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James Jaragosky
08-26-2008, 5:31 PM
With my new cnc on the way I have been reconfiguring my shop alot (on paper:)) as to the best placement of all my equipment.
I am wondering if I will need easy access to all 4 sides of the machine or can I get by on just easy access to just 3 sides? Any major disadvantages to doing it this way?
I am thinking of putting an 8' side within 2 foot of a wall.

Michael Kowalczyk
08-26-2008, 7:17 PM
Hey James,
The manufacturer should have the specs for you. Just make sure you have access to any part on the CNC so you do not have to cut a hole in the side of your garage to get access to it because you needed 32" and you only had 23 7/8".

Sometimes you may need 2 or more people to load and unload a big 2" to 3"+ thick set of 36" x 108 entry doors.

I built a vacuum lift, using PIAB cups, their venturi vac and barn door track, to load mine by myself but once you 3D carve you tend to loose your suction area, so an extra set of hands are helpful. So make sure there is plenty of room for someone to be on that side if you still plan to do those behemoths.

On my old Digital 905 CNC, it had a 5 x 12 table top but I made a phenolic top so that the grids were set for a 4' x 8' area, I was able to access it from 1 side, the front, because it was a moving gantry table and I made a roller system on the extra 1 foot area so I could actually roll my stock into position without ever actually lifting the entire weight of the sheet. "Leverage" and smooth rollers. It did make it real difficult to replace bearings, belts and to re-square/align the table sometimes but I only had 1 place to put it and made the best of it.

Call you Camaster guy and ask him what the bare minimum clearance should be and go from there.

Paul Stelpflug
08-26-2008, 8:52 PM
James,
I had a 6X12 CNC in my 18 x 26 shop. I kept the long side about 18" from one wall and the short side about 3.5' from another. It was plenty of space for the operation. The machine I had was configured very similar to the Camaster I 'm getting. The no side rails and clear deck make sliding large flat work easy. There wasn't anything I couldn't do with the exception of high speed production where you are requiring all sides of the machine available for moving and cleaning parts and the table.You should be in good shape depending on how large your shop is. Most of the rest of my woodworking equipment was in an adjacent room so that was not an issue. I won't say I didn't want more room but I had to live with what I had. My new Camaster is a 5X10 with an ATC and a 4th axis so it should give me a little more space.

Paul

james mcgrew
08-26-2008, 9:28 PM
james, the camaster manual is on the website, there is an older and newer version.

my bit loading end (SPINDLE) faces the back wall with 48 inches of clearance the computer is also at this end, the wall side has 24 inches of clearance and i will be moving it to 30 or so inches soon

i just sent you the manual by email see page 12

jim

james mcgrew
08-26-2008, 9:30 PM
micheal, it was nice to meet you in atlanta, i wished i'd had more time to speak

jim

james mcgrew
08-26-2008, 9:37 PM
www.rbtoolsupply.com (http://www.rbtoolsupply.com)

has bits on sale for one month at 70% off

jim

James Jaragosky
08-27-2008, 10:45 AM
But I am getting a set with the machine and untill that arrives i have no idea what i will need.

Michael thanks for the advice as luck would have it Jim M. has seen your post and sent me a PDF of the manual and it does have have the clearance specs.
Thanks Jim.:)

Paul I'm with you on this space issue. With the open top design it should be ok if i leave 24 to 30 inches off one long wall. the open table design should make it easy to load and unload from the other 2 sides (the 4th being occupied by the gantry)

Thanks all I am off to paint some walls to keep SWMBO happy.
Jim J

Eric Mims
08-27-2008, 1:13 PM
I am figuring out the same thing as we speak.. putting my 5x8 (table is 10' long) in my 19x24 shop. Wish I had more room, but it'll have to do for now. I plan on putting the control box and spindle changing side toward the back wall and I'm still debating how far to keep the gantry from the wall.. I' rather not be caught between the gantry and the wall.. but that being said, I probably won't put it too far from the wall.

james mcgrew
08-27-2008, 1:39 PM
here ya go

Michael Kowalczyk
08-27-2008, 2:41 PM
micheal, it was nice to meet you in atlanta, i wished i'd had more time to speak

jim

Yes Jim, Nice to meet you also. Sorry you could not make it for dinner.I guess for now we can type but you have my # if you should need it.

It still amazes me how some of you guys cram so much stuff into a small space.

Pictured below is as follows:

on left is the twin head twin table Thermwood C42. it is in it.s own 1800+sf warehouse so space was not an issue for this one.

In the middle is the Thermwood C40 with the 4rth axis mounted. We built this room just for the CNC so we could install a dedicated HVAC unit. What you don't see is the 10x10 roll-up garage door.

on the right is our old Digital tool CNC. sorry for the grainy pic but this is from the early 90's. I put some notes on it to help explain. We put the 5hp Travaini vac above the table for 2 reasons. #1 to save space but #2 was to make it easier to change the oil. I put a hole in the deck so that the oil could pour into a 5 gallon bucket that had a holding bolt under the deck. Worked so good that I built a similar system for our twin table that has 2 vacs. I was not short on space so it went in the room to the left of the CNC with the compressor.

james mcgrew
08-27-2008, 3:06 PM
mike you are having fun!!

james mcgrew
08-27-2008, 8:33 PM
bits
http://magnate.net/index.cfm?event=s...Group&theID=57 (http://magnate.net/index.cfm?event=showProductGroup&theID=57)

http://www.amanatool.com/cncroutingdetails/rc-2257.html

http://www.precisebits.com/tutorials...eprocedure.htm (http://www.precisebits.com/tutorials/coletcareprocedure.htm)

http://beckwithdecor.com/index_files/Cutters.htm

on sale till sept 20 at 70%off

http://rbtoolsupply.com/6000_detail.html#down

collets for porter cable router

http://www.precisebits.com/products/...llets_nuts.asp (http://www.precisebits.com/products/equipment/pc_collets_nuts.asp)

amazon sells whiteside

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw...+cnc&x=12&y=14 (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/104-5280819-1994353?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=whiteside+cnc&x=12&y=14)

free dxf files

http://mydxf.blogspot.com/

the techno book still good reading

http://www.techno-isel.com/Education...ical%20section (http://www.techno-isel.com/Education1/H850/H850Cat.htm#_technical%20section)

a good pdf on vacuum

http://www.axyz.com/option%20pdfs/Va...ownDevices.pdf (http://www.axyz.com/option%20pdfs/VacuumHoldDownDevices.pdf)

amana bits

http://www.toolstoday.com/c-206-rout...inalmsnad71209 (http://www.toolstoday.com/c-206-router-bits.aspx?utm_source=msn&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=routerbits&utm_content=router_bits_by_amana_tool&utm_campaign=CtoolsusGrouterbits888originalmsnad71 209)

good old router bits .com

http://www.routerbits.com/

onsrud, best bit's i have used

https://www.onsrud.com/xdoc/wood

dover clip art, #1500 and 660 are good for vcarve, you can get these at barnes and noble

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw...dover+clip+art (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/104-5280819-1994353?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=dover+clip+art)

how's that for a good start!!

jim

james mcgrew
08-27-2008, 8:38 PM
uh oh ! i am still at it!
http://www.ballewsaw.com/

here is CAMasters supplier

http://www.southeasttool.com/

Ed Lang
08-27-2008, 8:55 PM
Centurion Tools LLC for solid carbide cutters.

http://www.centuriontools.com/

James Jaragosky
08-27-2008, 8:59 PM
bits
http://magnate.net/index.cfm?event=s...Group&theID=57 (http://magnate.net/index.cfm?event=showProductGroup&theID=57)

http://www.amanatool.com/cncroutingdetails/rc-2257.html

http://www.precisebits.com/tutorials...eprocedure.htm (http://www.precisebits.com/tutorials/coletcareprocedure.htm)

http://beckwithdecor.com/index_files/Cutters.htm

on sale till sept 20 at 70%off

http://rbtoolsupply.com/6000_detail.html#down

collets for porter cable router

http://www.precisebits.com/products/...llets_nuts.asp (http://www.precisebits.com/products/equipment/pc_collets_nuts.asp)

amazon sells whiteside

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw...+cnc&x=12&y=14 (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/104-5280819-1994353?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=whiteside+cnc&x=12&y=14)

free dxf files

http://mydxf.blogspot.com/

the techno book still good reading

http://www.techno-isel.com/Education...ical%20section (http://www.techno-isel.com/Education1/H850/H850Cat.htm#_technical%20section)

a good pdf on vacuum

http://www.axyz.com/option%20pdfs/Va...ownDevices.pdf (http://www.axyz.com/option%20pdfs/VacuumHoldDownDevices.pdf)

amana bits

http://www.toolstoday.com/c-206-rout...inalmsnad71209 (http://www.toolstoday.com/c-206-router-bits.aspx?utm_source=msn&utm_medium=cpc&utm_term=routerbits&utm_content=router_bits_by_amana_tool&utm_campaign=CtoolsusGrouterbits888originalmsnad71 209)

good old router bits .com

http://www.routerbits.com/

onsrud, best bit's i have used

https://www.onsrud.com/xdoc/wood

dover clip art, #1500 and 660 are good for vcarve, you can get these at barnes and noble

http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw...dover+clip+art (http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_ss_gw/104-5280819-1994353?url=search-alias%3Daps&field-keywords=dover+clip+art)

how's that for a good start!!

jim
Thanks jim that will help keep my mind on something for a while. it keeps drifting into the furture when i get to take delivery on my new camaster cr 408:D

James Jaragosky
08-27-2008, 9:02 PM
Centurion Tools LLC for solid carbide cutters.

http://www.centuriontools.com/
I can always use a good suppler of tools.
and a recommendation from a creeker is a Hugh plus in their favor.

james mcgrew
08-27-2008, 9:08 PM
would not want you to get bored!!

ed those are the best prices i have seen on carving ballnose bits !!!

jim mcgrew

james mcgrew
08-28-2008, 6:27 AM
hope you did not spend all night with these pages, just save them we will need some of them as time goes on



jim

James Jaragosky
08-28-2008, 9:49 AM
hope you did not spend all night with these pages, just save them we will need some of them as time goes on



jim
Is it night already? Man time fly's when your reading technical manuals.:eek:

Larry Bratton
08-28-2008, 7:49 PM
James,
I have a 50 x 100 table sitting close to a wall on the left side. I have been running the machine for 5 years and I can't think of a time I needed to get to that side other than walking around the table. Three sides works fine for me.

james mcgrew
08-28-2008, 8:04 PM
al right another "bill" hog owner, larry i purchased a 2000 bill hog and have retrofited it with new controller, drivers and motors, i will be painting it with the camaster yellow and have purchased a new one from bill and josh

good to meet you

jim mcgrew columbia sc

James Jaragosky
08-28-2008, 10:50 PM
James,
I have a 50 x 100 table sitting close to a wall on the left side. I have been running the machine for 5 years and I can't think of a time I needed to get to that side other than walking around the table. Three sides works fine for me.

I really appreciate you taking time to let me know how you have had success with your machine set up this way. I feel a little better knowing that this is a tried and proven set up.

Jim Dailey
08-29-2008, 12:44 AM
When you 1st think about a 48" x 96" machine fitting it into a shop it doesn't seem to 'cause much re-arranging.... "Seem...." :rolleyes:

Then you do the math... for example a Shopbot PRS with a 48" x 96" table is actually 79" by 120" overall or 6'7 by 10'

If the ideal setup includes a minimum of a 3' walk way around three sides plus 10' on the long "feed end".....

Then the "ideal" work/service area for a 48" x 96" table translates into 12'7 by 22' PLUS ideally a straight clear isle/path to your storage area for 4' x 8' sheet stock :eek: :eek: :eek: AND an adjacent staging area for assembly/finished goods :confused: :confused: :confused:

Yikes!!!!

I should mention that we just purchased a 48" x 96" Shopbot ... So my friend & I have both been following and are very appreciative of all the comments & insights of those who have experience using these machines.

jim

james mcgrew
08-29-2008, 7:21 AM
my cnc room

jim

Eric Mims
08-29-2008, 10:30 AM
That was one of the reasons I went with the Camaster Cobra machine. It doesn't have raised side rails, so you can get a sheet on there without lifting it over the rails or feeding it from the end. If I had someone helping me or a bigger shop, I suppose it wouldn't have mattered.

Got my ceiling finished and am expecting delivery next Wednesday. :)

Eric



When you 1st think about a 48" x 96" machine fitting it into a shop it doesn't seem to 'cause much re-arranging.... "Seem...." :rolleyes:

Then you do the math... for example a Shopbot PRS with a 48" x 96" table is actually 79" by 120" overall or 6'7 by 10'

If the ideal setup includes a minimum of a 3' walk way around three sides plus 10' on the long "feed end".....

Then the "ideal" work/service area for a 48" x 96" table translates into 12'7 by 22' PLUS ideally a straight clear isle/path to your storage area for 4' x 8' sheet stock :eek: :eek: :eek: AND an adjacent staging area for assembly/finished goods :confused: :confused: :confused:

Yikes!!!!

I should mention that we just purchased a 48" x 96" Shopbot ... So my friend & I have both been following and are very appreciative of all the comments & insights of those who have experience using these machines.

jim

james mcgrew
08-29-2008, 5:45 PM
eric you should get the software, o switch languages pull down the edit tool bar commands and there will be a option for english!

takes a few minutes but is easy after that

jim

Eric Mims
08-29-2008, 7:51 PM
excellent Jim!! I look forward to it, thanks again!

james mcgrew
10-23-2008, 2:49 PM
your machine is third one on right, this was taken before z truck and rails were on!!

james mcgrew
10-28-2008, 11:19 AM
james it was nice to see you again at camaster yesterday, here is the famous "thumbs up!!"

jim

James Jaragosky
10-29-2008, 5:25 PM
Got it inside late last night and placed it today.
I need to pick up some bits to run a file.
Here it is in its new home.
I love the color Camaster used.

Michael Kowalczyk
10-29-2008, 5:52 PM
Hey James,
Glad to see it made it to your garage finally. Sorry you aren't closer because I have a bunch of 22"-24" CRT's for 10-15.00 each that would be a nice addition for you. Dual screens is the way to go. Also unless you have another PC inside the house I would upgrade your chair to one that has a bit more padding because you will probably be spending a lot more time there now.;)

Nice organization on the wall there. Looking forward to seeing some of your "Inspired" work. Pun intended.

james mcgrew
10-29-2008, 9:40 PM
excellent!! glad to see you made it home last night!

let me know if you need any thing, i now have the ability to do on screen live work

jim

James Jaragosky
10-29-2008, 10:36 PM
Hey James,
Glad to see it made it to your garage finally. Sorry you aren't closer because I have a bunch of 22"-24" CRT's for 10-15.00 each that would be a nice addition for you. Dual screens is the way to go. Also unless you have another PC inside the house I would upgrade your chair to one that has a bit more padding because you will probably be spending a lot more time there now.;)

Nice organization on the wall there. Looking forward to seeing some of your "Inspired" work. Pun intended.


Mike thanks for the kind words.
I actually have 6 desk tops and a lap top. The lap top does not see much use, as I prefer a full size machine and all the power that comes with it.
That picture was purposely taken as not to show the other two bays of my garage, that are currently very disorganized. (This will change soon now that the CNC Router is now in place).
I do have a real computer chair for the garage machines; it was at the computer running the laser at the time of the photo.
I will do all my cad /cam and creative work on one of the two machines in my computer room, where I have one unit with duel monitors and one on a single monitor. All my monitors are 19 wide screen LCD FPDS high res.
Thanks for the offer of the crts, that is a good price. If I did live closer I would pick up 3 or 4. The garage computer running the CNC router is just an overpriced controller, so that screen should work fine.

As far as Aspire is concerned, I sent an email to Vetric tonight asking to purchase the upgrade. Now Ill have to wait until I get instructions on how to make an upgrade purchase.

My only real regret is that I cannot find any suitable router bits locally, and will have order some online tomorrow and wait before I can start any practice work.

I was pleasantly surprised to find out that my 4x8 cnc router has a 10 bed, and my 6s of clearance was adjusted to 9. Camaster explained to me, that in order to get me my machine delivered in my requested time frame, that rather than order or manufacture the parts for my size machine (4x8) that they used some off the shelf stock parts and gave me the upgrades for free.
They also upgraded me to win cnc over mach3 so it would be easier to help me with any future problems I might have, It seems I am the only guy to have requested mach3, and they felt that with all the current Camaster machines running win cnc that it would be easier on them and me.
Thanks Camaster you just made a sweet deal even better, I really appreciate it. I am really happy with the people and product from Camaster.
I am one excited Camhead right now.
Jim J.

james mcgrew
10-30-2008, 8:00 AM
james, you will need 90 and 60 degree v bits to use vcarve but you will want some tapered ballnose carving bits for 3d, the best bits are onsrud 77-100 series bits
https://www.onsrud.com/

i use 77-104 mostly

https://www.onsrud.com/xdoc/TaperBits


here is one but does not have 1/16th taper ballnose

http://www.centuriontools.com/router_bits_toolcase/centurion_tools_showcase.html?cart=121988597551344 06&splashPG=y&__max=6&pageID=1&id2=735&startat=1&--woSECTIONSdatarq=735&--SECTIONSword=ww

collets for pc router

http://www.precisebits.com/products/equipment/pc_collets_nuts.asp

tapered ballnose

http://beckwithdecor.com/index_files/Cutters.htm

james mcgrew
10-30-2008, 8:18 AM
james, i also have some 1/2 inch clear acrylic if you want to build a larger dust boot

jim

Michael Kowalczyk
10-30-2008, 2:07 PM
Gee some guys get all the breaks.:cool: 25% longer table and 33.3% higher "Z" clearance for NADA, ZIP, Zilch, Neetz, NC. Just be glad you did not have to knock a hole in the wall to accommodate the extra 2 feet.

Surprised they didn't through in a complete set of solid carbide bits for 2D and 3d work:D.

James Jaragosky
10-30-2008, 2:32 PM
Gee some guys get all the breaks.:cool: 25% longer table and 33.3% higher "Z" clearance for NADA, ZIP, Zilch, Neetz, NC. Just be glad you did not have to knock a hole in the wall to accommodate the extra 2 feet.

Surprised they didn't through in a complete set of solid carbide bits for 2D and 3d work:D.

They did throw in about 7 bits. All high quality, but not any good for carving or sign making.
I just returned from Rockler and they have a deal on the house brand carbide tipped router bits at $10 each for the smaller sizes and $40 each for the really big stuff
I am going to post this information in the deals section. I got 18 bits, the wife is going to kill me.:D

james mcgrew
01-07-2009, 8:11 AM
installed vacuum pump for the x3 508 yesterday and put dust collector on top. after we built the tower with the arms we named it " tony the tower" after an employee that was not at work yesterday.

jim