crosscut sled - make or buy?

[julie Graf]

any suggestions here?

i seem to routinely cross cut 15-25 inch boards, and my sled just got ruined in a small flood. ( i had it on the floor. no.no.) i wasn't real happy with the sled, it was homemade in a hurry.

so what are the good options out there?
spend the time to make a good one? (plans?)
buy one?

[Jamie Buxton]

Build it. A sled is such a simple thing that it isn't worth the hassle of buying one. The only small challenge is setting the fence at 90 degrees. Search around on this forum, and you'll find several different approachs.

[Prashun Patel]

I really like the integrated stopblock in this design from Woodsmithshop.

While I really love the lightness of this design, the problem is that there's no cutoff support. You could make a dropoff piece that sits stationary in the 2nd miter slot, but the only benefit of this vis-a-vis a 2-runner system is that it's easier to make (since you don't have to glue 2 runners simultaneously to the bottom of the sled)

Every design I've seen uses 3/4" stock for the deck. I don't understand why. I prefer to use 1/4" hardboard. It's lighter and smoother than ply, and allows you to cut taller stock. Of course, for stability, then you gotta add a leading fence. I like THAT idea too, bkz then you can straddle the 2 fences with lexan to make a blade guard.

[Jim Becker]

I'm a "build" fan for this kind of thing, Julie. There is a very nice article in a recent issue of Fine Woodworking for a great cross cut sled design, too.

[Joe Scharle]

This one has lasted for 2-3 years (pic 1, shown squaring a table top). The reason I make them heavy is so that neither the workpiece nor blade will deflect the tracking. This one is 24 X 36, uses an Incra track and hangs on a couple if nails. If it were a 2 runner sled, it would have to have tall & heavy fore and aft fences to hold it together (pic2).

Joe

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/194/thumbs/Fly_Leaf_Table_3_1.JPG (http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/194/Fly_Leaf_Table_3_1.JPG)

http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/194/thumbs/Small_Sled_2.jpg (http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/194/Small_Sled_2.jpg)

[Dewey Torres]

Julie,
This is something you need to make. As a matter of fact... can you buy one? Incra makes a sled similar to the PDF file shown here but it is expensive. My advise is find some simple plans (I stress simple). Make your own and be very carful to get it square.
It will help you build your skills and going with the very simple, you can easily modify your next one to suit your needs. You will build many of these over the years as they wear out or you see the need for new accessories or different sizes.

as for plans see these links. Caution, possibilities are almost endless:

http://www.geotekds.com/sled/index.htm (http://www.geotekds.com/sled/index.htm)

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/howto_crosscut.htm (http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/howto_crosscut.htm)

http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodworking-plans/tablesaw/crosscut-sled/ (http://www.woodmagazine.com/woodworking-plans/tablesaw/crosscut-sled/)

http://www.toolcrib.com/blog/2008/05/30/toolcribcoms-ultimate-guide-to-the-crosscut-sled/ (http://www.toolcrib.com/blog/2008/05/30/toolcribcoms-ultimate-guide-to-the-crosscut-sled/)

[Tom Walz]

I'll second Mr. Becker on this. Just got it yesterday.

[Greg Cole]

Hi Julie,
Like many things, the answer is it depends. I wanted one sled for as many functions as I could integrate.
Personally I made one. BB 3/4 ply for the base. Yes it limits the thickness you can cut, but not like I cross cut any 2 by stuff.
I used a front and rear fence (Incra track that allows for use of stop blocks and has a T track slot etc) with 2 T tracks on each side of the blade. Straddling the blade allows for a shield to be installed over the blade and supports the drop-off cut nicely.
The blade kerf is dead center which some what limits the cross cut length some, but with 4 hold downs in the T track I still cross cut 40+ inches easily. I can fit up to a 24" wide piece between fences & the double T tracks allow for making miters etc etc etc.
I purchased Incra runners for the sled so as to not have to fiddle with wood ones or make any out of something like uhmw.
Also used 1/4" MDF for a changeable kerf plate.
Were I to buy one I'd most likely buy the Incra 5000 or Miter Express.
Dubby sleds are one ya never hear anything bad about either.

Greg

[Denny Rice]

Julie,

Build your sled...Norm has some really good plans out there for a really good crosscut sled. It doesn't cost a lot, and it probably took no more than an hour to build.

[Prashun Patel]

...it probably took no more than an hour to build.

I always find a way to make 'hour' long projects last 2 days.

[julie Graf]

I always find a way to make 'hour' long projects last 2 days.

i'm with you on that one, shawn.

my original thought was that if i bought it - it might be lighter. my old sled, which was easy enough to make, was a bear to use. HEAVY. and i wasn't real happy with it.

but i used wood slides and a wood fence, perhaps i could use other materials. i will take a look at the plans mentioned above.

i need a fairly large sled - big enough to support for a 40-60 inch long panel 24 inches wide. i've had to cut these sizes for several projects the past few months...

[Jim Cunningham]

Build it for sure. Go to the Highland Hardware website. They have step by step plans to build one and it's a good one. They tell in detail how to insure it's square.

[Prashun Patel]

I hear you on the weight issue. That's what I hated about my last one.

A single-runner model might work better for you. I'd still clamp a support piece (or lock it down in the miter slot) on the cutoff side.

This will make the sled significantly lighter to position on the saw, and to push through. It'll also eliminate the need for a leading fence.

It may also allow you to use it with the guard/splitter in place.

Build the trailing fence wide enough to support on top a couple toggle clamps for holding stock down.

Go with the 1/4" hardboard on the deck...

[Jerome Hanby]

I built mine and use it all the time. In fact I'll probably build a larger/better one shortly. But I'm dedicating my change jar to saving for an Incra Miter 5000. Seems to me that would cover sled use AND give a great way to cut miters...

[Mark Carlson]

Julie,

I would make one. I'm off today and I'm going to make a 2 runner sled. This is my preference for single versus double runners. If your looking to trim wide panels make a single runner sled. Then you only need the back fence. If your looking to crosscut smaller pieces to size make a 2 runner sled. When cross cutting I like the sled to carry the work versus having it drop off the sled and possible catch the saw blade.

I'm going to use a piece of 1/2 baltic birch. Its always nice to have some baltic birch around for jigs. Its stable and flat and not heavy like 3/4 plywood or mdf.

Note: The finewoodworking.com site has a bunch of plans for various sleds. You might need to subscribe to see them though. I pay a yearly fee but I think its worth it.


~mark

[Brian D Anderson]

Yeah, build it. I had fun building mine. Use it as a learning experience.

http://www.jfreitasphotography.com/Temp/Sled1.jpg

http://www.jfreitasphotography.com/Temp/Sled2.jpg

http://www.jfreitasphotography.com/Temp/Sled4.jpg

-Brian

[glenn bradley]

Build it. If you're not into the ones that look like serving trays (although they are pretty) you can build one in a couple hours. Here's my large and 'regular' sized ones:
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=76667&d=1197145807

[Dewey Torres]

A better question here... has onyone seen these for sale?

I mean a true sled with dual runners?

[Jerome Hanby]

A better question here... has onyone seen these for sale?

I mean a true sled with dual runners?

Would a Double Dubby fit that description?

[Gary McKown]

Three suggestions: Use (2!) Incra runners that you can tweak for tight fit in the slots, and can adjust for squareness. To reduce weight, use thinner material for the body - thin enough and the flatness becomes a function of the saw table top (I used 9 mm baltic birch only because of the countersunk tweaking screws). And to further reduce the heft, use lightweight material for the fences. I used some (very old) 5/4 redwood that is straight, stable, quite strong, and about as lightweight as it gets.

The Incra bars come with fairly decent instructions for building and calibrating a sled, and they sometimes go on sale at Rockler, for example. Oh, get the 24" ones for a sled the size you are talking.

[Dennis Lopeman]

while you are at it... why not make multiple sleds?

I'm thinking about it, too... folks are complaining that they tend to be heavy...

How about making several?? Small ones for small stuff, and that big one for the big stuff? I think people tend to try to build the "all-inclusive" model...

[John Gregory]

I had a commerical sled, I don't recall the brand but it retailed for $250 please shipping. I bought from local guy for $100 and it was great. Accurate with lots of features. BUT it was large and very heavy. In my small shop I did not have a good place to store it. At the time I had some back pain so it took my wife and I to put it on the saw table. So I sold it for $100 on Craig's list and bought the Woodpecker miter express, http://www.woodpeck.com/incramiterexpress.html I already had the miter gauge 1000SE. The combination is very accurate, light weight and easy to use. Easy to store too. I have done several 45* miters on it and the joints were perfect. This combination works for me.

Oh, by the way, my first sled was home built and worked great. I am just a tool hound. :D

You have lots a suggestions now. Do what works best for you. Lots of those shop made sleds are awesome looking. Have fun whatever you do.

[Chuck Tringo]

I actually got the rockler sled, and love it for the few angled cuts and shorter corsscuts that I do. Will probable get rid of my Incra V27 in fact. I dont love the length ston on it however, it rocks a little when loose and when you tighten it the position can change ever so slightly. For strict 90 degree cuts I plan to build my own. The one in Fine Wood Working was ok, but i prefer to have dual runners to support both sides of the workpiece. I plan to modify one of the dual runner designs so that the workpiece is to the right of the blade where it can be supported by the saw table and I dont have to use an auxiliary work support. I'm left handed anyways so I like to do thing backwards anyhoo....

[Jerry Olexa]

Build it...You can set it up exactly how YOU want it for ease of use...FWW had a good article/plan a few years ago that I used for guidance...G'Luck

[Johnny Kleso]

I think shipping cost would be as high as the sled cost..

For wide boards put fence at front..
I also have a small sled with fence at back...

[John Keeton]

Yeah, build it. I had fun building mine. Use it as a learning experience.

http://www.jfreitasphotography.com/Temp/Sled1.jpg

http://www.jfreitasphotography.com/Temp/Sled2.jpg

http://www.jfreitasphotography.com/Temp/Sled4.jpg

-Brian
Brian, that's not a tool! It's a piece of furniture! Did you get a sick feeling when you raised the blade through it? Nice work.

[John Stevens]

my original thought was that if i bought it - it might be lighter.

Buy it and get back to work! :)

You're a professional woodworker--you don't need to make a sled to improve your competence...as if you're just an aspiring journeyman or something. Sheesh. Besides, if you don't make stuff to sell, you can't pay the rent.

If most of the things you make are from plans and templates, then you're knocking out dozens of salable items at a fast clip. Think of how many you could make in the time, however short, it would take you to make another sled. After you factor in the cost of your time (measured in lost sales), you probably can't afford to make a sled. That's not a bad thing, it's a good thing, because it means you're putting your time to its highest-valued use.

Regards,

John

[John Stevens]

Brian, that's not a tool! It's a piece of furniture!

Yeah, think of the nice piece of furniture that didn't get made while he was making that instead. ;)

Regards,

John

[Brian D Anderson]

Yeah mine's total overkill. I'm totally aware of that. :D I'm still new at this (< year), so I'm working my way up to furniture. Though I did just make a sofa table. I like practicing with hardwoods for shop jigs and furniture. It's nice to get a feel for working with the various types of hardwoods.

-Brian

BTW, the runners are Kreg and they're great. They come in 30" lengths and have the set screws along the length for adjustment.

[julie Graf]

Buy it and get back to work! :)

After you factor in the cost of your time (measured in lost sales), you probably can't afford to make a sled.

haha! EXACTLY!

but, i am not sure that i have found a product i like. in the end, i think i will make one for my larger needs, and perhaps look at the incra for my smaller needs, mostly because it would be nice to have something nice for miter cuts also.

there are some great plans out there, and thanks all for the suggestions. i am def. going to buy the t-tracks and runners this time, and i have some 5/8 BB i can use instead of 3/4 (not much difference, but some)

sleds are great, and it makes sense to have more than one for different purposes. i've just been too lazy (or busy!) in the past to make more than one.

[Brian Patterson]

if you did build your own i recommend using this method to square up your fence...

http://www.thewoodshop.20m.com/five_cut_method_swf.htm

[Matthew Voss]

Build it. If you're not into the ones that look like serving trays (although they are pretty) you can build one in a couple hours.


Agreed - they don't have to be pretty, just square.

I have a few that are simply 1/2" shop ply and a couple of jointed 2x4s. Built in less than a couple of hours.

[Tony Bilello]

I'm about to make a sled and was wondering .....
1). Can i use high density polyethylene? This is a slick feeling plastic that is normally is used in plastic cuttin boards and is slick.
2). Should the guide bars/runners be raised slightly off the bottom of the slot so as not to drag OR should they be cut slightly oversized and ride the bottom of the slot and raise the sled bed slightly (maybe 1/16") so as to put all of the sliding friction on the runners as opposed to the all of the friction on the sled bed?
3) What should the bed be made of? I saw somewhere that they recommended 3/4" MDF. That seems awful heavy.
Thanks in advance.

Tony B

[Prashun Patel]

You can make it out of whatever you want - as long as it's stable.

I would cut the runners so the sled rides flush on the saw top. A well-maintained should ride like butter.

[Greg Muller]

I love my Double Dubby!

I can use either one side, or the other, or both together for large panels.
I subscribe to the " I wanna build furniture, not jigs" view.


Greg

[Paul Johnstone]

i'm with you on that one, shawn.

my original thought was that if i bought it - it might be lighter. my old sled, which was easy enough to make, was a bear to use. HEAVY. and i wasn't real happy with it.

but i used wood slides and a wood fence, perhaps i could use other materials. i will take a look at the plans mentioned above.

i need a fairly large sled - big enough to support for a 40-60 inch long panel 24 inches wide. i've had to cut these sizes for several projects the past few months...

Julie,

I used a homemade sled for a long time. I was really fussy about getting everything lined up, and it took an entire day, and it wasn't fun adjusting..
I also made mine huge, so it was heavy and took up a lot of space.

If you have the $$, the Jessem sliding table is a dream. It is not cheap, but I got one off ebay below the normal price. It won't crosscut a full sheet, but it will go up to a 34" (IIRC) crossuct.

Edit: After reading the rest of the thread, I found out you do this for your livelyhood.. IMO, if you are doing this fulltime, the Jessem is a no brainer..



Anyhow, before buying a sled, I'd spend the money on the Jessem.. But they are pricey, I admit that.

[david kramer]

I'm about to make a sled and was wondering
2). Should the guide bars/runners be raised slightly off the bottom of the slot so as not to drag OR should they be cut slightly oversized and ride the bottom of the slot and raise the sled bed slightly (maybe 1/16") so as to put all of the sliding friction on the runners as opposed to the all of the friction on the sled bed?


I would recommend some clearance between the runners and the bottom of the slot to allow for buildup of sawdust.

David

[John Stevens]

I'm still new at this (< year), so I'm working my way up to furniture.

Brian, that jig is nicer than most of the furniture in my house. You're ready for prime time!

Regards,

John

[Jay MacDougall]

A better question here... has onyone seen these for sale?

I mean a true sled with dual runners?

These guys make a few, including this one which I've been contemplating for some time.
http://woodhaven.com/ProductDetail.asp?Id=1112

[glenn bradley]

[quote=julie Graf;894284]my original thought was that if i bought it - it might be lighter.quote]

Just a thought . . . most of the commercial units that I have seen (that would only be four different ones, not a complete list for sure) MDF and heavy for their size. Of course they are usually small so they will not meet your size requirement.

[Nissim Avrahami]

Hi Julie

I made a few sleds - on one runner and two runners.

I don't make any "2 cut test"......"5 cut test" nor any adjustments to the fence and they cut straight from the first second.

Here is the last picture of the post....after this picture comes "Put your board on the sled and cut".

http://i208.photobucket.com/albums/bb151/matsukawa/Crosscut%20sled/38.jpg

I'm so confident with this method that nowadays I "super glue" the fence to the sled...

If you are interested, you can see all the post here
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=64448

Regards
niki

[Brian D Anderson]

BTW, I used niki's method when I made my sled above. It got me to make a couple copies of my plastic engineers triangle out of mdf. Thanks niki!

-Brian

[Nissim Avrahami]

Thank you Brian

Oh yes, I rolled up and I've seen that I posted also the "Triangle - Copy & Past".

Using the 2 triangles method, actually aligns the fence to exactly 90° to the miter slots that is the most important alignment for any sled or miter gauge to cut at 90°.

The blade alignment to "parallel to the slot" in not important and has nothing to do with 90° cut but, we should align it to prevent rough cuts, burn marks and wider kerf (almost every blade has wider kerf than the "published" one because of "run outs" and flattering).

After setting the Miter gauge fence, the "Half sled" (on one runner) or "Full sled" (on 2 runners) to 90° to the Miter slot, you can use it to very fine tune (or align) the blade to the miter slot.

Regards
niki

[Prashun Patel]

Man am I jealous of that riving knife that can stay on when using the sled....

[Joe Jensen]

Here are a couple of commercial versions.
http://www.woodhaven.com/Category.asp?Id=60

[Nissim Avrahami]

Man am I jealous of that riving knife that can stay on when using the sled....

I don't think that you would be so jealous if you knew that this simple Aluminum top table saw costs here around $2,500:mad:...I think that it would not cost more than $1000 in USA but considering the fact that it "Made in the country of Festool", I might be wrong...:)

Regards
niki

[Greg Hines, MD]

There was a good design in one of the recent magazines, I forget which one, but you could adjust the offcut support to handle dados and other odd cutters, such as a molding head.

I built my sled out of 1/2" MDF, and it has held up well. I did use UMHW for the runner, and I did also make a cutoff support with a cleat that locks it in the miter slot, which really helps with not dinging the offcut.

Doc

[Mike Henderson]

There was a good design in one of the recent magazines, I forget which one, but you could adjust the offcut support to handle dados and other odd cutters, such as a molding head.

I built my sled out of 1/2" MDF, and it has held up well. I did use UMHW for the runner, and I did also make a cutoff support with a cleat that locks it in the miter slot, which really helps with not dinging the offcut.

Doc
I really need to make one like that so I don't have to have two sleds - one for regular crosscuts and one for dado and cuts with the blade tilted. Even if I had to replace the insert often, it would be worth it. I'm going to look into this - thanks for posting that "reminder".

Mike

[Maybe we can get Niki to design one.]

[Mark Singer]

I have always made mine and they are really good!

[Charles McKinley]

I really like the SmartMiter. I am debating if I should sell it as I had to sell my table saw over a year ago.

[Samuel Brooks]

I also like the build that everyone else is saying.

But with that Length, I would recommend that you either use a saw guide system like EZ Smart or make up zero clearance insert for a handheld saw and use a fence. Too increase the accuracy, make the zero clearance have an extension to wrap around a guide like an EZ-Clamp Guide so you can just push the saw and not worry about guiding it during the cut. With something that long you are just asking for it to move when sliding it on the crosscut sled because the sled fence will flex on you with that much width. Better to move the cutter over the piece then to move the piece over the cutter.

I have the Incra crosscut sled which works great and I use it quite often, but even though the fence allows me to do something like 45" I due to put much of anything though other then maybe a 1/4" due to the overall weight issue. I find that the work likes to pivot on me even with it being clamped down, or tries to lift the crosscut sled out of the guide track. Even though it is a T slot the play from the lift kills the 90% cut that I am trying to make. Also with only one guide rail it really fights you.

Also this can be done with a router and a straight edge bit and a guide against a fence as another option.

Sam