Sawstop -- does it NEED DC?

[Tom Henderson2]

One of the photos in John Lemke's post about moving his Sawstop cabinet saw shows the Sawstop with the side panel off.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=88668&d=1210909660

This shows the hose that connects the dust-collection shroud around the blade to the DC port in the base of the cabinet.

Looking at it, it seems that a DC system would be mandatory, otherwise the dust would likely pile up in the hose.

So is a DC system a requirement? If so, is that unique to SS or do all modern cabinet saws REQUIRE a DC system.

I have lusted for a Sawstop or other modern cabinet saw, but a DC system is out of the question for me as I just don't have the room.

Just wondering.

-Tom H.

[Joe Jensen]

Interesting question. I'm sure someone here has one without a collector. If you didn't have a collector, you could just unhook the hose from the bottom of the shroud. Then the cabinet would catch the dust..joe

[Brian Penning]

What Joe says makes sense to me.
You can always call SawStop and ask them.

[Per Swenson]

I can tell you this,

Once in awhile due to hustle and bustle or laziness,

our hose is unhooked for a few minutes.

These are not a pleasant few minutes.

You mention that dust collection is out of the question.

How about a smaller one tool system?

If that is not a option, do you have a shop vac?

You could rig a reducer.

Granted folks it's a lousy Idea and I am not advocating it,

But a man needs to do what..........


Per

[Prashun Patel]

The cabinet will contain some of the dust.

However, without suction in the cabinet from a vacuum or dc, much of the dust at the blade won't even make its way into the cabinet; it'll be spewed forward.
The blade guard helps mitigate that. In fact, with a 'sharkguard' style guard, you can rig a shopvac to catch a lot of the overhead dust.

I also am space-constrained in my basement but was able to find space for dc. If you have the space for a cab saw, then you should also have the space for a small (1hp-ish) dc.

The portable ones collapse down to a very small footprint when the bag's not inflated. With a 1micron bag and a short-as-poss duct, you'll do a decent job of catching the dust.

Also, when you decide to upgrade to a real DC eventually, you can enshroud your portable in a plywood box with some air filters to make a very good ambient air cleaner.

[Maurice Ungaro]

Not collecting the dust is NOT an option. If you spend that much on a Saw Stop, what's another $200 for a 1.5 hp roll-about collector?

[Steven Wilson]

Get a dust collector and find the room.

[Anthony Anderson]

Definitely get a dust collector, at least a 1100cfm, and plumb it to all of your tools. The piping that I used is nothing fancy, pvc 4" branches, flex drops, with 6" main trunk, but works very well. I also wrapped the pipes with copper wire to dissipate the static electricity, it was more of an annoyance than anything else. Also, get a remote for the dc. You may also want to consider an air filter when you can afford it. You do not want to breathe in all that dust. I understand having a small shop, mine is 12x22, and space is at a premium. Just tuck the dust collector in a corner, and build a storage shelf above it to use the verticle space. Good Luck, Bill

[Carl Fox]

Dust collection could be as simple as a large shop vac on a shelf. It does not have to be a 9' Oneda.

DC is very nice to have. So is an air filtration system. *cough* *cough*.

[Don Bullock]

...
Looking at it, it seems that a DC system would be mandatory, otherwise the dust would likely pile up in the hose.

So is a DC system a requirement? If so, is that unique to SS or do all modern cabinet saws REQUIRE a DC system.

I have lusted for a Sawstop or other modern cabinet saw, but a DC system is out of the question for me as I just don't have the room.

Just wondering.

-Tom H.

Tom,

I have used my SS without DC and you are correct. The saw dust does clog it up fairly quickly. Once I noticed this I chose to shove my ShopVac hose as far up the SS DC connection tube as it would go. This did help, but didn't get all the saw dust. When Rockler had the Jet 1 hp DC with remote on sale last year (with rebate it was less than half price) I added it to my shop. ( See http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=69842) It does a great job of removing all the sawdust from my SS. While the Jet DC does take up some space, it is easy to move around the shop. I now use it on my jointer and planer in addition to the SS.

[Lance Norris]

So is a DC system a requirement? If so, is that unique to SS or do all modern cabinet saws REQUIRE a DC system.-Tom H.

Tom... I have a Delta cabinet saw, and was using the stock 4" dust port, hooked up to a 600cfm Delta Collector. The collection was poor enough, even with this collector, that the end of the motor where the cooling air enters, was plugging with sawdust. The cooling fan inside the motor was pulling it into the cover. It was so bad that all it took was several cuts and the cover was completely plugged. Now I have seen pictures of cabinet saws with so much dust inside them that it literally is piling up on the floor. This was a picture of an old Unisaw, so I dont know if there was a fan and cover on this type motor or not. What I have done to fix this is, I upgraded my dust collector to a much larger unit and ran a second, seperate 4" line into the saw cabinet and the results have been dramatic. Now I only get a few tablespoons of dust in the corners of the cabinet. To answer your quote above, I would say without a doubt, Yes, all modern cabinet saws need dust collection. They all come with TEFC (Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled) motors. IMHO, without dust collection, you risk motor damage.

[Curt Harms]

..........

[Chris Padilla]

I dunno. Table saws have been run far longer WITHOUT DC than WITH DC. DC is a fairly 'recent' deal....

However, I think DC should be considered whenever possible. It is just much nicer with it being use overall for neatness, health, and probably other things.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

do all modern cabinet saws REQUIRE a DC system.

In a word - - - No.

You will however have to unbolt and remove the dust shroud and either lay it on the floor of the saw cabinet or remove it entirely.

My slider came with such a shroud and I have no DC.
It got all jammed up with crap almost right away so I took it off. The dust builds up in the cabinet and I take a shop-vac to it occasionally.

Some Euro style machines absolutely have to have a DC of some sort on 'em like the Planers and combo JP/Planers. For some reason European engineers are not capable of imagining a shop without DC. Maybe they have a law over there is some such.

If you run a euro planer without DC the chips will get trapped between the out-feed roller and the work dimpling the surface of the wood.

[Joe Jensen]

WOW, this is so funny. Everyone here is all about the dust collector. I did serious hobby shop time for 25 years before I had a dust collector.
1) Is dust good for you, NO.
2) Do some have serious allergies, YES.
3) Should commercial shops expose workers for long hours every day to dust NO
4) Is the hobbiest level of dust a huge and horrific risk? I think one could argue that drinking one beer and driving, or eating wings once a week is bigger health risk than the dust.

I ended up getting a dust collection system because my shop also holds one car, and I was tired of spending so much time cleaning up every time I made some sawdust.

Don't get me wrong, it's really nice having a dust collection system, and I don't doubt it's healthier

[jason lambert]

I have been running mind without dust collection since I don't have it installed yet, I tried a vac but it doesn't pull enought through and it still clogs. I just cut what I need and vacuum it out now and then. It has been fine but I would get a small jet to put next to it, nothing big, the one that fits right under the table. It will keep everything else dust free as well and don't worry if you like the smell os sawdust some will still escape.

[Chris Padilla]

Does anyone take a leaf blower, start at the back of their shop, and go to town?

I do this about once a month: pull the car, truck out of the driveway...park them UP wind, put away items easily dislodged by 100 mph wind (but I alwasy miss a few ;) ), then fire up the leaf blower and let the neighborhood breathe in a month's worth of MDF, plywood, cedar, maple, walnut, and good old "2x4 wood". There might be some cobwebs, spiders, bug carcasses, leafs, and metal shaving tossed into the cocktail as well. My DC doesn't capture EVERYTHING....

:D :D :D

[Larry Fox]

Does anyone take a leaf blower, start at the back of their shop, and go to town?

Yep - same here. As a matter of fact, that is in the plans for tomorrow if the weather holds.

As far as DC with the TS. I have a Uni and used to have a 4" line running to it. It got clogged up all the time and didn't work. I ran 6" to it over the winter and cut the cabinet in the back to open it up to 6" also and there is no dust whatsoever in there now (when I remeber to trigger the collector that is).

[Tom Henderson2]

I dunno. Table saws have been run far longer WITHOUT DC than WITH DC. DC is a fairly 'recent' deal....

However, I think DC should be considered whenever possible. It is just much nicer with it being use overall for neatness, health, and probably other things.

Hi Chris and everyone-

If I'm understanding the responese, the consensus is that modern cabinet saws that include blade-shrouds that are ducted to a DC port do need a dust collector of some sort, or they will get plugged up fairly quickly. I don't know why that had never occurred to me before, but is is pretty obvious now.

As Chris notes, the older saws that did NOT include blade-shroud devices have been around for decades and will work fine without a DC.

I'd love to have some sort of DC, but at the moment there just isn't space for it. Now, if I could just move the washer, dryer, furnace, water heater, pantry and household storage out of the garage, I'd be in good shape. But that isn't going to happen any time soon...

Thanks again for the info.

-TH

[Paul Johnstone]

I have lusted for a Sawstop or other modern cabinet saw, but a DC system is out of the question for me as I just don't have the room.

Just wondering.

-Tom H.

How big is your right side fence extension table.. You might be able to fit a DC under that.. I find it hard to believe you have zero room for a DC, as a table saw requires a lot of space to manuever boards in and out..

[Wayne Watling]

The questison should really be; do I need DC ? forget about the tablesaw.

[Jerry Booher]

Installing my cyclone DC took far longer than it should have. Therefore I used my SawStop without it for a month or two. I hooked up a shop vac with a 4x2.5 reducer. It worked, but not very well. I had to frequently open the cabinet and vacuum the saw dust. With the cyclone finally hooked up, very little accumulates in the cabinet.

I, too, enjoy blowing out the shop with a leaf blower. I always wonder what the neighbors think when they see a cloud coming out the overhead door. Is there a way to collect dust from a circular saw used to break down plywood or MDF sheets?

Jerry

[Chris Padilla]

I, too, enjoy blowing out the shop with a leaf blower. I always wonder what the neighbors think when they see a cloud coming out the overhead door.

Don't ask, don't tell? ;) I usually only try to do this on particularly windy days as it helps disburse things better but no one has ever complained to my face and I really don't do it once a month...maybe every 2 months.


Is there a way to collect dust from a circular saw used to break down plywood or MDF sheets?

Yes: Festool! :eek: Expensive as all get out but their DC is quite amazing...really. :)

[john bateman]

Well, this is certainly small....
http://woodworker.com/cgi-bin/FULLPRES.exe?PARTNUM=065-115

http://woodworker.com/images/ss/065-115.jpg

[Ben Rafael]

Spending that much on a saw and not spending another $150 or so on a DC is like buying a Ferrari and getting cloth seats because the leather is another $1000.
Get a DC, there are some portable DC units out there if space is an issue.

[Peter Quinn]

If you don't have room for a DC you don't have room to take advantage of a cabinet saw and should frankly avoid the entire purchase. When you figure in an infeed, outfeed, and outboard support system (which can be movable, but so is a small DC) it takes some space. If your space for wood working is very limited I recommend a good band saw, and....a dust collector!

A cabinet saw with out DC will contain more dust than say a contractor or portable saw, but its still a messy affair to use and clean up after. I use a small JDS DC on wheels that works well and I'll get rid of my cabinet saw before I go without a DC.

My guess is you have room for both.

[Ben Rafael]

Space shouldn't be an issue. There is space under each wing, also a DC can be hung on the ceiling with a hose leading down.

[Bart Leetch]

So Tom How about a shop layout maybe we can help you find a place for a DC.

[Karl Brogger]

Does anyone take a leaf blower, start at the back of their shop, and go to town?


Hell Yeah!! I do this almost every day. I like a clean shop, and we make a mess when busy. DC or not.