Overarm pin router arm

[Don Nicholas]

Has anyone had any experience with the Veritas Pin Router Arm and the Bit Jack?
Or any other homemade pin router plans.
Thanks for the help!!:)
Don Nicholas
Lakewood WA

[Joe Scharle]

I've got a MLCS Daisy. I've only used it with a dish bit for nut plates and pocket change trays. Worked well enough, but I do recommend a foot switch because I felt uncomfortable taking both hands off the work to switch the router. I can see where the lift device would be real handy because I have to drop the bit to untrap the work if it's a deep penetration.

If you get the Veritas, I'd like to hear your feedback. BTW, the Shopsmith overarm accessory is about the same cost. Then add router motor.

Joe

[Don Nicholas]

Joe,
Thanks for your reply and your info. I had forgot about the Shop Smith unit. I will check their website.
I am making some Cheese boards with an inset 4x4 tile. The pin router would be used to route out the inset for the tile. There is a photo on my web site under "Wine items" to see the board.
Thank you for your input!!:)
Don Nicholas
www.roundhousewoodworking.com (http://www.roundhousewoodworking.com) (not complete as yet)

[Dave Lehnert]

The shopsmith unit is now made to mount to a Mark V. A link to some videos available here. http://www.shopsmith.com/ownersite/catalog/rm_overarmpinrouter.htm

[Will Blick]

I am curious about the application of pin routers.....

For copying work, what is the difference between a pin router vs. using a flush trim bit with a bearing? They seem identical to me?

I assume there must be some unique applications that makes a pin router earn its wings....... can someone post some pix of such applications?

[Rick Lizek]

Picture an electric guitar body as an example. With a template you can cut out the outside of the body and with the same bit do the pick up holes, neck mount, etc. Typically there is a turret depth stop like you would find on a plunge router. There's over head type pinrouters and underhead type pin routers. I've even used ones with a drivewheel that will power the template around. Largely replaced by CNC but still a great tool and priced pretty reasonable for the small shop. 10 hp is a common hp rating for many of these old machines. There isn't much info on these tools as techniques for industrial machines are handed down from operator to new operator so there are no books to learn more on the subject. Old vocational text books just show a quick view and a paragraph of text. Pinrouters were also used in the aircraft industry for aluminum parts.

W

[Doug Jones from Oregon]

We had 3 industrial pin rounters, along with 3 cnc routers in a speaker enclosure plant. With a good operator, there were speaker parts that one could produce faster and just as accurately on a pin router and therefore, we kept all 3 of them running, all day.

It is was easier to push the product to be machined through the bit than the bit through the product as with a hand held router and a pattern bit.

[Ken Dolph]

I made my own 15 years ago to make Christmas tree ornaments. I used Corian for the arm and screwed it to my routertop. I liked it so much that I bought the Delta/Onsrud 43-155 ($1,500) as soon as it was available. It will be the last tool that leavs my cold dead fingers. I use it instead of a drill press for many repeating projects as well as for form cut out and design cutting. It paid for itself within a month.

http://www.blueballmachine.com/sys-catalog_single_details.asp?catid=17229&seq=2&categoryID=4900&category=Y&PageID=129539&SiteID=34232

Alas Delta did not advertise it well and did not sell many. They stopped production within a year. Onsrud still makes very nice units but they are too much for me.

Veritas makes excellent tools. I was not aware that their overarm was back on the market. An overarm should be invaluable to you in the project you have. Make a vacuum template and the parts will goe much faster. A simple arm is easy to make. Give me a shout if you would like to try.

I hope this helps.
Ken

[Eddie Darby]

Veritas makes excellent tools. I was not aware that their overarm was back on the market.


http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=43038&cat=1,43000

Never knew it left the market. Nice arm, with okay capacity.

[Ed Kilburn]

I have a homemade pin router for sale.
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=86548
I'll post a video of the router in action when I get home next Tuesday. I make many of the same parts, that I got the profile CNC cut into 1/2
aluminum plate. Because I cut 3/4" poplar with one pass, vacuum wouldn't work, all the blocks were clamped in place.

[Peter Quinn]

They had a grizzly over arm router where I worked last, they used to use it for dados in pre-finished plywood with a fence and for custom HVAC air returns for rooms with floor to ceiling paneling. I never had reason to use it much on the jobs I was given but a few of the guys made good use of it.

It had pneumatic hold downs, some type of power feed I never saw used, and either a fence or center pin for template work. The bit came up and down with a foot pedal leaving both hands free to move the work. Seemed to go much faster than a plunge router could have and it had a lot more power.

[Will Blick]

> Largely replaced by CNC but still a great tool and priced pretty reasonable for the small shop.

Makes perfect sense..... but as a previous poster mentioned, i can see how this tool at times, be even more cost effective than a CNC router. If the piece is be enough and the user can easily control it...the concept of holding the piece flush to a bearing and moving the piece as fast as the blade will allow is probably the most efficient process for copy work, which does not have intricate or tight cut-outs.

Question 1: Do you pin route with the entire blade into the wood, or must you hack away most of the waste wood and allow the bit to do edge routing only?

Question 2: I still don't see a huge difference between a table mounted flush trim bit with a bearing vs. a pin router arm? Under what circumstances will the pin router provide a benefit?

[Doug Jones from Oregon]

Answer 1: Entire bit if design warrants...we used .5" straight bits and would plunge and route out the center hole in speaker faces.

Answer 2: You answered it yourself...easier to control the wood/plastic/metal that the router itself. This coupled with some serious power in the commercial units...5hp/10hp....

I'm not sure you would see a lot of advantages for a arm designed to hold a 1-2hp router motor...not enough power to make it much better. I would worry also about the rigidity of these arms.

Doug

[Will Blick]

Doug, excellent point regarding the use of a pin router with exceptional hp powering the bit I think of a 3hp router as being such a beast in your hands..... so the next obvious progression in power would be, mount the larger motor, now you only handle the work piece.

Next, with this much force at play, its best to push the work piece against a pin, that is NOT an extension of the motor / bit shaft. A bearing bit, in this application would transfer all forces to the motor bearings.... I am sure the bearings get enough stress from the material being forced through the blade..... Anyway, I can really see the application of these larger pin routers for dupe work... specially when half the bit is used for cutting, as the speaker hole cut-out mentioned above.

However, for small applications such as the home hobbiest, it still seems a table mounted router, using a flush trim bit with a top bearing is more than suitable. I think David Marks demonstrates this very well.....by hoggin out most of the material on a BS or other saw, you reduce the task to edge trimming, so the total load on the bit and bearing is not that substantial vs. the applications mentioned above.

[Doug Jones from Oregon]

I agree...pin routers are ideal for production type repetition work. For the time it takes to build a jig, establish your hold down locations and methods, one can usually make one or two with a bandsaw/router much quicker.

I used to use one dedicated to nothing but keyhole(s) in the back of my frames...simple application but with the air activated raising and lowering of the bit....made for doing a stack at a time easy. Dedicated keyhole machines start at about 12k and are running just a Porter Cable router... I think I paid $800 for my pin router.

[Roger Oldre (REO)]

pin routers work great for "blind" or pocket work. The alternative would be to cut thru the pocket part with your bearing following the template and then to glue two peices together. It also lends itself to inside cuts where a pilot or start hole does not have to be drilled first. I would agree that it is not the best n the "one off" arena but in short to long runs it can be extremly useful. Way back when Rapalla filet boards were wood we used a pin router for cutting the shape because it was fast, virtualy dust free, and because we had a bit sharpened to contour it eased the edges giveing us a finished edge all in one pass.

[Rich Enders]

In answer to Will's question #2, I found with the overarm pin or bearing you can use router bits and shaper cutters that do not have a guide bearing on the business end.