dedicated mortiser vs. drill press and kit

[Wes Ramsey]

Hi all! I'm getting ready to try my first M&T jointery, and I have clearance to buy a new tool or two. I have a small Delta drill press, but it won't handle their mortising kit (too small). I don't have a lot of space, so a dual-use tool would be idea, but I want something that will work right the first time so I don't have to re-buy tools. I think I would rather get a bigger benchtop drill press with a mortising kit, but if I can expect poor results from that I'd rather get something different that will work well. What would work best for under $200?

[Frank Drew]

Wes,

I'd advise making up a box jig to use a plunge router and end mill bits for mortising (that is, until you get your horizontal slot mortiser :D).

I've never loved hollow chisel mortising; I think it's slower than either of the two alternatives above and doesn't give as clean a cut.

[Jesse Cloud]

If you already have a router, then you can get by with some mdf and maybe a new sharp router bit.

Cut a pattern in the mdf the size of the mortise +the difference (half on each side) between the template guide and the bit diameter. Use a file to fine tune the square corners.

Nail or screw the mdf pattern onto a board that you will use for a fence. the key thing here is how far the hole in the pattern is from the fence - that will determine how far your mortise is from the edge of your leg or whatever.

Clamp the pattern/fence to your workpiece. WIth the power off, plunge the router till the bit touches the workpiece, now set the router's depth gauge to zero. Set the depth of cut to the depth of the mortise.

Chop out the mortise with several light passes. If desired, use a chisel to square off the corners.

This will give you a much better mortise at a cheaper cost than a mortiser or drill press.

[scott spencer]

Hi Wes - I've never used a mortising kit on a DP but my understanding is that they don't work all that well b/c a mortiser requires a fair amount of leverage which is difficult to achieve with a typical short DP handle, not to mentioned how far the DP's handle needs to be turned to travel the full stroke. I went the route of picking up a $100 dedicated mortiser from Harbor Freight. I tend to approach my HF purchases cautiously, and with good reason, but this one does work fairly well and has been more than sufficient for the occasional mortises I do. I recently completed a project with 36 M&T joints and the HF mortiser worked fine.

http://www.harborfreightusa.com/html/wkend0601/images/8.gif

[Mike Henderson]

The mortising kit that fits on a drill press is a pain in the rear - unless you leave it on all the time. And even then, it doesn't work well because the arms on the drill press aren't long enough so it's very hard to pull the bit down.

But if you're not going to make a lot of mortises, you can drill them out and clean the mortise with a chisel. Use a bit that's just a little smaller than the mortise (because you never drill all the holes exactly in place). Quick and works very well.

The absolute best thing for making a mortise is a horizontal slot mortiser but that's a lot more money and takes quite a bit of room. The next best thing is a dedicated mortising machine with the square bits. Either is only worth it if you're going to do a lot of M&T joinery.

Mike

[Randal Stevenson]

NEVER heard anyone who ended up liking the drill press kits for mortising. Heard several that bought them (and refused money for them as they thought so little). Router or drill and chisels, or dedicated machines are the only ways I have ever heard people happy.

[Don Abele]

Wes, when I bought my Jet DP many years ago it came with the mortising attachment (thankfully it was free). I tried using it several times and absolutely hated it. I threw it away (I was not about to subject anyone else to such pain and agony).

After that, I went with the method that Mike mentioned using drilled holes and chisels. Not quick, but I wasn't doing a lot, so it worked just fine (and is MUCH better than that DP attachment).

When I had a project that required a lot of mortises I bought the Delta dedicated mortiser. I have been thankful I did every time I use it. Quick, easy, repeatable, accurate. I chose it over others because with "hands-on" testing I liked the feel of it, especially the handle.

Now...all of them, right out the box are not going to perform well. And this is what causes a lot of negatives reviews of them. The chisels HAVE to be sharpened. I was a little worried when I first used mine and noticed it wandering, burning, and leaving really ragged holes.

Someone here mentioned sharpening...bought the kit from Rockler http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=11153&filter=hollow%20chisel gave all the chisels a quick hone - WOW, what a difference. Now it performs like it is supposed to.

So if you are going to use a hollow-chisel mortiser, you also need the honing kit.

Be well,

Doc

[Doug Shepard]

Wes,

I'd advise making up a box jig to use a plunge router and end mill bits for mortising (that is, until you get your horizontal slot mortiser :D).

I've never loved hollow chisel mortising; I think it's slower than either of the two alternatives above and doesn't give as clean a cut.

That's pretty much my take on things too. I sold my Delta mortiser because the router cut ones were better. I usually use a spiral bit rather than endmills though. The cut quality on the bottom of the mortise isn't very important.

[John Thompson]

If you wait long enough Jason.. you will probably see someone giving the DP mortise kit away as I have seen it many times. Hard to set up as stated.. a pain to take down.. etc.. etc..

But the most important aspect is over-looked IMO. A drll press is a finesse machine that uses a small motor to drill a small hole with a small bit. The motor and plunge gears are made for just that. They are not made to plunge a square chisel into hard-wood time after time after time. Too much strain on the plunge gears and it will lead to excessive run-out in the chuck as wear will set in.

Router.. bench mortiser.. whatever... just spare yourself and avoid the DP attachment as many learned the hard way...

Regards...

Sarge..

[Frank Drew]

I usually use a spiral bit rather than endmills though.

Doug,

We might be talking about the same thing -- upcut two flute spiral end mills were what I used.

[Ryan Sparreboom]

My old man bought one of these and it seems to work WAY better than his DP mounted mortising jig. I havn't used it myself though. And you pretty much have to use floating tennons I think. (?)

http://www.mortisepal.com/

[C Scott McDonald]

I had the jig and it was horriable. Get a dedicated machine. I got a General and have been happy with it.

[Frank Drew]

And you pretty much have to use floating tennons I think. (?)

http://www.mortisepal.com/

You can cut a tenon on the piece that would normally have one and then round the tenon corners with chisel and/or rasp to match the round ends of the routered mortise (this is very easy and is much faster than chopping the mortise corners square, IMO.)

Or you can use loose tenons, as you mentioned.

[Greg Cole]

you will probably see someone giving the DP mortise kit away as I have seen it many times. Hard to set up as stated.. a pain to take down.. etc.. etc..Sarge..

I've offered to give my Delta one away numerous times, never had a taker on the offer. I think I can round up all the tid bits to it if you want it.
That said, you won't like it for all the reasons already posted.
My advice is to learn it the old fashioned way with a chisel & mallet. Then decide whether you want a dedicated mortiser, slot mortiser, something like an FMT or loose tenon cutter like a Domino.
Might just be me, but I like having the hands on old fashioned skills first before having a toy-tool do the work for you. I love the ability to grab a chisel, mallet and KNOW I can chop a good mortise. Oddly enough I can't hand cut a DT to save where I sit (haven't tried too hard either) but rumor has it M&T by hand is tougher than DT's... so there's hope.
Anyway, if ANYONE wants the Delta DP Mortise kit, PM me and pay shipping & its yours.

Cheers.
Greg

[Wes Ramsey]

Thanks for all the suggestions! Since I already have a drill press and use it pretty often, I think I may opt for the dedicated mortiser. I won't have room in my shop to work on longer pieces, but I have a piece of sturdy countertop and room to build it it's own station.

I'll be doing enough M&Ts that the Rockler kit would be a great investment. Thanks for the tip!

[Aaron Beaver]

You can cut a tenon on the piece that would normally have one and then round the tenon corners with chisel and/or rasp to match the round ends of the routered mortise (this is very easy and is much faster than chopping the mortise corners square, IMO.)

Or you can use loose tenons, as you mentioned.

Used that method too, and the loose tenons. I find both faster than pulling out the chisel, but that's just me. I would probably do more harm than good when I chiseled it.

[Andy Pratt]

I found hollow chisel sharpening cones on the lee valley website also, I can't remember what catagory they were under but I think they ended up being cheaper than the rockler kit and since I order from LV all the time anyway it saved on shipping cost. Just another option for everyone to know about.

[Peter Quinn]

Just for the record I have the Delta Mortising attachment that came with the drill press (probably would not have bough it otherwise) and when properly set up and run with sharp chisels and bits (which is hardly what I'd call those that were included) it does work fine for the occasional mortise session. I would not call it crap, but I would not call it a god send either. It is IMO a serviceable option for light use on small shallow mortises like those necessary for sash bars which is in fact all I presently use it for. Perhaps it is due to my Popeye like build, but for mortises 1/2" or less I have not found it excessively difficult to pull the lever and lower the head into the work. Also, for the attachment to work well you have to have a pretty solid drill press and a large auxiliary table with good hold downs.

I bought my drill press to use as a drill press primarily, and the set up time to attach the mortise device makes me want to leave it there at least until the end of the job in progress which becomes a problem when I need the drill press!

I have used a fair number of chisel mortisers at this point, and faced with the option of a bench top I would prefer to chew out the mortises with my teeth. I find that until you approach the $1K range for a floor model (general, powermatic) most chisel mortisers leave me wanting for more power, a moving table, better hold downs and more leverage. For large mortises or pieces with multiple mortises I usually seek another method like the router. Many bench top models are capable of cutting accurate mortises if you are patient and careful, and if they fit your space and budget are a good option. I am thankful I have other options.

If you get any chisel mortiser I second the other opinions that honing the stock bits and chisels is essential on all but the most high end chisel sets, and all sets will eventually need honing, so get the necessary sharpening implements and learn to use them. Also look for a good primer on setting up the mortiser as it is not exactly an intuitive process and makes all the difference for good results.

[Pat Germain]

I think there has been a design change to the drill press mortising attachments. I bought mine recently. It works pretty well and it's easy to install and remove. I do have a floor drill press which likely makes getting the necessary leverage easier.

My attachment involves a holding piece which fits onto the drill press easily and clamps down by moving a lever about 1 1/2". It has an alignment pin to insert and make sure the holding piece is set properly. Then you attach the mortising bit and your done. You can leave the fence in place or remove it, which isn't that difficult.

As I stated in another post, I think modern mortising attachments are a reasonable compromise. If you use a router to cut mortises, the drill press mortiser works great for squaring up the corners.

[David DeCristoforo]

All things being equal, an attachment will never work as well as a "dedicated" machine. In this case, the drill press attachment will be inferior to a dedicated mortiser. Cost wise, you may find that it's a "wash" and the drill press with an attachment would be more versatile overall than a dedicated machine. However, with a limit of $200 you are not going to be buying "top quality" machines either way. Most tools in this price range, whether you are talking about a drill press or a dedicated mortiser are going to be pretty "light duty". And, whichever you go with, buying the hollow chisel sharpening "kit" is an absolute must.

[J. Z. Guest]

From a fellow small shop guy, I'd recommend taking a pass on the M&T's and using dowels. There are feelings both pro & con for dowels, but basically, they are round M&Ts that are much easier to do. A top-of-the-line dowel jig such as Dowelmax will let you adapt nearly any M&T design for dowels. It is fast, accurate, and versatile. There is never a question of joint fit; it is either perfect or it doesn't go together.

[Chris Kennedy]

. . .

But if you're not going to make a lot of mortises, you can drill them out and clean the mortise with a chisel. Use a bit that's just a little smaller than the mortise (because you never drill all the holes exactly in place). Quick and works very well.

. . .
Mike

I'm with Mike on this one, with one small adjustment. I have a BeadLOCK jig, which I use to hog out the majority of the material and then finish with chisels. It has the advantage of doing a good job of setting up the mortise nicely. It has the disadvantage that you really only have two options for the width of the mortise.

Cheers,

Chris

[Wes Ramsey]

From a fellow small shop guy, I'd recommend taking a pass on the M&T's and using dowels. There are feelings both pro & con for dowels, but basically, they are round M&Ts that are much easier to do. A top-of-the-line dowel jig such as Dowelmax will let you adapt nearly any M&T design for dowels. It is fast, accurate, and versatile. There is never a question of joint fit; it is either perfect or it doesn't go together.

Thanks for the suggestion Jeremy. I actually think the dowelmax idea is pretty sweet, and I don't really have a problem with doweling pieces. For building this particular piece I want to use it as a learning experience - build the best piece I can with what I have, what I know, and what I can afford. I have some specific projects in mind in the future that will for sure have real through tenons, so I figure if I can afford the equipment now I can start getting good with M&Ts on this project.

On the other hand, I'm not opposed to waiting until I can afford the 'right' tool, as long as there's a sound way to do it without that tool.

[Chris Padilla]

I recently did a few mortises simply using my router table. I have a very nice solid carbide up/down cut 1/2" diameter router bit along with a PRL from Woodpeckers. It was a bit slow but the mortises are clean and perfect.

I then made some floating tenon stock to fit just ever so snugly and rounded them over on the same router table with a roundover bit (1/4" roundover).