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Zac Altman
05-31-2008, 4:25 AM
I want to get everyones opinions on certain brands, this is NOT to help me decide, i have already chosen which one.

So summarize any or all of the following in 1 sentence (or short paragraph):
- Epilog
- Universal Laser Systems
- Gravograph
- Xenetech
- LaserPro
- Mercury

Let me know who I missed and I will add them to the list...

Please no a is better than b, just say your opinion on each brand...

Rodne Gold
05-31-2008, 6:23 AM
The Answer:
They all do the same job!!

There are 100's of posts of the pros and cons of each brand on the boards , reading them will give a far better idea then a short summary
What do you expect to gain by this post? You have made up your mind , so is this going to change anything?

Nancy Laird
05-31-2008, 8:34 AM
The Answer:
They all do the same job!!

There are 100's of posts of the pros and cons of each brand on the boards , reading them will give a far better idea then a short summary
What do you expect to gain by this post? You have made up your mind , so is this going to change anything?

Rodney, I couldn't have said it better myself! Well done!!

Bill Morrison
05-31-2008, 9:16 AM
they are all good brands.

Doug Griffith
05-31-2008, 9:22 AM
...this is NOT to help me decide, i have already chosen which one.

Hi Zac,
Since you've already chosen a system and your current threads have been about your website development I can only guess that the information you request is to be posted on your website. You should be clear about how the information is going to be used. Especially if quoted on your site for search engine benefit.

Zac Altman
05-31-2008, 6:20 PM
- This is NOT for ANY of my websites

- This was just to find out what people thought of each brand
e.g.
Versalaser - Cheap and simple, yet not very well built, they break a lot
Xenetech - fastest, built very well, expensive.

- Does someone really want to go and look into 100s of posts? I am trying to make this easy, not just for me and my curiosity, but for others who may be new or who may not know about all of these brands.

- If they are all good brands, why do people chose..lets say..a laserpro over an epilog

Doug Griffith
05-31-2008, 7:09 PM
Understood.

I think simple one liners are way too subjective. Would it be fair to "I Build Laser Cutters Co." if a few people said they were crappy when they based their opinion on features that no one cares about. I've seen numerous eBay and Amazon reviews stating the seller was crappy when in fact it was the product itself. Also, most consumers only point out the bad and take the good for granted. All in all, I think it's best left for people to make informed decisions based on their own research (and digging through the threads).

I've manufactured and sold my own product line and know that one bad comment online can cancel out thousands of good.

How about just a list of brand names and URLs.

Zvi Grinberg
06-01-2008, 12:34 AM
- ...
e.g.
Versalaser - Cheap and simple, yet not very well built, they break a lot
...


Just for the record, and actually as a direct response to your original request - this statement is far from the truth.

It may be cheap and simple, but is built very well, and it does not break. From my experience (selling ULS machines in Israel) this is one of the most reliable instruments I've been working with in my entire career.

Steve knight
06-01-2008, 1:24 AM
Come on you want to be lazy and want others to have to tell you for your own curiosity? atleast I could see if if you needed help making a choice but even then a little work on your part is needed.

Zac Altman
06-01-2008, 1:53 AM
Come on you want to be lazy and want others to have to tell you for your own curiosity? atleast I could see if if you needed help making a choice but even then a little work on your part is needed.

Ok, here is what i know so far:
Epilog - well built, seem to be the most popular and reputable brand.

Universal Laser Systems (Versalaser) - Cheap, easy to use, fairly popular, no autofocus on the versas, go as low as 10 watts which is pointless, looks the best?

Gravograph - nothing special about these machine, a bit more expensive in the lower end, not sure about the higher end, they just look old and outdated.

Xenetech - Fastest (up to 150ips - but it costs a bit more to get the fastest), most expensive, extremely well built, no very low end model, printer driver problem?

LaserPro - dont have anything to say

Mercury - dont have anything to say

Trotec - 2nd fastest

I know looks dont really matter, but I decided to just point it out.

so any comments on what I have to say, am i completely wrong? care to expand?

Scott Shepherd
06-01-2008, 8:46 AM
Yes, you are completely wrong.

As mentioned, you can't do this, it's simply impossible based on your criteria.

Speed is relative to the quality. It means nothing to say the machine will go 200ips when in fact, that's cutting air. How many ips will it cut while rastering plastic/acrylic/alumamark? Oh, that's not posted anywhere. That's a raster speed at 100% setting. What's the vector speed? We don't know. Top vector speed may be 15%. Again, you can't put numbers on stuff like that because it would depend if your material is .005" plastic or .500" plastic. It's a marketing ploy uses to sell machines.

What one person uses the laser for is different than what the next person uses it for. You might take a $2500 laser and vector cut shapes with it all day long and be happy. I might take that same machine and try to raster on reverse engravable and it might do a horrible job with poor quality. So who's right? The person who says it does a great job or the person who says it does a horrible job? Answer- it depends.

Also, service is a huge factor. I'll use your example- Xenetech, ranked on your scale as a top brand. Well, their driver has known bugs in it for XP and they basically abandoned that platform. So if you have a new Xenetech running XP and it's having problems, or takes extra steps to get the job done, is it really better? It the machine is faster but the prep work is slower, then the time on my job matters. If I have 10,000 items to run, then it's no big deal, but if I have 1 piece, 10,000 times, then it is a big deal.

Everything is relative and it can't be summed up in 1 line of text.

Also, for the record, VersaLaser isn't the only machine ULS makes. Once again, there is the flaw in your question. You're comparing the entry level laser from one manufacturer (versalaser) to the top end brand of other companies (Xenetech and Trotec).

If there are specific question you'd like to know, then ask, but to open a broad "which one is better" will yield you no results that would be helpful. You'd end up with exactly what I said- 1 person saying it's great and the next person saying it's the worst. So where does that leave us? Right where we started.

Doug Griffith
06-01-2008, 9:16 AM
Everything Scott said and...

Abacus - inexpensive. works great. very portable.

MacBookPro - expensive. not very expandable. far heavier than the competition.

I think I'll go with the Abacus.

Rodne Gold
06-01-2008, 9:27 AM
I'm gonna be blunt here but i'm gonna call this as I see it : This post is total waste of time.
In the first place ppl are partisan to the laser they own and in the 2nd place , most users have not had all the brands mentioned to make comparisons and 3rdly it is impossible to fully describe a brand in one short paragraph.

Zac , with all due respect , if you couldnt be ass'ed to look thru the multitude of posts , you are effectively telling all of us who have taken the time and trouble to write them to get knotted and are also demanding to be spoon fed. And as you say ..you have made your choice , so what will asking us to write you a synopsis do?

If any other new user comes here and asks us to do the same , the answer I have given you would be the same. Do your homework , and only once it's done , then if you have more specific queries , ask with pleasure and we will help with pleasure.

Lee DeRaud
06-01-2008, 9:49 AM
Ok, here is what i know so far:...no autofocus on the versas...For some very low value of "know".

The way the VL-series works is, you set the thickness of your material in the printer properties dialog, and the driver sets the Z-axis automatically. (Note that you can save/load these properties, so it's not like you have to enter it for every job.) A bit different from how "autofocus" is handled on some other machines, but based on what I've read here about various problems with probes etc, IMHO that's a feature, not a bug.

Lee DeRaud
06-01-2008, 9:52 AM
I think I'll go with the Abacus.Have they released Bead 4.0 yet? The 3.7 version is giving me carpal tunnel. :cool:

Zeev Goldin
06-01-2008, 4:20 PM
Zac this is a professionals Forum don't insult them with waisting their time on giving useless information. And to who? You already know what You need to know. 99.9% of the people that Want to buy A $10.000 Plus machinery WILL want to get a profound and deep opinions about those machines. One liners are excuse me for my French are for teen age text messaging Kids not Professionals like the people that use this Forum, take the one liners elsewhere. I don't mean to be harsh but I watched Your posts and threads before and my opinion is not based just on this particular one.

Rob Bosworth
06-02-2008, 11:34 AM
After wasting our time on these one line descriptions, let's do automobiles. Now remember, only one line per manufacture.

Mark Winlund
06-02-2008, 1:58 PM
Yes, you are completely wrong.

As mentioned, you can't do this, it's simply impossible based on your criteria.

Speed is relative to the quality. It means nothing to say the machine will go 200ips when in fact, that's cutting air.


I have one of ULS's top end models, with fairly high speeds... yet it wont vector past about 10% speed without vibration induced defects. So, the usable speed is about 10% of the advertised speed! Been a problem for years, no comment from the mfr.

Mark

Mike Mackenzie
06-02-2008, 8:43 PM
Mark,

Please PM me with your firmware and driver versions.