Felder / Hammer

[jason lambert]

Anyone know who the sales manager is over at Felder? I am trying to order a joiner plainer, Hammer A3-31 and the quotes I keep getting are different. It keeps getting more expensive from what I was told and have email that quoted lower prices. I need to get a definitive price down and don't have time to call them back all day or wait for calls to be returned? I am about to give up on them all together at this point I hate companies that play games and will not do anything for you. This is just not starting off well.

[Rob Russell]

Hans is the President of Felder USA and should be able to get things straightened out for you.

[jason lambert]

Well after I convinced them that I was picking it up and they took off the $500 shipping they added a shipping/pick up prep fee. That is BS! They are right up there with car dealers charging a dealer prep fee and they still have the invoice wrong. Wanted to go pick this up tommrow and I can't get them to call me back they just email back there sails rep is horrable. Not a good start when you can't even buy a machine with cash in hand. Now they are gone so I guess I am not getting it tommrow.

[Ken Garlock]

Jason, is there something unique about the Felder machine that can't to be had from another vendor? I know that Mini Max would not treat you that way. Their sales staff keeps in touch with you, even a year after the sale.

Of course the Felder sales staff may have made their quota already this month....:rolleyes:

[jason lambert]

I will have to look into them I was ready to purchase this even looked at one this weekend. The sales guy finally called me back and told me that he gave me special wood show pricing (this is more than a friend paid 6 months ago) anyhow he called me 10 minuts of 6 and told me they where closing the office so he couldn't adjust anything but if I send him my CC and sign the PO it would lock the price and he could adjust later. Correct me if I am wrong but I am not signing anything and giving my Credit Card till I have a good quote he couldn't seem to get that to me today it sounded like he had to leave since they where locking the office. For spending 4K and I am already having issues :mad: Oh yea they are doing me a favor giving it to me cheap that seemed to be that attude!

[Chris McDowell]

Jason I know Eric is no longer with Felder. He evidently left and went to Stiles. Which sells Altendorf among other things. I just bought my slider and bandsaw at IWF from MiniMax and couldn't be happier. I normally don't try and persuade people one way or the other, but after spending most of the show with them I feel confident in saying they are good people. Michael Kahn is the president now and Sam Blasco is in sales and a pro woodworker to boot. Maybe you should give them a call. My .o2.

Chris

[Rick Potter]

Jason,

I own a Felder, and it is a great machine, but in my opinion they act like they are doing you a favor selling it to you, and then you find out everything is an overpriced option. My favorite was the $175 or so extra if you want the slider table anodized (5 years ago).

I would not hesitate to look at the Mini Max. They have come up in quality quite a bit since I chose the Felder, and some of your existing tooling may work with it.

Again....great machine, but a really uppity attitude from the company, and I hope they have fixed their really poor manuals.

Rick Potter

[Mike Heidrick]

Minimax is awesome - even when you buy their tools used!

I am suprised to read that though about felder. I registered to look at their booth at IWF and I cannot get their guys to quit calling. Heck, I was just looking for their mortiser to compare it to the Laguna knock off of the Hammer D3. They are convinced I want one of their jointer planers and I have a 12"J and 20"P seperate setups already.

Boy though, Their Felder Format Four stuff is super super nice!!

[Aaron Beaver]

When I bought my jointer/planer I looked at and talked to both Felder & MiniMax. I ended up going with Minimax because of there sales people, I didn't find Felder as bad as what you are going through but I liked the way Minimax answered my questions.

I will say that after the sale support has been great, even just run of the mill operating questions.

[Jim Becker]

I didn't know Erik left Felder and removed my previous post with the requested contact information provided as a courtesy accordingly. Obviously, MiniMax is also my choice and I highly recommend them for all the reasons stated.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Jason, I tried to buy a Felder slot mortiser this last winter, and after getting completely fed up with their payment "process", somewhat similar issue to what you are talking about, I posted a complaint here. Within hours, I got a very helpful call from Felder, doing what it would take to fix my issue. By posting here, you have probably notified them of your issue.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I bought a slider saw and that same J/P from them and my transaction was slick easy and smooth.

I can't guess why you are getting these issues.

Who is your sales rep?

[Thomas S Stockton]

Jason
In this economy you hold the upper-hand, you're smart not to lock in a price with no info. You might want to do what some people recommend when buying a car and it gets weird and that is to walk out, freaks the salespeople out completely. Since this is all over the phone when they call just let them know very politely that you are researching the other options out there. Find out about the other jointer/planers so that when they do call back(they will) you can talk to them about the pros and cons of their machine versus the others. You might find that one of the other ones fits your needs better. I don't know how the big IWF show went for dealers but I would guess it wasn't great and people are hungry for a sale.
Tom

[David DeCristoforo]

Post this on the Felder group on Yahoo

Then, sit back and watch the stuff fly.

But, I am thinking that some other responders are on the right track. In this economic climate, vendors should be much more considerate of potential customers (not that they shouldn't be anyway). There are many good alternatives.

[Alister Orme]

I have a 16 hammer j/p that needed work recently.
They got the parts sent over and then there was a line on the invoice for 12% foreign exchange charge or something goofy like that....they not only nickel and dime you....it sometimes seems they have a competition to make up the goofiest reason for doing so.
I've been upgrading my stuff for several years and have bought three "Every Molecule Machines".....the ones you know you have paid for every molecule in the bloody things.
Two of the sales for the Sawstop and the Shopbot went smoothly enough and I'm glad I bought them.
The Hammer purchase was Awful-the machine delivery was stuffed up and at the end of the day I'm sorry I bought it.....the machine itself is nice enough but dealing with people that don't care....leaves alot to be desired.

[Brad Shipton]

There have been some discussions about customer service on the FOG and there have been some problems. The unfortunate truth is hobbiests represent nothing in the Felder annual sales. The north american market is only about 10% of Felder's sales and I bet the hobbiest market would be less than 1% of that. Now thats no excuse for this experience, but I will say that I have gotten far better service from my Felder rep than some other companies. It pretty much boils down to the individual salespeople and we all know how that can vary. I think the dollar change may have led to some internal changes at Felder in North America. I know my rep moved on and seems some others have too.

Brad

[Mike Heidrick]

Anyone been to the Felder office in Chicago. I read about that on their site. I would like to visit that place one day.

[Rod Sheridan]

I must say my experiences with Felder Ontario were nothing but top notch.

Well trained staff who really knew their product, a beautiful showroom, and a willingness to invest as much time as was required in my transaction, even if I am "just a hobbiest".

There are always two sides to a dispute, unfortunately we won't hear Felders as they cannot comment on customer transactions.

Regards, Rod.

[Rick Fisher]

I am in the middle of a purchase from Felder right now. The rep is excellent. The machine is late, but its not a really big deal. If I email my rep at 6:00 PM. I could get a response the same day.

My machine is supposed to be here in just over a week. Like I said, its a bit late but not a big deal to me.

I have also had dealings with Mini-Max and find them good. The "parts pronto site" isnt really all that "pronto" :) But the product knowledge of the staff is excellent.

Being Canadian, I have an issue with price disparity. It costs about $200 to have something CSA approved plus the current exchange rate. If a product is more expensive than that in Canada, I likely wont buy it. Its the reason I wont support Delta, Ford, GMC or Chrysler.

Call Felder, complain, tell them what you think of the uppidy attitude and ask them if they want to sell you a machine or not. By the response you get, you will know if you want to do business with them.

There are other tools out there, but give them the chance to respond to your issues.

[jason lambert]

I kind of did complain a little but I hate doing that,m I am pretty easy going when things go well. The answer I got was that is our price! So I figured these where written in stone. Then I found out some other people got discounts on accessories and stuff! My rep didn't want to buge a pennie, they must work on commission. I pretty much hate them now and I will think I will pass on this it is not that good of a machine anyhow and has some serious flaws, god forbid I need a part or customer service once I buy the thing.

[Leigh Betsch]

When I was looking I checked out all three, Felder, Mini Max, and Laguna. Felder definitely was high pressure sales, as soon as I told my sales rep I had bought Mini Max I immediately got called by his boss for one more high pressure sales pitch. I was very happy with the Mini Max sales and staff in Austin TX, don't know anything about the GA office. I went to TX with a car trailer to pick up a table saw/shaper combo, a bandsaw, and a jointer/planer. When I got there Jim said my MM16 wasn't ready (demo model) so he up graded me to a MM20 demo for no added cost, my 12" j/p was damaged when they brought it down off the rack so he upgraded me to a 16" at no charge. I've never heard of service like that, great guys. Now that they have moved back to GA, I don't know just how they will treat us hobby types. The Felder stuff sure is pretty. I think some day I'll buy some used Felder stuff just so I can give them a try with out dealing with their sales people.

[Gregory Stahl]

My understanding is the Chicago office is now closed. It closed about a month ago.

I spent time with Felder at IWF and had them write up some quotes. The prices they were offering were good, but the one thing that disappoints me is they charge $1500 for on-site calibration for the sliding table saws I was looking at. If you don't agree to this, it nullifies the warranty. Now c'mon, I am capable enough to calibrate a table saw, arn't I????? For $1500, I'll figure it out--I made it through engineering school after all. What makes a Felder so much more precise than a Mini Max?

Felder equipment is definately very nice, but the Mini Max sliders are very nice too, priced a bit lower and don't require a $1500 on-site calibration visit.

I ruled out the Laguna saws after seeing them up-close and learning that most of their sliders are now manufactured in Asia. My impression is Laguna is focusing on making their product cheeper to compete with companies such as Grizzly.

-Greg

[Chris McDowell]

Gregory that was my understanding about the Chicago office as well. I'm sorry it closed but they called me all the time. Several times in fact after I had told them that I was purchasing the MM at IWF. I'm sure they were under pressure to make sales in a tough environment.

Felder makes very nice machines, and I know of several satisfied customers, but for me I honestly like the 315 better than the K700. That's just personal opinion and it's worth what you paid for it.

Leigh-the MM sales staff in Georgia is the same as it was in Texas. Only thing different is Jim left the company and Michael took his place.

[Rick Fisher]

I think sales people are exactly that.... people.

I was going to buy a hammer combo unit but decided that I really didnt need another planer. (I have 2 already). What I need is a bigger jointer.

I cant justify the cost of the Felder Jointer, so I am searching around for a good used Euro Jointer.

When I told my Felder rep, he said " no problem, thanks for your interest in our product ".

I thought it was a classy finish.

I already had another piece on order, so I am not a tire kicker. Yet the answer was classy. I will call him again as my hobby gets even more outragous. :)

Mini Max is a tough one for me. The MM-20 Band Saw is about $1500 more in Canada. I wont agree to that. So I bought a used SCMI. I just cant support a company that cant do simple math. :)

Disparity irritates me so much that I hope they read that. :)

If Felder made a more affordable dedicated Jointer, I would likely have one on order. I think its missing from the Hammer line of tools.

[Dan Clermont in Burnaby]

I bought my Felder machine last fall and the service was great. They were prompt answering my e-mails and questions over the phone. When I decided to have the machine delivered to my house rather then picking it up at the dock they made the changes quickly.

Whenever I had a question they were quick to answer even after they recieved all of my money

Before buying my machine in Canada I did call Felder in the US to compare prices and was surprised how arrogant they were. If I had to buy from them I probably would have chosen Minimax

I am extremely happy with my Hammer A3 31 and would gladly buy another Hammer machine

Dan Clermont

[Steve Perez]

Hey Jason hows it going?
Just got back into town, sorry for this late reply ...

Unfortunately, like you, I gained interest in the A3 31 after the price increase of April '08. I kicked myself for not coming to a decision on the Hammer before the price hike. But many manufacturers are raising prices these days (inflation argh). So when I got word of a sale at Felder/Hammer that brought the unit back to similar prices before the price hike, I got a good quote and jumped on it real fast, without any hesitation. I believe there may have been another sale during the IWF. But those sales might be over now. Also the A3 31 is a configurable machine. Just things to keep in mind on why prices may vary so much.

I can take the shipping/rigging cost only so far as I dont know what the price was you were quoted. Just to give you an idea, for shipping over seas, they cram many units into one large shipping container. Each machine is rigged onto a very narrow steel reinforced pallet that is not suitable for shipping on roads as it would very easily tip over. I guess they use the narrow pallets so they can fit as many units into a container. Once in the US, they attach it to a full size wider pallet suitable for roadway transport. I'll PM you some other stuff they do but its all about contingency and all in all it might be justifyable as the precautions they take are planned for the worst, short of a car crash. Still it should be them telling you all this and not me .

And I've had the good fortune of having great service too ... lots of emails going both ways. Hope this helps and hope everything works out for you.

[Gregory Stahl]

Just got off the phone with a Felder rep.

Apparently, not paying the $1500 for on-site calibration will not void the warranty on the saws as was my understanding from my visit to Felder at IWF.

Just wanted to pass this on so my previous post does not negativly influence any purchasing decesions.

Best,
Greg

[jason lambert]

I would get it in writing they seem to change the rules as to what fit them best at the moment.

I may still get one but they will have to do better on price at least what they originally told me it would be with the accessories.

[Mike Heidrick]

I talked to the Felder guys again the other day. I let them know I bought the Laguna mortiser. They were very very nice. They said they would keep in touch with me and that I would be ready for a Felder mortiser before long :rolleyes:.

[Rick Fisher]

I run a medium sized company and deal with customers on a regular basis who have complaints or issues with one or another of the employees.
Having the opportunity to try to make things right is something I look forward too.

If you have a bad experience with an employee of a company, go up the ladder a bit. Give a supervisor an opportunity to keep your business. If they blow it.. well..