Bosch bluecore-vs-Ryobi LiON batteries???

[Jay Yoder]

I have been looking at cordless set/upgrade exist. I was looking at the purchase of a Bosch set at the Blue Borg. It has the Blue Core batteries. Has anyone had any experience with them? they have them priced at $399 w/ a mail in $150 Store card. That is not a bad price at all! Currently I have a Ryobi 18v set and the other option would be to get the Lithium ion upgrade pack. I have been satisfied with the Drill and impact, but find that the recip saw and the circ saw dont last too long b4 having to swap batteries out. It has been a pain. i can get the upgrade kit for 117 for the charger and one battery...any thoughts or opinions? i am leaning toward the Bosch, b/c they are definately heavier grade...the circ saw is definately alot more like my corded models...if anyone has the blue core batteries, i just wondered how they compare to regular NiCad...Thanks!

[Bob Aquino]

Jay
One thing to keep in mind is that the blue core batteries are not LION, but are Nicads that have some extra stuff in them to keep them cooler when they charge. I have about 5 bosch 14.4 batteries and 2 of them are bluecore. I cant tell you I see much difference in performance.

If the Ryobi LION batteries will fit your current tools and the chargers, I would try one of those first and see how it does. Bosch is good stuff, but I can tell you my circular saw doesnt last all that long even on a fresh battery. They just draw too much juice. Good for a few cuts, but not all day work.

[Steve Clardy]

I have all bluecore in my 3 14.4's

Performance is awesome.

[Lance Norris]

I have upgraded to Ryobi Lithium-ion for my One+ tools and can tell you the run times are greatly improved. I bought the Li-ion drill, flashlight, charger, and 2 Li-ion battery kit, from HD. I then bought 2 more Li-ion batteries on Ebay and these batteries are so much better than the Nicads. One of the best features of the Ryobi Li-ion battery is the "gas gauge"


http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=71156

I have taken my One+ circular saw to the lumber yard, counting on it to cut lumber down so it will fit in my Dakotas 6-1/2' bed, only to find the Nicad batteries were dead. Now with the Li-ion, this isnt a problem anymore. You can also buy just the battery now at HD, but keep in mind, the older nicad chargers will NOT charge the Li-ion battery, you will need the new GREEN COLORED charger.

[Matthew Poeller]

I too upgraded to the Ryobi LIon batteries and I am very pleased. The run times are seriously improved. I (rather my wife) bought me the 2 battery, drill, flashlight and charger set because it seemed to be a better value. I already had a drill but you can never have too many and the new one has a ratcheting chuck which I like very much. Ryobi gets a huge plus in my book for their cordless tools.

[Jay Yoder]

I went to HD today and they had an awesome deal going. if you bought one of the multi tool sets u could get a free One+ tool. the website said you could LiION. I talk to one of the guys in hardware and he said he did not know if it was for the upgrade kit. So we tried it! It was my lucky day! I ended up buying the starter kit for $109 (drill, circ saw, charger, and 2 nicad batteries) and i got one of upgrade kits FREE ($119 retail). So then i bought the radio/impact charger and 2 nicads and charger and got another upgrade kit! So not here is my battery tally, including the new stuff...2- LiIONs and 8- Nicads...anyone want to buy a starter set? hehe...

[J. Z. Guest]

I have the Ryobi One+ system with two NiCd packs (cheap!) and 5 Li-Ion packs.

Li-Ion make cordless tools truly practical for folks who don't use them every day. It is sooooo nice to pick up a battery that has been sitting for a couple months, snap it in a tool, and have it ready to go, and full charge.

The latest Ryobi tools are very high quality. They're not quite as ergonomic as the latest Makita and Panasonic toolks, but they work just as well.

Since Li-Ion has twice the energy per volume vs. NiCd, mfrs. have a choice. Same weight with double the run-time, or lighter weight with the same runtime. Makita gives both options, and I very nearly went with Makita due to the high quality, light weight, fast charging, and excellent ergonomics.

But the Ryobi One+ system is so much more extensive compared to anything offered by Makita or anyone else. And besides, it takes me a lot longer than an hour to discharge a battery pack, so why would I need to charge it in 15 minutes? ;)

Later, I bought one of the nice little Milwaukee 12V Li-Ion drivers at Home Depot, and I love that too. Nothing beats that for light-duty screw-driving. (for heavy duty driving and mechanical work, I like the Ryobi impact driver)

[Dennis Lopeman]

I went to HD today and they had an awesome deal going. if you bought one of the multi tool sets u could get a free One+ tool. the website said you could LiION. I talk to one of the guys in hardware and he said he did not know if it was for the upgrade kit. So we tried it! It was my lucky day! I ended up buying the starter kit for $109 (drill, circ saw, charger, and 2 nicad batteries) and i got one of upgrade kits FREE ($119 retail). So then i bought the radio/impact charger and 2 nicads and charger and got another upgrade kit! So not here is my battery tally, including the new stuff...2- LiIONs and 8- Nicads...anyone want to buy a starter set? hehe...


The free tool thing is in effect until July i think - i've been looking into it... I'm still deciding -

I like the deal you got!! I'm gonna research that!

[Chris Padilla]

Folks,

Check up at www.primecell.com (http://www.primecell.com) The reason I mention this battery-rebuilding firm is that they have some interesting information on Li-Ion batteries: http://www.primecell.com/qli-Ion.htm

I have experience over the course of 3 years with a Li-Ion battery that powers my bike headlight: they don't last long. I'm on my 2nd battery in that period of time and I've learned to run my light at its lowest current draw and my battery still doesn't last long between charges. I cannot get it rebuilt and a new one's cost may well have me buy a different bike headlight. I was lucky to get the first one replaced under warranty but I won't be so lucky with my second one. This battery, however, is small and light and great for biking...just wish it would last longer!! :)

[Peter Quadarella]

I have almost all of the Bosch cordless 18v tools, and use both Blue Core and regular/older batteries. I don't notice a huge difference to be honest. The big selling point for me is the Bosch tools themselves. Each one is quite excellent. They are durable and well designed.

[J. Z. Guest]

Chris - Is it possible the Li-Ion batts. are just don't have enough capacity for your use? (i.e. it has nothing to do with the battery chemistry)

Or are you saying that they don't stand up to vibration like Nickel cells?

[Dave Lehnert]

I know some people won't ever consider the Ryobi. I have the 14.4 volt Kit and think it is great (purchased it before the 18V one plus came out) I have a Ported Cable that was highly rated and cost a lot more but like my Ryobi better. Nothing wrong with the PC. Just the Ryobi has a better feel.

As far as a saw goes. They all eat up batteries fast. We have a Milwaukee at work and it does not last any longer than other brands. Have no idea on the Bosch performance.

[david scheidt]

Chris - Is it possible the Li-Ion batts. are just don't have enough capacity for your use? (i.e. it has nothing to do with the battery chemistry)

Or are you saying that they don't stand up to vibration like Nickel cells?

Li-ion batteries have some serious technical limitations. They're subject to a chemical reaction that degrades the batteries, which starts at manufacture, and continues whether the battery is used or not. They're relatively expensive , and require modestly complicated chargers, and battery pack circuitry.

They've also got some very nice features. They've got the highest energy density of any widely available rechargeable battery, which means that for a given battery size, you get more power out of it. They've got a stable discharge rate, which means they can put out a more-or-less constant power from full charge to fully discharge. They've got low-self discharge, so that they're more likely to still have a charge when you don't use them for a long time. They can be made in strange shapes, which is an advantage of small portable devices, like phones and iPods.

Primecell's page is rather out of date; there have been great improvements in the technology in the last few years. I'm still leery of them in power tools. I'll wait to see what people who've had them five years say about them.

[Neal Clayton]

i don't think any battery powered saw will be sufficient for all day use.

that said, i recently had to find a replacement for my old ones and wound up with the makita "green" ones. think it was 300 for the drill, 2 batteries, and the charger. can't complain, i get about 9 hours of semi-constant use on one battery (semi-constant being two people sharing it to go back and forth between hanging straps around conduit and framing new tables for a new shop, all day long) and they recharge in one hour, give or take. you get full power until they're within about 5 minutes of dead.

[Neal Clayton]

fast charging is basically a means of not being made to look stupid, i admit.

i've got myself, an electrician, and a helper working at my house every day on a lengthy renovation. when a day starts with "which one of you forgot to charge the batteries" that 1 hour charge time is worth its weight in gold ;). at least one of us is using that drill all day long, after all.

[Chris Padilla]

Chris - Is it possible the Li-Ion batts. are just don't have enough capacity for your use? (i.e. it has nothing to do with the battery chemistry)

Or are you saying that they don't stand up to vibration like Nickel cells?

Well, the whole bike headlight and battery came together as a complete system so I'd have to trust the vendor put the parts together appropriately. As has been pointed out above, you can pack more energy into a Li-Ion battery than any other rechargeable battery--a reason y'all like them so much. For a bike, that means the battery can be smaller and lighter yet deliver a lot of energy over time.

I don't think vibration has anything to do with it (my battery actually sits in a pack and is not directly connected to the bike frame)...it is the chemical make-up.

Let me put it this way, I paid boo-coo bucks for this nice light system and I like it a lot because it is very bright but there are several disadvantages with it I've noticed over time:

(1) The bulbs don't last long and are proprietary (near as I can find) and are therefore pricey.
(2) The battery doesn't last long and I'm not sure even when brand new that I ever really got the expected capacity out of it. After reading PrimeCells page on Li-Ion batteries, I think I understand why: Li-Ion batteries appear finicky. :)