Which 12" slider chop saw to buy?

[Craig D Peltier]

Im in the market for either a 12 or 10 inch sliding compound miter saw. My general purpose for moving up to a slide is the crosscutting capability. I currently have a 12 inch ridgid ( non slider)with msuv stand.
One thing I want to add to the equations is when cutting thick stock 2 inches and thicker the 12 inch blade seems to sway out like this / but more subtle of course. I have heard from one friend that a 10 inch wont do this as much due to less blade. So is this tru, have you read it elsehwere or have a 12 and a 10 an noticed?

So my recent tool guide rates the bosch , makita an dewalt the best ones. Im leaning towards bosch. I know dewalt has more cutting capacity in height and lighter for jobsites.I do carry mine but maybe once every 2-3 weeks so weight isnt an issue. I have used the dewalt many times and I like it. I dont like the DC , seems to spit everywhere but in the bag.

So can I hear which one you like and what you dont like about it as well?

The makita is said its close to the bosch but the miter scale is covered by the stock when being cut if its wide. I dont really like that non feature.

One thing said about the 12 inch bosch is when you tighten the miter gauge down it creeps to one side or the other making it move slightly off degree.

Ridgid I dont like the lock down function.I have it on my MSUV and its tough to lock sometimes , push it hard like it wants to break.

Thanks for the input.

[jason lambert]

Well they all have there issues I hate to tell you that. Even the new festool one I have seems the best but has had issues for many other people. Dust collection is bad on all of them! The Bosh seems to be the best but that is my opion and I have not use one alot. I have used the dewalt alot and like it. But you will need to get use to the one you buy to work around the short commings. Good thing is they all seem to hold up well. I would also look into the Bosh rolling stand or something like that it makes life easer transporting it or the sawhelper system.

[Matthew Voss]

If I was in the market I would go with the new Milwaukee hands down.

[Craig D Peltier]

If I was in the market I would go with the new Milwaukee hands down.
Have you read reviews and comparisons on it?

[Matthew Voss]

http://www.woodmagazine.com/dgroups/persona.jsp?userId=4d3c9a99a4711a853a3a45b2c33c3d3 1&plckController=PersonaBlog&plckScript=personaScript&plckElementId=personaDest&plckPersonaPage=BlogViewPost&plckPostId=Blog%3a4d3c9a99a4711a853a3a45b2c33c3d31 Post%3ac7de193e-2cb7-470d-8092-7e470a369ce1

Go to HD and put your hands on it - I think you will be impressed.

[Scott Whiting]

I have:
10" Craftsman single bevel miter
12" Dewalt single bevel miter
12" Ridgid single bevel miter
12" Bosch double bevel slider

The only time I have trouble with blade flex is with thin kerf blades and I only use those for carpentry work. Even some of the better thin kerfs won't flex until they start to dull but I prefer using full kerf. Of the bunch, the saw I use most often is the Ridgid because it captures the most dust and being single bevel it has a full fence on the right and I cut a lot of 5/32 pieces and am too lazy to attach a ZCI fence.

[Tom Godley]

I went through this with my friend last year when he was looking for a compound slider. He was all over the place - looking at them and pricing them.

So much thinking about a saw!

Anyway, he went with the Hitachi 12", and has been very happy with it. I also liked that saw. I have the 8.5 and absolutely love it!

Recently I have been thinking about getting a larger saw so I will be able to cut wider stock.

For some reason I just do not like the feel of the Bosch units - I can not tell you why. The new Hitachi units are coming from China and do not look to be as well made - this is a shame!

Last week I went to the Grizzly sale and they had the Milwaukee saw on display. I thought is was a nice saw, although it had a lot of plastic - it was very smooth! -- almost too smooth on the slider if the saw is not level. I did not love the blade guard -- but this was minor. I think it was $699.00 with a choice of free tool.

Grizzly also had a big Dewalt/ PC display. The had the 12" compound slider for $539.00 and it came with the free Dewalt miter stand ($200.00) and laser (?). I went inside and they had the Dewalt and the Milwaukee side by side. I played around with them both - walked away and came back -- played some more.

I came to the conclusion that they are about the same just different. The plastic of the Milwaukee concerned me but Milwaukee makes sturdy tools so I gave them a pass on that. The digital display was interesting but of little use to me for what I wanted to use the saw for. I felt that the Dewalt had a heavy spring to overcome to lower the blade - but I did like the fence arrangement. The Dewalt looks and feels more industrial but that may not be the case in reality.

I felt that I could not pass up the deal on the Dewalt!

Its a great saw -- the stand is particularly nice and I quickly got used to the spring! And I like the laser. No regrets - does all it should.

[Bill Jepson]

I really like it. The saw has higher capabilities than the operator. The OEM blade on the Bosch also seems to work a bit better than the others I have used. I would have looked into the Milwaukee if it had been available when I was looking. The Bosch detents are crisp and accurate. Laser add-on is crap, like most of the Laser add-ons. Right now we seem to have an embarassment of riches in the 12" SCMS competition. I would go with the Bosch or Milwaukee. Can't go badly wrong with any of them. Oh one last feature on the Bosch, the handle rotates to vertical or horizontal and has a interlock button on both sides of the handle. Good for righties or lefties. I'm sure this has been copied (or perhaps stolen?) from others FWIW.
Bill

[Scott Rollins]

I tested the Milwaulkee slider and the milwaulkee chop saw. I kept the chop saw (I don't need the extra capacity for what I use it for). The dust collection was awesome on both of them when hooked into a vac (either a shop vac or dust collection). Both saws performed as well as any other miter saw I have used. I tried the kapex out at the store and I could not justify the price after using the milwaulkee. It gives me perfect burn free cuts on my miters and tall mouldings. I love the digital miter for those less than perfect 89 degree walls! I would definately buy it again. If I felt the need for the 12" capacity I would buy the slider. It is extrememly ridgid. There is little to no deflection in any of the cuts I made. The only problem I had was it is huge and heavy!

[Brian Peters]

The newer dewalts are a joke, a complete down-grade from their older 12" slider model. Plus $$$. I have a rigid 10" and a bosch 12", but would say the older 12" dewalt slider if you can find one is the best bang for the buck. The Bosch slider is good, a very well built saw. Only complaints is that it is very heavy and bulky, takes up a lot of space especially in the back; not good for a small shop but good for job sites when you need a large cross cutting capacity or cutting height for crown/base.

[Craig D Peltier]

The newer dewalts are a joke, a complete down-grade from their older 12" slider model. Plus $$$. I have a rigid 10" and a bosch 12", but would say the older 12" dewalt slider if you can find one is the best bang for the buck. The Bosch slider is good, a very well built saw. Only complaints is that it is very heavy and bulky, takes up a lot of space especially in the back; not good for a small shop but good for job sites when you need a large cross cutting capacity or cutting height for crown/base.
What categorizes older, do you know how old 3 years or more?

[Craig D Peltier]

Thanks for the input.Tonight in maybe 2 hours I will be going to the depot to look at the milwaukee.

[Jim Kountz]

I have two of the older deWalt 12" sliders and let me tell you they dont get babied. These are both jobsite saws, they travel in my trailer from job to job, they get beat and banged around, up and down stairs across all kinds of terrain. I have used these saws in the rain, sleet and snow and not once in the 7 years Ive owned them have they given me a minutes trouble. I have done nothing to them as far as alignment or maintenance other than the usual like lubing the pivot points and the carriage. I make a living with these saws and use them daily and I can tell you I should get paid for this endorsement! LOL Just kiddng but seriously if you want a rugged saw that will last for years and stay in alignment find yourself a deal on a dewalt. Just my 2 cents!!

PS I bought an Hitachi 12" with the digital display and all that crap, it lasted one week before I took it back and got a refund. Horrible saw in my opinion, least the one I got was.

[William OConnell]

I have two of the older deWalt 12" sliders and let me tell you they dont get babied. These are both jobsite saws, they travel in my trailer from job to job, they get beat and banged around, up and down stairs across all kinds of terrain. I have used these saws in the rain, sleet and snow and not once in the 7 years Ive owned them have they given me a minutes trouble. I have done nothing to them as far as alignment or maintenance other than the usual like lubing the pivot points and the carriage. I make a living with these saws and use them daily and I can tell you I should get paid for this endorsement! LOL Just kiddng but seriously if you want a rugged saw that will last for years and stay in alignment find yourself a deal on a dewalt. Just my 2 cents!!
Me too also. I have the exact same experience with my Dewalt. I did have to change the armature but after years of use and abuse it still cuts like a dream. I have the older one with the guide bars on the top and bottom, I personally don't think theres been a better saw made in the class . The newer ones however seem to be a downngrade with the guide bars that run horizontally. The motors and armature are much smaller and it just seems built cheaper all the way around.

[Brian Ross]

i echo what those who drag them around in a trailer have said about dewalt. I have a Makita LS 1013 slider and a Dewalt 12 in slider. They are used and abused and still work great. Bought a 12 Bosch fixed last week as I got tired of carrying slider at job site. So far I really like it.It hasn't survived the trailer test but I am sure it will. As for blade deflection between the 12 and 10 inch I have not noticed any difference but I do have full plate after market blades on both. Good luck with your decision.

Brian

[Bob Feeser]

In a word: Makita

[Simon Dupay]

In a word: Makita
2ed-Makita

[Per Swenson]

I keep saying this over and over again but that's OK.

All of the top $500 saws are excellent. And you simply can't go wrong
no matter your choice.

I also now own a Kapex (No issues) but the price puts this in a class all by itself. Yeah, its worth it.

Out of the others I own the big makita and a older Milwaukee.
My preference after the kapex would be another Makita.

I also looked at the new Milwaukee, no, I used the new Milwaukee,
the only drawback I found was size and weight. It's a Monster and I wouldn't look forward to moving it to the third floor even if the kid was carrying it.

I sold my Bosch. That should tell you something.
There is nothing really wrong with dewalt.
But I have deep seated personal issues with this company
that don't need to be aired here.

So lets sum up and remember its just opinion

Kapex, Makita, Milwaukee, then in no order the other 3. Hitachi,bosch, dewalt.

Per

[John Thompson]

I had a 10" Hitachi for 5 years and it was excellent. I sold it local and purchased the 12" Hitachi as I do all my cross-cutting on the SCMS and I encounter 16/4 stock on occasion. I needed the 12" to handle the thickness there. It is an excellent saw but somewhat heavy. It does have the compact sliding bars that don't take up the space in the rear of some.

I do not think I would want to lug the 12" Hitachi around on a job-site daily. But with a Freud 12" blade on board.. it doesn't deflect in Thin Kerf with 2" oak. Perhaps because I slow the feed rate down vs attack with vengence.

I have used the Makita.. excellent saw. I have not used the Bosch or DeWalt. I looked over and used the Kapex at IWF and it seems to be a nice 10" saw but IMO.. not a $1200 saw. A few nice features but not and added $500-$600 worth of creature features for my needs which mainly consist of deep 90* cuts.

I also looked at the Milwaukee the other day at HD. This appears to be a good saw but soldiers all appear nice in a dress uniform. The question is can they fight when introduced to the trench. I will say I own a Milwaukee 3 1/2 HP and 2 1/4 HP combo router. I will never buy another brand as I have tried about all. Based on that I might purchase the Milwaukee without even using it first if I were not happy with my Hitachi. I trust them that much based on their routers and saw-zall.

Sarge..

[Per Swenson]

Sarge,

Here is what makes the kapex a $1300 saw.
Cut 4 triangles to make a flat square on any saw on the market,
you can try this at home with the Hitachi, and tell me you
didn't have to fiddle the last piece in order to make it work.

Kapex does this flawlessly.
In other words the accuracy is unparalleled in the mitre saw market.
Which also begs the question do you really need it, that kind of accuracy.
Not every body does. My other saws and I have been trimming houses forever. But for custom work in hardwoods, well its a no brainer.

Per

[Brian W Evans]

Caveat: I am not a pro and don't move mine around much. That being said, I have used mine for rough cutting hardwood to length, framing/decking type carpentry, and trim carpentry on several remodeling projects. I am thoroughly pleased with the Makita. Dust collection is awful, but that's the nature of the SCMS's. I especially like the adjustable laser and the fluorescent light is surprisingly nice as well.

I also use a full kerf blade and go slow where cut quality is important (i.e. as opposed to framing cuts). The nature of the cut an SCMS as opposed to an CMS is often more of a crosscut than a plunge cut, which appears to make the cuts cleaner.

[John Thompson]

Thanks for the inside info on the Kapex, Per. If one does trim or angled in-lay for bucks then accuracy is a must. You won't often find professional picture frame makers using a miter saw to cut corners and if you do they are probably "cutting corners" as they can't afford the "right stuff". :) In my case you are correct about not having the need. Even with final cuts on furniture I get accurate cuts but... without even doing what you suggested with my Hitachi I can tell you that last piece would have to be fiddled with to mesh 100% accurately.

I do a small amount of trim work for myself as the house is paid for and all that was done years ago. But I have cut some chair rail and the Hitachi did fine once I learned from locak trim carpenters why I got a gap when cutting angles. I thought my TK blade was deflecting but it turns out that was not the case at all and operator was.

I even tried 2 other blades and still got the gap so I sought help from some locak trim guys I know who all laughed and told me the same thing.. your stock is "walking the fence" (southern trim carpenter talk) meaning that it would creep on the fence from the accute blade angle and I was using the same fast plunge as I used to use on a standard 90* cut.

I slowed it down.. added sand-paper to the fence.. firmly hold or clamp the stock and what I thought was deflection disappeared into thin kerf air. But again I know without attempting that my saw will not bring that 4th piece you mentioned to NASA standards.

But for what I do... I definitely could not justify as you mentioned.

Regards...

Sarge..

[Craig D Peltier]

I looked at the milwaukee last night. I couldnt figure out how to use the red adjustment knob on it for fine adjustment. Seems like a sturdy saw without bells and whistles. I guee it does have a digital readout which I wouldnt trust just like a laser.
I can tbeliev im looking at chop saws that cost more than my first TS ( ridgid for 549). I meane the milwaukee is 699. I have a $50 off at lowes that HD will honor. Im going to see the Bosch on monday.Dunn Lumber around here is closed on weekends which I dont get.
I saw the makita as well, looks like alot of exposed parts to me, it wasnt the slider version.
As far as older dewalt if anyone can post a pic of one so I can compare when looking on CL that would be nice. I guess the one with the vertical guides verse the horizontal.

Thanks

[John Bush]

Hi Craig,
I've had the DW708 for 6+ years and it is the most used tool in my shop. I am the hobby type but have used it for rough stuff as well as more accurate finish work with good results. If you can find one I think you would be happy with it. I had the blade sharpened for the first time two weeks ago and what a huge difference that has made. I think I will resharpen sooner than every 6 years!! JCB

[Craig D Peltier]

I looked at the milwaukee last night. I couldnt figure out how to use the red adjustment knob on it for fine adjustment. Seems like a sturdy saw without bells and whistles. I guee it does have a digital readout which I wouldnt trust just like a laser.
I can tbeliev im looking at chop saws that cost more than my first TS ( ridgid for 549). I meane the milwaukee is 699. I have a $50 off at lowes that HD will honor. Im going to see the Bosch on monday.Dunn Lumber around here is closed on weekends which I dont get.
I saw the makita as well, looks like alot of exposed parts to me, it wasnt the slider version.
As far as older dewalt if anyone can post a pic of one so I can compare when looking on CL that would be nice. I guess the one with the vertical guides verse the horizontal.

Thanks
Forget comment on not knowing how to use the red knob.I watched in on there site.

[Tom Godley]

I just read the reviews of the Dewalt - and I am not seeing the problems noted in the negative reviews with the saw I purchased??


I needed to get a saw to allow me to rough cut larger timbers and to do larger cuts that my Hitachi 8.5 can not. I recently picked up a great set of jigs called "Cut-N-Crown" for crown moulding that requires the larger blade.

It may just be me but for cutting small stock I am a little uneasy using these large 12" saws. For small stuff I will continue to use the 8.5.

The funny thing is, I bought the 8.5 to replace a mini craftsman RAS that I bought back in 1979. I had to replace it because it uses a strange blade size 7.5 -- they were getting impossible to find. But I still use it with a custom blade to make picture frames - it is quite accurate - plus I like pulling the blade rather than pushing when cutting small stuff.

[Craig D Peltier]

HD has over 40 12" sliders reconditioned for 299. Thats a good price on the internet.

[Craig D Peltier]

I just read on the ridgid forum that the dewalt has a 16" crosscutting capability an confirmed it on there site. This is a 3-4 inch adavantage I believe over others. This is a plus for me.

[Craig D Peltier]

Anyone want to read a very extensive review by many owners of the milwaukee go to this link. http://forums.jlconline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=43590 I have never heard of this forum but I think the post is 3 pages.
My local HD has two.Im going to get one tommorrow.

[Per Swenson]

Craig,

Good choice.

Per