade my air compressor but I just purchased the Jet 10-20 drum sander :D so the air compressor will have to hit the back burner. :cool:

Option #3 (http://www.woodcraft.com/family.aspx?familyid=5086)

$349.99 Woodcraft CRS with 36" x 54" Vinyl Bag. But I would still need to get a supply kit of glue so about $50.00 more.

Should I spring for the Vacuum Mesh Breather Kit for any of them?


I am leaning towards Option #1 but the 3.15 CFM does not have a rating for me to figure out what size of a bag it can handle max. I am looking towards a kitchen table project that is on the near horizon so I will need to pickup a larger bag but it would still be done in pieces.

Thanks for any comments.

Sam Brooks

[Jim Becker]

www.joewoodworker.com (http://www.joewoodworker.com) ;)

If it's something you need to know about veneer work and veneer presses, Joe is the man.

[Jamie Buxton]

#2 would be putting a big stess on that little compressor. It isn't built to run nearly-continuously for the time you want to leave the press pressing. I'd go with option 1. 3 cfm will pull down most bags quickly enough. (BTW, the pump in the Woodcraft kit is about 1.1 cfm.)

I don't know what's in that $65 worth of "essentials", but that seems a bit excessive. You need glue ($15/gal if you're using PVA), and veneer tape ($5 a roll). You don't need a veneer saw. I own one, but haven't actually used it in twenty years. I rough-cut veneer with a sharp knife -- a drywall knife, to be exact. Then I edge-joint it, glue it down, and then treat the assembly like veneered plywood, which is what it is.

[guy knight]

second joewoodworker.com

[Samuel Brooks]

#2 would be putting a big stess on that little compressor. It isn't built to run nearly-continuously for the time you want to leave the press pressing. I'd go with option 1. 3 cfm will pull down most bags quickly enough. (BTW, the pump in the Woodcraft kit is about 1.1 cfm.)

I don't know what's in that $65 worth of "essentials", but that seems a bit excessive. You need glue ($15/gal if you're using PVA), and veneer tape ($5 a roll). You don't need a veneer saw. I own one, but haven't actually used it in twenty years. I rough-cut veneer with a sharp knife -- a drywall knife, to be exact. Then I edge-joint it, glue it down, and then treat the assembly like veneered plywood, which is what it is.

Thanks for the comment on the "essentials". I keep thinking that I am missing something with Option #1, like it should be more expensive but that is the direction that I am leaning. I guess now I just need to pull the trigger. I will take the money saved and spend it on the mesh. I am only doing flat work right now but it should help with that as well.

Option #1 & #2 are from Joe Woodworkers Web Site.

[Samuel Brooks]

#2 would be putting a big stess on that little compressor. It isn't built to run nearly-continuously for the time you want to leave the press pressing.

I though the resevoir tanks were suppose to help with this, so the compressor did not have to run all of the time? I am still leaning towards Option #1 but have you seen or heard different on the Option #2?

Thanks, Sam

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Joe knows what he is doing, and if you defer to his expertise, you won't be sorry. I built a 4'x8' system with a bigger pump, with parts supplied by him, and have around $500 into it. Excellent system.

Not sure I understand the continuous run? Is that just for vacuum clamping? You certainly won't need the pump to run non stop with the bag. Mine has resevior tanks, which help evacuate the bag quicker, I think. Once the bag gets to vacuum, about a minute with a big piece, it cycles the pump several times per minute a couple times, then holds for hours.

I would not use a venturi pump personally. Why bother? The air compresser is ridiculously loud, while the electric pump is incredibly quiet. The venturi system is more complicated as well. It can make some impressive amounts of vacuum, but is it really needed?

I also rarely use the mesh you mentioned. Usually not needed in my humble opinion. Try your new press for form bending too some time. Amazing machines.

[Guy Germaine]

I haven't bought any veneering hardware from Joe, but I always hear good things about him. I have purchased other items from him, and had excellent service.

I have the setup from Woodcraft. It has served me well for over a year now. I went the Woodcraft route mainly because I didn't feel like taking the time to gather the parts and assemble them.:rolleyes:

[Larry Fox]

Another voate for Joe Woodworker. Breather Mesh is great stuff. I use it all the time instead of a top platten and have gotten consistently great results.

FWIW - I have the V2 system and a 60-gallon compressor and the compressor runs fairly frequently. It is pulling a vac in a 48" x 60" bag though so ymmv but I would think any configuration would really work that PC compressor. I have one and I agree that it is LOUD.

[Charlie Plesums]

I like Joe woodworker also, for both advice and products.

One unpublished note... You can use a shop vac to take the bulk air out of a bag, and then switch to a lower capacity continuous duty pump.

Another unpublished note.... You cannot use a continuous duty pump for vacuum hold-down clamping. There is usually shop dust around when you want a vacuum clamp (hold down for sanding, etc.). That dust gets into the vacuum pump filter, and plugs the filter in no time.

I had assumed that a venturi pump would take a very high volume of air, overloading a compressor. After I bought a continuous duty pump, I was surprised at the relatively low cfm requirement for a venturi, and I expect it would also work well with vacuum clamping since the suction doesn't have to go through a pump.

[john bateman]

One minor point...if your 44" x 12" piece has much height to it, then it can be quite difficult to get the 4 ft bag to to fit around it and still have some slack at the end to clamp it shut.

If your just veneering a flat substrate, you should be ok.

[Samuel Brooks]

I am going to go with option #1 the CRS system, but it looks like I will be waiting awhile since this falls in the "discretionary funds" category and right now I am choosing to bank my discretionary funds for a little while until the markets indicate what they are going to do.

So I am going to go with contact cement for this project. It's the hall table from Woodsmith Magazine #147 (http://www.woodsmith.com/issues/147/). But I am putting it together with pocket screws so I can deliver the project and get paid. If it blows up in a few years, I can take it apart and do it the correct way. Because the veneer press was going to cost more then I was going to get in gross for the project not including materials.

I do this for fun, so making a profit on each project which is only 2-3 per year is not a requirement, and any excuse for a new tool is a worthy project :). But I already picked the Jet 10-20 drum sander and the Ridgid benchtop sander to complete this project so I guess I should just call it a good project, 2 new tools and be happy. :D

Thanks for all of the comments.

[john bateman]

I've veneered many panels about the size you are contemplating, using the correct glue...not contact cement. Mechanical presses existed long before vacuum bag systems came along.
If you have plenty of clamps, it's pretty inexpensive. Even the big C-clamps pictured below were only around $4 apiece on sale.
http://members.verizon.net/%7Epecker/jbpress2.jpg