New "Dovetail" Joint Making Video from Bridge City Tools

[Roger Savatteri]

There's a new Dovetail Joint Making Video from Bridge City Tools on - you tube, using the Jointmaker Pro. (a different video from the first one a little while back....)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_eyFENlSQ0&fmt=18

[Steve Pirrelli]

That's an extremely clean and thin kerf. Thanks for the link.

[Floyd Mah]

This is slightly off-topic, but I followed the link to youtube to view the joint-maker video. I noticed that youtube gathered several other videos, also on joint-making, on the same page. I followed one of these links: a gentleman was addressing an attentive group of people in a foreign language, maybe Dutch, while doing a demo on what looked like a plastic cup with four test-tubes. He was sprinkling some organic material into the tubes and compressing them. There wasn't a piece of wood in sight, or for that matter, a dovetail saw or marking knife. I couldn't understand a thing that he was saying and wondered why the obviously upper class audience was paying such close attention. Anyway, it took me a few minutes to realize that he was making an "Up in Smoke"-Cheech and Chong kind of joint. I was reminded of going to UC Berkeley in the late 60's and never running across anyone smoking a joint. This didn't happen until Stanford a few years later (student section of the football games...every football game). I guess I'm too square (archaic term).

[glenn bradley]

Cool link. Expensive way to avoid using a handsaw ;-)

[Jack Camillo]

thanks for posting. reconfirms why i would not buy this product at that price to cut nice clean lines, which are, yes, admittedly, nice and clean. But, come on. My dovetail and tenon and other saws cut nearly as fast (give about 20-30 more seconds). So, what this does is eliminate the need for practice and experience with a well-made, quality sharpened handsaw. I do, however, admire the innovation of this product.

[Dave Lehnert]

thanks for posting. reconfirms why i would not buy this product at that price to cut nice clean lines, which are, yes, admittedly, nice and clean. But, come on. My dovetail and tenon and other saws cut nearly as fast (give about 20-30 more seconds). So, what this does is eliminate the need for practice and experience with a well-made, quality sharpened handsaw. I do, however, admire the innovation of this product.

I had the chance to see and use the BC saw in person. The inventor gave a demo to a group of us. All I can say is you have to use it to understand. He came up with the idea to cut the very small and detail moldings made by the small multi hand plane they sell.
All i can say is I don't care how good or expensive a hand saw is or how skilled a woodworker is. You will NEVER make as clean and straight a cut as this saw will. This is from Hands on experience. The cut on end grain is smoother than glass.

That said I think I will hold off for the $19.99 Harbor Freight unit LOL!!!

[John Shuk]

That is just so cool.

[Pedro Reyes]

just to start an argument (altho this is my opinion, and I do believe what I'm about to say)

I don't consider dovetails cut with this, hand cut. There I've said it.

/p

[Jim Tolpin]

Be interesting to watch a you-tube video of Rob Cosman hand cutting a dovetail vs. someone using the Bridge City "hand-cutting" machine. Bet Cosman would win (time-wise)! Maybe his cuts wouldn't be quite as precise--but you wouldn't be able to detect that once the joints were assembled.

[Tim Sgrazzutti]

Agreed, Pedro -- not hand cut.

Also, I wonder how blade (un)friendly it is to cut to the baseline in one pass?? I think it would promote tooth decay.........but I could be wrong.

[Narayan Nayar]

Technically speaking if your hand is doing the cutting, you've got amazing technique and I'll be waving at you from a distance if I ever meet you.

It's a tool just as a dovetail saw is a tool. While I'm sure it's exquisitely made, it's probably not much more complicated in its workings than your average plow plane or foot-operated lathe. For me the line between handwork and non handwork exists at the power outlet. You might think differently. I doubt the tool is for me, but I applaud its ingenuity and wouldn't think twice about the "integrity" of the work produced from it.

[Mark Singer]

As a woodworker , I strive to improve my skills by using traditional techniques. I learn by doing. This type of gadget, while clever is very limited and will not allow a woodworker to learn from experience... The virtues of man working with old and worn out tools rather than the newest gadget is much better said by others...

[IF]
If you can keep your head when all about you
Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you
But make allowance for their doubting too,
If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:
If you can dream--and not make dreams your master,
If you can think--and not make thoughts your aim;
If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
And treat those two impostors just the same;
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
And stoop and build 'em up with worn-out tools:

If you can make one heap of all your winnings
And risk it all on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
And lose, and start again at your beginnings
And never breath a word about your loss;
If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
To serve your turn long after they are gone,
And so hold on when there is nothing in you
Except the Will which says to them: "Hold on!"

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
Or walk with kings--nor lose the common touch,
If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you;
If all men count with you, but none too much,
If you can fill the unforgiving minute
With sixty seconds' worth of distance run,
Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
And--which is more--you'll be a Man, my son!

--Rudyard Kipling

[Mark Singer]

How could you ever take pride in making dovetails?

[John Thompson]

What's next... a drive-thru window where you order your DT's through a little voice box before you go to the window? Want fries with those Dove-tails, sir? Or..... perhaps just save your money and use Dove-tail decals after attaching with a brad gun and a dab of glue! ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..

Sarge..

[Chris Kennedy]

What's next... a drive-thru window where you order your DT's through a little voice box before you go to the window? Want fries with those Dove-tails, sir? Or..... perhaps just save your money and use Dove-tail decals after attaching with a brad gun and a dab of glue! ha.. ha... ha..ha..ha..

Sarge..

Don't laugh too hard -- I've basically seen that. I was looking at a piece of mass-produced furniture, and the dovetails were painted/stained on. I kid you not.

Personally, I look at the jointmaker and think that it is a really small, cordless table saw.

Cheers,

Chris

[Mike Henderson]

Personally, I look at the jointmaker and think that it is a really small, cordless table saw.

Cheers,

Chris
Yeah - I guess you could put a thin kerf blade on your table saw, use a zero clearence insert and support at the back of the cut (to avoid tearout), and set the angles as they did and get the same result.

And for a lot less money, assuming you already have a table saw.

Mike

[Clifford Mescher]

It got my attention and I studied it. Just not my cup of tea. Clifford

[John Powers]

When it can get the wast out of the dovetails in 6 seconds that will be real news.

Now fess up....did any of you check out Two Girls in a Shower right above the Bridge City gadget on UTube? right.....me neither.

[Jim Koepke]

When it can get the wast out of the dovetails in 6 seconds that will be real news.

Now fess up....did any of you check out Two Girls in a Shower right above the Bridge City gadget on UTube? right.....me neither.

LOL! They didn't have any other videos on the Bridge City Tool site.

Now if someone puts together a setup like this in their shop to cut joinery, is that different than buying the setup?

Just curious,

jim

[John Thompson]

Chris, I'm not sure if those were decals you saw on the mass produced furniture. It would be debatable if decals could hold up inside a hot.. humid Conex container stored in a ship's hole for 30-45 days. I bet they were actually geniune.. bona-fided Oriental hand painted art-work. :)

Not sure if anyone will buy this rig even though it does look like a minature sawmill of some form, but we're sure having some fun just window-shopping, huh.... :D

Back to the shop to make sure someone didn't steal my $19 DT saw while I was up for coffee. hee.....

Sarge..

[James Mittlefehldt]

Be interesting to watch a you-tube video of Rob Cosman hand cutting a dovetail vs. someone using the Bridge City "hand-cutting" machine. Bet Cosman would win (time-wise)! Maybe his cuts wouldn't be quite as precise--but you wouldn't be able to detect that once the joints were assembled.

Welcome to Sawmill Creek Jim, I noticed that was your first post and no one else welcomed you. I agree about Cosman to.

I think that that device would be great for a someone who is a pro or semi pro and does a lot of dovetailing and perhaps box joints.

[Jim Tolpin]

Welcome to Sawmill Creek Jim, I noticed that was your first post and no one else welcomed you. I agree about Cosman to.

I think that that device would be great for a someone who is a pro or semi pro and does a lot of dovetailing and perhaps box joints.

James: Thanks much for the welcome! I'm looking forward to hanging out more here in Neanderthal Haven. Been doing powertool woodworking for way too long (though I did make a living at it for over 25 years). Now I'm mostly teaching and doing a lot more work with hand tools. Last fun project was a reproduction of a Gypsy Caravan...all the detail work and much of the interior cabinetry was all done with hand tools...no routers, no sanders (no noise, no dust, no anxiety!). Photos at my website jimtolpin.com. My personal maxim:

The more power you apply to the process, the further you get from the product.

[Ron Dunn]

Jim Tolpin as in Toolbox Book, Measure Twice Cut Once?

Exalted company :)

[James Mittlefehldt]

Jim Tolpin as in Toolbox Book, Measure Twice Cut Once?

Exalted company :)

Yea I was thinking the same thing when I wrote the welcome.

It is that Jim Tolpin and take a look at his site those gypsy wagons he mentions are really intriguing.

Jim you must turn a few heads when you pull one of those into a camp ground, unless of course you also belong to SCA as well.

[Mark Koury]

You have to admire the ingenuity behind this!

But, why not use a router, especially if you are running a business.
I wonder who the target market is for this, especially considering the price?

Handwork - to me, anyway - is like playing golf. A machine to control the club swing takes the enjoyment and satisfaction out of it.

[Chris Friesen]

But, why not use a router, especially if you are running a business. I wonder who the target market is for this, especially considering the price?

This saw would let you make far skinnier pins than any router bit...basically it will let people make dovetails that look hand-cut without having to master cutting by hand.

The market is probably the same as the people that buy their other tools--$170 for a honing guide, $135 for a combo square, $439 for a hand drill, $600 for a block plane, $750 for a set of chisels.

[Joe Cunningham]

If you buy rough cut lumber
then use a power planer
and a jointer
and a table saw

is it really 'hand-cut'?

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

Be interesting to watch a you-tube video of Rob Cosman hand cutting a dovetail vs. someone using the Bridge City "hand-cutting" machine. Bet Cosman would win (time-wise)! Maybe his cuts wouldn't be quite as precise--but you wouldn't be able to detect that once the joints were assembled.

Jim Tolpin! Welcome to The Creek! I'm a fan! Matter of fact, I gave away almost all of my woodworking books early this year on this forum (there were A LOT!) and the only one I saved was your book "Building Traditional Kitchens" Your book was my bible for my first kitchen build in the mid 90's and have made several more since then using the valuable, practical lessons and jigs in your book. I recommend it highly to anyone thinking of building a kitchen.

[Jim Tolpin]

Jim Tolpin! Welcome to The Creek! I'm a fan! Matter of fact, I gave away almost all of my woodworking books early this year on this forum (there were A LOT!) and the only one I saved was your book "Building Traditional Kitchens" Your book was my bible for my first kitchen build in the mid 90's and have made several more since then using the valuable, practical lessons and jigs in your book. I recommend it highly to anyone thinking of building a kitchen.

Thanks Jim...its always heartening to hear that people are getting useful info from my books. I always try hard to just write what I know...and I think that Cabinetmaking book was one of my better examples!

As far as cutting dovetail joints by hand....its really not that hard to master...it just takes practice and learning a few tricks to make the work go easier.

[Tim Thomas]

(Disclaimer: I'm not a Neander, but I do have a great deal of respect for everyone who has the skill and patience to master the use of hand tools. I use some handtools, but mostly for just refining work I've done on with my power tools.)

I think this tool looks neat and awesome and well made and all that. And the results you get certainly look great from the demo. BUT: Isn't the point of hand cut dovetails that they LOOK like handcut dovetails when you are finished? I mean, if the end result is that the dovetails look so perfect that they could have been made on a Leigh jig with a power router, then where is the charm and character that I would think is at least part of the appeal of doing work by hand? Am I missing something here?

[Mike Henderson]

Thanks Jim...its always heartening to hear that people are getting useful info from my books. I always try hard to just write what I know...and I think that Cabinetmaking book was one of my better examples!

As far as cutting dovetail joints by hand....its really not that hard to master...it just takes practice and learning a few tricks to make the work go easier.
Let me add my welcome also, Jim. I'm just in awe of people who write books. It's so much work - but I do appreciate the final results. I have several of your books but the one I especially like is your "Toolbox Book".

I look forward to your comments in this forum.

Mike

[Jack Camillo]

power planer, jointer, and table saw don't make dovetail. yes, the dovetail is hand cut with a hand saw. if you by s4s and then cut the dovetail, it is handcut. if you have a shop full of tools, including power tools, and make a custom jewelry box, in my opinion, it's hand made.

[Dave Lehnert]

The video is just to show the precision of the unit. It is not a dovetail jig per say. Just is very capable of doing it. A chisel is capable of cutting dovetails but will do so much more. Same idea.

The inventor of the tool said they have seen a big upswing in hand tool sales. People are moving into condos and the like and need to practice "silent woodworking" He is just as excited to see what woodworkers will do with it as anyone. Also told me "take a saw and sandwich it between two oak boards at home" That is how they started. But you will soon see it takes a little more than that.

He also said it is expensive. Anything made here is expensive. He also seemed open to selling the idea to someone who could make it cheaper.

Like I said before. Use one and you will say WOW!!!!

[Jim Tolpin]

"The inventor of the tool said they have seen a big upswing in hand tool sales."

This, to me, is great news. I think people will get a lot more enjoyment, and be drawn deeper into woodworking, when they start using tools that not only let them have a more tactile relationship with the wood (and therefore their project) but they can also have the experience of using tools that don't require them to protect their hearing, their lungs or their eyes. Plus, they get to listen to the radio station/ipod song of their choice while working! Power tools are far over-rated when it comes to doing home-shop, single project woodworking. That's my 3-cents worth (adjusted for inflation)...

[James G. Jones]

Jim, first, I too am a big fan of your work. I love Woodworking Wit and Wisdom. I also completely agree with you about hand tools providing more enjoyment and passion for woodworking. I was an enthusiastic hobbyist with a garage full of power tools. I made some nice tables, beds and the like when I couldn't afford nice furniture, but I never was fully immersed. It was more like me versus the wood. I picked up a #4 and a #45 at a flea market because I was curious about what they could do. (Yes, that was the start of the slippery slope.) Now while I am still just an enthusiastic hobbyist, I am starting to understand how, during the process, the character of the wood and the feel of the process makes a difference between hand made and hand crafted.

[Jim Tolpin]

James...I made a living at woodworking for more than 25 years and I couldn't have done that without power tools---so its not like I have anything against them! But since I'm not having to do production level efficiency anymore, it just doesnt' make sense to me to let power tools have all the fun! There is so much joy in using a sharp and well tuned smoothing plane to make a small table surface mirror smooth. Love the sound, love the smell, love the feel of the plane in my hand!