A Scam ?? What do you think?

[Pete Simmons]

I sell woodpens on the web.

Got this today. Edited to remove real names.

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recipientPete@subjectWoodPenMan
contact Responseemaildddd@gggg.com (Responseemaildddd@gggg.com)
first_naChin Lee
last_naLeeaddressgggggggg
cityCauseway Bay
stateHong Kong
zip_code00000
phone_no25555555
TextDear Mr. Simmons, Hello and Greetings from Hong Kong. I am interested in the following pens what I have seen on your web site.
Please advise whether you can ship to Hong Kong (by USPS Global Priority Mail).
I am intersted to get fountain pens in these 4 woods, all made to the same size/style. (1) Morton Bay Fig (2) Bethelem Olivewood (3) Timeless Timber Bird Eye Maple (4) Ancient Kauri If at all possible, I would very much like to get all 4 pens in the Statesman style (any finish - Ti-Gold, Platinum or Rhodium) Please let me know the possibility and the pricing. Best Wishes, GGGG

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What do you think?


Maybe I will sell him one pen and see how that goes. If all goes well then the other 3.


I am afraid of chargebacks either via CC or Paypal.


What is a safe payment method short of a gold coin in a blank envelope.


I have shipped to 3 or 4 countries with no problems but this one worries me.

[Dan Hintz]

The word choice leads me to believe it's Nigerian, not Chinese. Asians have a much different twist on English...

Have you looked at the full IP address of the email? That would be more telling.

[Joe Chritz]

Normally if you have to second guess yourself it is for a reason.

I never, NEVER, NEVER ignore a gut feeling or instinct. If something looks suspicious it is.

That said it could be a good deal, just make sure you get some kind of protected payment, cleared first.

Joe

[Scott Shepherd]

In a previous venture, I shipped to about 40 countries and I shipped quite a few packages to Hong Kong. Remember, Hong Kong is an international city and there are loads of English, Australian, and other's from all over the world working there. They usually seemed to be in the financial industry and have plenty of money to spend.

It didn't read like a scam to me. You can always tell him the pens will ship after payment has cleared. You can even have him wire the money directly to your account, but it'll probably cost him a fair amount to do that.

With things like Internet Telephony, I'd get the guy's phone number and give him a call. Will cost you less than $5 to speak to him directly.

[Raymond Fries]

I would sell him whatever he wants a s long as the payment cleared my bank.

I also agree that if it does not feel right, then do not do it.

I hope it works out for you.

One other thought on the source. If you right click on the email and select View Source, you will see the routing. Maybe you could trace the source that way.

[Raymond Fries]

I guess I should have mentioned that by Pre-Pay I was thinking a cashier's check or money order that proves the payment is good.

[Phil Thien]

Very interesting. I'd say 50-50. Give him pricing and terms, make sure he knows payment has to clear, and see what he says.

[Luke Phillips]

Be aware that cashiers checks and money orders are often fake too and it takes the bank some time to find out that the paper is worthless - then they take it out of your account to cover the loss. Wire funds directly to your account is probably safest way.

Seems that a lot of us have been getting these odd quote requests from foreign "buyers". Hope the SMC email/contact lists haven't been compromised in some way?

[Steve knight]

looks like too much detail for a scam. they don't usually want some many different things and don't specify so many options.

[Pete Simmons]

Thanks for all the info.

I have communicated via email several times with the person. I do not think it is a scam. I am going to go ahead with Paypal .

We set up a payment method for the order with a deposit.



I will keep you posted.

[Craig Hogarth]

Like most here, I get a lot of the scammer emails, but this one doesn't seem like what we normally see. Generally they appear to be a generic cut and paste type email, but from the looks of yours, it sounds like he actually spent some time looking through your website. If it were me, I'd treat him as a genuine prospect until you have reason to doubt him.

btw, cashier checks and money orders are easy to forge. You'll be ale to cash them, but once they're determined to be a forgery, you'll be held liable. There's all sorts of information about it on the internet.

[Dee Gallo]

Just FYI: the Hong Kong phone prefix is 852. They have no postal code.

I would think PayPal is your safest way to go, since they have to basically transfer the funds from a bank account.

I wonder what makes your pens so different from any he could get there? No offense, but it seems like there must be a million businesses in Hong Kong and with all the Chinese lasers being sold, why wouldn't he have a closer place to get them? Of course, there is the "exotic" factor... I know a lot of Chinese who prefer to buy American because they think it's better, and it is!

my two cents, dee

[Pete Simmons]

Dee:

I bet they do not have Timeless Timber ( First cut virgin forest of the USA ) or a Morton Bay Fig tree that Tom Edison planted?

[Dee Gallo]

I see, said the blind man... and spectacularly beautiful they are, too! I get a lot of pen catalogs, but yours are unique and you are right, it's all about the wood. Very nice work!

So back to your guy, I hope he is legit and now seeing what he ordered, it is not likely he could find them anywhere else. Collectors go where the goods are.

cheers, dee

[Pete Simmons]

You know what pen turners say?

"Good wood does NOT grow on trees. You have to go out and find it!"

[Barbara Buhse]

I work in a bank... Tellers checks, money orders, etc... ANYTHING PAPER that is not actual cash... is subject to come back to haunt you even a month later.
Here's a quick rundown:

Deposit paper.
Wait for it to clear
Yay! It clears five days later! BUT WAIT...
Uh oh, two weeks later the Fed returns it as counterfeit.
You're out the money.

WHY? Because todays computer technology enables us to clear the paper as a facsimile, and then and only then actually send it to the issuing bank for the real money.

I would not even be surprised if he then gave you that old story about sending more and then please wire money back etc...

Get the money wired or just deposit and hold the paper payment for 5 weeks to be sure. You can also call the issuing bank, but DO NOT call the number on the paper check, since its probably also fake. Look it up on the internet. You can even accept a credit card, process it, call the issuing bank (ask for the bank name, not just the card type) and make sure its a good card, and also as a safe measure, wait two weeks to make sure that payment is not also reversed.

hey, I'm from NY... I'm suspicious by nature.

[Dan Hintz]

Teller checks, money orders, etc... ANYTHING PAPER that is not actual cash... is subject to come back to haunt you even a month later.

This is worth repeating 50 times over, but I'll just quote it once for good measure. Too often I see merchants hosed by accepting a check, only to have the money taken back out a month later when it's determined to be a fake document.

[Pete Simmons]

The deal was done. Pens made and (call me crazy) shipped a little prior to Paypal payment.

Payment made quickly.

Person loved the pens.

Whole deal went very smooth with no problems.

From more emails after he got the pens - This person is a pen collector.

A small USPS International Priority Mail package cost about $25 and took about 8 days.

[Tom Majewski]

Good deal Pete, glad it worked out.

I got an email from somewhere in or near China months ago.

"Need 6 as possible as soon. will need more."

That was it. No attachment, no description.

I guess I let my only overseas inquiry slip away-lol.

[Michael Kowalczyk]

Pete I hope all goes well for you with this order. I think he may not be able to get these types of exotic woods there and wants the quality that "Made in America" still stands for.

A WORD OF CAUTION TO ALL about International Bank Wires.

We keep a separate wire transfer account and that is the form we give out when any wire transfer is requested. I found out from the bank and other sources that if they can wire in $$ they also have found a way to wire it out. Nigeria is the most popular one abusing this currently but not the only one.

I just think it makes good business sense not to give out too much info and keep some transactions separate to protect your assets. It is easy to call your bank officer and have it transferred to your main account. That's how we do it. A very small amount is left in there and it is linked to the main account so there are no monthly fees. We also have them pay the wire fee that our bank charges and usually get a phone call when it arrives.

Many large business' have multiple account also. Operating, payroll, holdings, International and many others. All it takes is one scam to clean you out.:eek:

Hope this helps someone...

[Jim Huston]

Use your head when dealing with paypal!!! They will charge you back just like a CC company if payment to them bounces!! The BIG difference is that you will pay THIER fees also -- so you loose twice!! You have NO control how the buyer pays paypal -- you do not/will not know if it was a bank transfer or a credit card. One thing you know for sure -- they will not only NOT loose money in the deal, they WILL make a profit, even if you loose everything plus.
JimH

[Dan Hintz]

Use your head when dealing with paypal!!! You have NO control how the buyer pays paypal -- you do not/will not know if it was a bank transfer or a credit card.
I use a "personal" account for PP transactions and tell people direct debit is the only way I will accept payment... it tells me when an attempt was made to use a CC and I deny it.