Carbide knives for DW735 planer

[Brian W Evans]

Just an FYI. I got an email today announcing carbide blades for the DW735 (http://www.infinitytools.com/products.asp?dept=1111) planer. They're made by/for Infinity (http://www.infinitytools.com). They're only one-sided (can't flip 'em over like the steel version), but Infinity says you can resharpen the carbide ones "multiple times."

They're priced at $249, but if you order this week they're $199. This price seems to be more or less in line with Infinity's other carbide-tipped blades. They are a bit pricey compared with other companies' generic (not for DW735), carbide-tipped blades, however.

Not sure if this is a good deal or not, but I thought I'd throw it out there to see what everyone thinks.


Disclaimer: I have no affiliation with Infinity other than having ordered a catalog from them once.

[Bruce Benjamin]

I'm really curious to see how these work out. I'm a big fan of Infinity and I have the DW735 planer. Frankly, I haven't had the problems with blade longevity that some people have had but they can't last for ever.

In my opinion, Infinity blades and bits are as good as or better than any other brand out there. I would be surprised if these new planer blades don't live up to their reputation for high quality. Their regular prices are generally about average for premium quality but they have frequent sales and that's when you can get a really good deal. Regardless of the prices I've paid though, I've always got a premium product.

That being said, $200, (on sale) is quite a bit of $$ considering that's about 4 complete sets of the standard Dewalt planer blades. And 4 standard blades have 8 cutting surfaces. 8 cutting surfaces should last for quite a while for the average hobbiest. One thing to remember is that when the blades get nicked up you can shift one blade at a time to keep the nicks from showing up on your workpiece. I don't know how many times I've shifted the blades on mine to get a smooth surface. Of course that doesn't keep them sharp but so far I've had pretty good luck with that too. Carbide should last a lot longer than the HSS blades though so I'm interested to see how they work out for the first few buyers. Hopefully they will keep us 735 owners posted on the subject.

Bruce

[Vic Damone]

$249., (with a very sarcastic tone) perfect! I wish I was one of those 735 owners who've hadn't any blade issues. I'm sick and tired of throwing time and money at these yellow plastic clad power tools. I'm de whupped.

Vic

[Eddie Darby]

$249 !!! Snikies, just two set's of blades are more than the cost of the unit!:eek::eek::eek:

[David Venditto]

Our new carbide-tipped knives (http://www.infinitytools.com/products.asp?dept=1111) for the DeWalt 735 planer cost 4x more than than our HSS version but they should last about 10x longer. At $250 for the set they're not cheap but they are a great value and you can have them resharpened several times because they are thicker than the HSS knives. For people who use their machine often this will solve the problem of always having to replace the standard knives. Most of you don't use steel router bits or saw blades anymore, same concept here really.

Till the end of this week you can pick-up a set for $199.90, please report you're results back to the forum when you've given them a good run. Our first sets will ship in Sept.

As always, thanks for your support.

David Venditto
Infinity Tools

[Brian W Evans]

Not trying to pick nits here but, since the carbide knives are single-sided, they will really only last 5X as long as the steel version. Also, spare knife sets are often available on eBay for $35 +/-. This makes the carbide versions much more expensive by comparison.

All this being said, if you can avoid nicks and have a reasonably priced sharpening service, maybe the carbide knives would be worthwhile.

I suspect, though, that people will balk at paying such a large percentage of the original cost of the planer for a set of knives.

[Mike Shields]

Our new carbide-tipped knives (http://www.infinitytools.com/products.asp?dept=1111) for the DeWalt 735 planer cost 4x more than than our HSS version but they should last about 10x longer. At $250 for the set they're not cheap but they are a great value and you can have them resharpened several times because they are thicker than the HSS knives. For people who use their machine often this will solve the problem of always having to replace the standard knives. Most of you don't use steel router bits or saw blades anymore, same concept here really.

Till the end of this week you can pick-up a set for $199.90, please report you're results back to the forum when you've given them a good run. Our first sets will ship in Sept.

As always, thanks for your support.

David Venditto
Infinity Tools

As a 735 owner, I'm sure hesitant to consider that amount, regardless of the quality. I mean the tool only costs $450.

What are the sharpening fees for these carbide blades?

[Clifford Mescher]

Our new carbide-tipped knives (http://www.infinitytools.com/products.asp?dept=1111) for the DeWalt 735 planer cost 4x more than than our HSS version but they should last about 10x longer. At $250 for the set they're not cheap but they are a great value and you can have them resharpened several times because they are thicker than the HSS knives. For people who use their machine often this will solve the problem of always having to replace the standard knives. Most of you don't use steel router bits or saw blades anymore, same concept here really.

Till the end of this week you can pick-up a set for $199.90, please report you're results back to the forum when you've given them a good run. Our first sets will ship in Sept.

As always, thanks for your support.

David Venditto
Infinity Tools
David
Do you manufacture carbide blades for the 733? Clifford

[jason lambert]

blade cost and tool cost is really not related to each other. I can buy a $40 router and put in a $60 blade and it will cut well. Or buy a $500 joiner and put on a $500 spirel head. The dewalt machine is robust and lasts if a good cutter costs 1/2 the price of the machine so be it. To me it is just a matter of if it makes sense. Beside it will save wood that would have a less than perfect surface because of a semi dull cutter.

[Peter Quinn]

I'm thrilled to hear that carbide knives are now available for the 735 planer, and even more thrilled to hear that Infinity is behind this. Good company to deal with, nice products. I've been holding on to my 735 planner in hopes that carbide would become available. I haven't had the abysmal knife problems that some have reported, but the stock knife longevity hasn't exactly been stellar either. I think the heat generated by that high speed head is what kills the edge quick on the HSS inserts. HSS in a typical induction motor driven head seems to last far longer, perhaps the slower speed creates less heat?

My need for carbide knives is occasional, and when I need them I'm looking for quick installation and set up. At work there is one old 20" Powermatic with a terminus head which typically runs HSS knives, but the boss keeps a set of carbide knives for the occasional run of teak or other very difficult species. The knives go in ONLY WHEN NECESSARY. Ever tried running one of these species through HSS? Just not possible. I am not in a position to spend for a terminus head or SHELIX set up for my own small shop presently. I suppose I could get carbide tipped knives for my 15" delta, but the installation time is far greater, and I don't need to run carbide all the time. Having the ability to switch to carbide quickly and easily for the occasional piece will be a great boon to me.

I fail to see the relevance of the cost of the tooling versus the cost of the machine. I have only a small investment in shaper tooling and at present it has cost me 3X what the used machine did. Should I not buy tooling because of the cost and use the shaper as a giant paper weight? I think the 735 planer is a unique tool brought to market at a fair price that offers the hobbiest or small shop the closest thing to industrial performance available in a compact format. Knives are always going to be relatively expensive when factored against the cost of such a reasonably priced machine. Carbide straight knives are expensive for any machine and are not necessary for every wood worker nor every species.

My local tool grinding service charges $.60/inch for HSS straight knives, and around $2.40 per inch for carbide, so yes expect sharpening to cost more too. Perhaps for some the 10-15X life span of carbide versus HSS will make it cost effective to use carbide as the primary cutting edge on the 735? For others HSS will make more sense. When I need to make a teak door threshold for a client, I frankly don't have much choice and am thrilled that the option has become available. It will give new purpose to what has become mostly a $450 paper weight for me.

[Mike Henderson]

Our new carbide-tipped knives (http://www.infinitytools.com/products.asp?dept=1111) for the DeWalt 735 planer cost 4x more than than our HSS version but they should last about 10x longer. At $250 for the set they're not cheap but they are a great value and you can have them resharpened several times because they are thicker than the HSS knives. For people who use their machine often this will solve the problem of always having to replace the standard knives. Most of you don't use steel router bits or saw blades anymore, same concept here really.

Till the end of this week you can pick-up a set for $199.90, please report you're results back to the forum when you've given them a good run. Our first sets will ship in Sept.

As always, thanks for your support.

David Venditto
Infinity Tools

David - thank you for posting here. Couple of questions: The blades on the 735 are indexed. When sharpening the carbide blades I assume you have to make sure that the same amount is taken off each blade so that they align - true? Also, as the blade is sharpened and wears back, how does this affect the operation. It seems that the cutting edge would get closer to the drum that holds the blades and this would change the relationship between the feed rollers and the blades. Any problem with the cutting edge being closer to the drum (such as clearance for chips)? Any problem with the changing relationship between the feed rollers and the cutting edge (such as excess movement of the feed rollers or the feed rollers reaching the end of their travel)?

Mike

[Bruce Benjamin]

Not trying to pick nits here but, since the carbide knives are single-sided, they will really only last 5X as long as the steel version. Also, spare knife sets are often available on eBay for $35 +/-. This makes the carbide versions much more expensive by comparison.

All this being said, if you can avoid nicks and have a reasonably priced sharpening service, maybe the carbide knives would be worthwhile.

I suspect, though, that people will balk at paying such a large percentage of the original cost of the planer for a set of knives.

Brian, you're making an assumption that David meant the carbide blades will last 10 times longer than a single side of the HSS blades. How do you know he didn't mean 10 times longer than both sides of the HSS blades combined? That was what I assumed he meant.

When you buy those $35 Ebay knives, how much extra do you pay for shipping? Ebay sellers are notorious for insane shipping and, "Handling" charges. What level of customer service do you get if there just happens to be a problem with the knives? It's not likely there will be a problem but it's possible. With Infinity you not only get great customer service but those blades are shipped to you for free. After spending $200 or $250 that may not seem like a big deal but since you brought up a $35 HSS Ebay set I thought I'd point this out.

I paid about $175 for my Freud router. It's not my only router but it's my main router so I'll use it as an example. It didn't even come with any router bits, obviously. I have no idea how many hundreds of dollars worth of router bits I have that go along with that router. Several times the price of the router I'm sure. See my point?

Bruce

[Wade Lippman]

David - thank you for posting here. Couple of questions: The blades on the 735 are indexed. When sharpening the carbide blades I assume you have to make sure that the same amount is taken off each blade so that they align - true? Also, as the blade is sharpened and wears back, how does this affect the operation. It seems that the cutting edge would get closer to the drum that holds the blades and this would change the relationship between the feed rollers and the blades. Any problem with the cutting edge being closer to the drum (such as clearance for chips)? Any problem with the changing relationship between the feed rollers and the cutting edge (such as excess movement of the feed rollers or the feed rollers reaching the end of their travel)?

Mike

What he said, and what (including freight) do you charge for sharpening the carbide knives?

[Mike Shields]

I fail to see the relevance of the cost of the tooling versus the cost of the machine. I have only a small investment in shaper tooling and at present it has cost me 3X what the used machine did. Should I not buy tooling because of the cost and use the shaper as a giant paper weight?

The relevance to everything is: cost!

Yes, you should (and have to) buy tooling, but for me ,there is a limit that I can afford, and $250 for 1 blade set is not what I can (or want to) spend. My pocket book has limits, if it didn't, I wouldn't have bought a $450 tool.

When your comparing shapers and routers to table saws and planers/jointers, it's apples and oranges. Shapers and routers will always require more than one tooling, unless you'll only ever make one edge type! A planer can do with one (set) blade.

Mike

[Brian W Evans]

Bruce,

I do see your point. I said that people would balk at paying such a large percentage of the cost of the the machine - not that they should. I, too, have hundreds of dollars worth of bits for my routers and don't see any problem with that. That being said, these bits can be used in any router. The carbide blades can only be used in a DW735. What if the motor burns out? I know from experience that this will cost over $200 to repair. The Dewalt repair guy told me that most of his pro customers make repairs to portable/hand machines only when the repair costs less than half the price of a new one. Using that logic, I came very close to saving my $200+ and putting it toward a 15" Powermatic. If I'd had $250 invested in carbide blades for the Dewalt, I might have felt tied to a machine I didn't want to pay to repair. With a more expensive machine like the Powermatic, carbide blades or a new motor are relatively small expenses (as a percentage of the purchase price) because you're paying for a machine that will last a lifetime. Not so with the Dewalt, fine machine though it is.

As for eBay, I am smart enough to factor in shipping. The price I quoted was from an auction I found yesterday where I could get two sets of blades, including shipping, for just under $70.

Finally, I don't know that the Infinity rep didn't mean 10X longer than both sides of a steel blade. However, in any catalog I've ever read, carbide is said to last 10X longer than HSS. I think what I said is a reasonable assumption.

[Eddie Darby]

They're priced at $249, but if you order this week they're $199. This price seems to be more or less in line with Infinity's other carbide-tipped blades.

I always like these 'order now' sales. It just seems that now is not always a good time.

Too bad they weren't always priced at a more reasonable price than $249.

I'll just wait for the other companies that are more reasonably priced to join the game with their carbide blades.

When my printer runs out of ink, I always debate the cost of buying a new ink cartridge vs. upgrading to a new printer each time. Now it seems that I will have to do it for my planer.:eek::rolleyes::D

[Michael McCoy]

I'm no machine expert but I've been running a Byrd cutter head on my jointer for the last six months (fairly heavy use) and curly walnut went through yesterday like the knives were new. I am more than willing to give these a shot so thanks for the heads up.

Shipping is free by the way for standard 5-7 day ground.

[Dave Falkenstein]

...Till the end of this week you can pick-up a set for $199.90, please report you're results back to the forum when you've given them a good run. Our first sets will ship in Sept.

As always, thanks for your support.

David Venditto
Infinity Tools

Here we are in the middle of July, being offered a "deal" on these knives for delivery in September. Putting on my devil's advocate hat, this sounds like test marketing. Why not just offer them in September when they are available to ship?

[Brad Townsend]

It's up to each individual to determine if it's worth it for them. For myself, it might be. Here's why:

Awhile back I really wanted to put a Byrd cutterhead in my 8" jointer, but couldn't afford the $400 price. However, I could afford carbide tipped knives. This was a bit of a risk, as there was little or no feedback on this, or other forums from people who had tried them. I put them in nearly two years ago at a cost of about $130, and they still cut like they did when I first put them in. I haven't had to do a thing with them since. That is worth something to me.

Based on this experience and my satisfaction with the 735 overall, other than the knife issue, I would be tempted to spend the $200, run the 735 until it dies, and THEN get the 15" with the induction motor and Byrd cutterhead.:D

[Peter Luch]

I do alot of work with teak for boats here and the HSS blades last about one board so I end up having all my teak planed at local cabinet shops which have planers with carbide blades.
The $249 will be a $$$ saver for me!

One of the shops has an old planer (Makita 15") with carbide blades and the owner uses it just for wood like teak and has said the blades have not needed to be changed for years :eek::eek::eek: and it still cuts perfect with no nicks and almost a sand free finish.

I will be getting a set of these blades when available and use them just for my teak cutting, they should last me at least 1-2 years before any sharpening is needed.
With paying $20 to $40 each visit to a cabinet shop they will pay for themselves in just a few boat jobs.

Aloha, Pete

[Bruce Benjamin]

As for eBay, I am smart enough to factor in shipping. The price I quoted was from an auction I found yesterday where I could get two sets of blades, including shipping, for just under $70.

Finally, I don't know that the Infinity rep didn't mean 10X longer than both sides of a steel blade. However, in any catalog I've ever read, carbide is said to last 10X longer than HSS. I think what I said is a reasonable assumption.


Hi Brian, I'll just address a few of your points: $70 for 2 sets of blades, shipped, is probably not a deal you can get very often. Though it's been a long time since I looked, I've never seen a deal like that for those blades. I'm not saying the deal didn't exist, I'm saying that you should compare a more common price. $249 is the common price for the new carbide blades.

Regarding the, "Infinity rep", he was more than just a rep, he is the owner and founder of Infinity tools. I've talked with David on the phone a few times. He always has answered the phone when I called Infinity, (though it's been a while since I called) and I believe he would be reasonable enough to mean that the carbide blades can last 10 times longer than both sides of the HSS blades since meaning anything other than that might be misleading. At least I hope that's what he meant. Think about it..."I wore out my DeWalt blades". To me that means it's time to throw them away. Otherwise you would say, "I wore out one side of my DeWalt blades". To me, "Both sides" is implied. He has always seemed like an honest and straightforward guy to me.

Bruce

[David Venditto]

Our carbide knives for the DW735 planer can be sharpened but you'll have to make sure to take them to a shop that knows what they are doing. Since the index pins are fixed you're not able to adjust the height of the knives after they've been sharpened so it is advisable to only take the minimum amount of material off. Assuming you have not damaged the knives, you should be able to get away with taking .010"-.012" off per sharpening. The diameter of the cut circle is changed with each sharpen so the infeed / outfeed rollers need to be within their tolerance so they put the correct pressure on the material being feed through. I would estimate you should be able to get 2-3 regular sharpenings but make sure to tell the shop you want the minimum amount of material taken off. Prices for sharpening vary but you can expect about $1-$1.25 per inch.

Our claim of 10x life for carbide tooling is pretty standard when comparing them to steel cutting tools. In the case of the standard 1/16" thick DW735 knives, we've heard reports of them not lasting as long as our regular single sided 1/8" thick HSS knives used in most other planers. In my opinion, only having half the material behind the cutting edge makes the standard knives wear faster than thicker ones made from the same material. So, for the record, I am comfortable saying that one of our carbide tipped knives should last about 10x longer than one of our DeWalt 735 HSS replacement knives (both sides included) since the original knives are only 1/16" thick and seem to wear faster than our standard 1/8" thick knives. If the original knives were double sided & 1/8" thick I would probably not be able to make the same statement.

Bottom line; the carbide knives will last much longer than the HSS knives and are suited to cutting even very hard and tricky material that would rapidly make the HSS knives dull. Are they worth the extra money? If you use your machine once a month for 15 minutes then probably not. If you use your planer often and/or use hardwoods for your projects then they most likely make a lot of sense.

Thank you,
David Venditto
Infinity Tools

[Peter Quinn]

So the last few posts reiterate what I was talking about when I said the cost of the tooling is irrelevant to the cost of the machine. On a dollar per board foot basis carbide will beat HSS every time. This is why you don't see many HSS router bits any more. Carbide is more cost effective for stock profiles or straight knives in most cases.

In the individual's decision to use carbide however price is very relevant and dependent on the end users needs and budget. If your planer gets light use and $200 is going to cripple your wood working budget, then why bother.

I plane teak, morado, liginum vitea, bubinga and a few other occasionally enough that I don't want to buy carbide tipped for my main planer but would love to use them in the 735. Keep um sharp and ready for those few boards that really require them. I have asked in every post about the 735 "Why doesn't some one make carbide for that tool?" I'll be getting a set as soon as finances allow, or the next job requiring them comes up, which ever comes sooner. I'd rather not buy carbide tipped for the 15" planer because I am saving for a better planer with a Byrd head and dropping $300 on knives won't help that cause. Such a tricky financial balance getting a small shop going.