Need bunk bed advice

[Andy Pedler]

Hi all...Today I picked up a pile of 8/4 and 6/4 poplar that I'm supposed to transform into bunk beds for the kids. I have some plans that I intend to use as a guideline but I will probably change a few of the joinery details and knockdown hardware. I'm going to build them such that they can be two separate panel beds in the future. I have a few questions:

1. What is an appropriate size for the legs? The plans I have use 1-3/4" square legs, but that seems kinda spindly to me. I don't want to have railroad tie looking legs, but I want this bed to be very solid (I imagine that it would be difficult to explain to my wife why the bed tipped over with the kids in it). I'm leaning toward 2-1/2" to 3" square legs. Any advice?

2. Based on the leg size, what is an appropriate size for the front and side rails? If the legs are 3" square, and the front/back rails will be joined using mortise and tenons, how wide should those rails be? The side rails will probably be the same size and I plan to use the Rockler bed rail hardware to connect them, which leads to question number 3...

3. Is the Rockler bed hardware the best to use? Poking around SMC that seems to be a common choice, but are there any alternatives worth considering? Secondly, if I go with the Rockler hardware, how much added strength do I get by embedding the hardware into the leg/rail as opposed to just attaching with screws? I imagine the bed will look better with the hardware embedded, as the joint will basically disappear when assembled.

Thanks in advance!

Andy - Newark, CA

[Randy Klein]

Andy,

Here's (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?referrerid=5960&t=68898) a bed 1 of 2 that I made for a bunk bed/2 twin bed setup. I loosely followed a set of Rockler plans.

The legs were a major change from the plans. They are real easy to make, strong, and are designed to connect the two beds together very securely when in bunk mode. Incidentally, I submitted this tip to Woodsmith mag and they printed it.

As for side rail to post connection, I didn't like any of the hardware I looked at. I ended up doing a stub tenon w/ bed bolt connection. It's rock solid. Plus, the way the legs were designed, the bolt head is easily hidden from view.

Good luck and feel free to ask any questions. I sure did.

[Andy Pedler]

Here is the plan I threw together in Sketchup.

96031

The posts are 3" square, which seems like it will be more than solid. I took a trip up to Rockler and looked at their bed rail assembly hardware. It looks more than solid enough for me, so I picked up two sets of fasteners.

Only problem is that I picked up the 6" long versions by mistake, and probably should have gotten the 4" version. The side rails in the design shown are 5" wide, so only the 4" hardware would work. If I kept this hardware I'd have to make the side rails 7" wide.

Any thoughts? Should I keep the hardware and go with 7" side rails or exchange the hardware and keep the rails 5"? Is there some benefit to a 7" rail that I'm not thinking of?

Thanks!

Andy - Newark, CA

[Andy Pedler]

So I've got the leg pieces for the bed laminated and I'm almost ready to start the front and rear rails. I have a question about tenon sizing for the rails into the posts.

The posts are probably going to end up 2-7/8" square. The headboard and footboard rails are 1-1/8" thick. So what width and length should the mortise/tenons be for optimal strength?

I was thinking of making the tenons 1-1/2" to 2" long and 5/8" thick. Playing around in Sketchup, 1-1/2" looks too short but 2" looks too long (also may be hard to cut a mortise that deep). Is there any good way of calculating how long the tenon must be for the desired strength?

Thanks,

Andy - Newark, CA

[Ray Schafer]

I remember when you posted that bed ... it is really great! I wish I had an excuse to make the same bed!

Ray

[Randy Klein]

The posts are probably going to end up 2-7/8" square. The headboard and footboard rails are 1-1/8" thick. So what width and length should the mortise/tenons be for optimal strength?

Are you referring to side rail to post connection or the head/foot board rail to post connection?

If it is the head/foot board, those aren't weight bearing except for their own weight, so you need not worry about that connection.

The load is transferred via slats to side rails to posts to ground. So if you're talking about the side rails to post, most beds use a stub tenon, probably to give more room for a bed bolt.

Mine was half a domino long, so that was about an 1" long and no more than 1/2" thick. It's plenty strong since the bolt is what draws everything up tight.

[Andy Pedler]

Okay, I think I get it now.

For my side rails I'm planning to use the Rockler bed hardware, mortised into the post and rail.

For the horizontal headboard/footboard rails that have the panels floating in them, I plan to connect those to the posts with mortise/tenons.

From what you're saying, those aren't holding a ton of weight, so the tenons may not need to be super long and super strong. So maybe 1-1/2" long tenons would do. Any thoughts?

Andy - Newark, CA

[Randy Klein]

You are correct, they only hold themselves up so you don't have to over-build that joint.

[Wright Woodall]

Andy,

I dealt with a similar design when building my son's crib. See the legs I built here (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=89250). I cut the mortise part out of 3/4" stock before I glued it up with 1/1/8" pieces on either side, which made for really nice tight mortises, and then cut tenons on the rails. Stole that idea from some other crib plans. My legs are just shy of 3" (i planed them again after glue-up), and my rails 1 1/8" as well. FWIW, I think the proportions will look good for beds.

Later...


Wright

[Andy Pedler]

Thanks to those of you who answered some questions I had as I was starting the bunk bed project. This has been by far the biggest challenge I've taken on in the shop. I've learned a lot and even though some of the parts aren't quite as precise as I'd like, I think the kids will like their new bed anyhow.

Here's a picture from tonight with the beds bunked. I still need to sand everything and then let the kids paint them.

103003

Andy - Newark, CA

[Ray Schafer]

They look really awesome! Great job!

How did you end up doing the legs?

[Andy Pedler]

Hi Ray,

I wound up building the legs by laminating up 8/4 material. I initially built them about 3 to 3-1/8" square and then planed them down to 2-7/8" square.
If I had to do this again I'm not sure I'd go the same route. But then again, I'm not sure that any other process would be less work. However, getting the two long "halves" of the posts face-jointed properly so that they'd glue up clean was a lot of work. It probably would have been easier with a long-bed jointer, which I don't have. I built a planer sled to help with this but it was tedious to use.

Andy - Newark, CA