Joinery Experiment

[J. Z. Guest]

There have been many discussion on the ultimate in joint strength. Do we want the strongest, or just strong enough?

I'm at the beginning of buildling our bedroom furniture. I've got one nightstand about 85% done. I used mortise & tenon and through dovetails on it. The other one already has M&T for most of the joints, but the drawer isn't done yet. I'm going to use either dowels or the plan-recommended lock joint (front) and dado (rear) for this drawer.

Next will be a bed, and then dressers. For the dressers I'm going to use Dowelmax on one, and go by the plan on the other.

I'm only 31, so and plan to keep this furniture for dozens of years. If the joints fail, I'll post up on it. Otherwise, I'll have firsthand experience as to what is "strong enough."

Doing the drawers with dovetails was a pain in the butt, even with a jig. The groovesfor the drawer bottoms didn't line up and it required lots of fine tuning.

Wish me luck!

[Chris Padilla]

What adhesive will you use? Keep track of the joints and where and the sizes...maybe calculate some glue surface area. Just some thoughts...you won't remember anything after a year goes by take lottsa pics and document it well! ;) haha

[J. Z. Guest]

Interestingly, I have a photographic memory for this kind of stuff. I will remember it 50 years from now.

I'll use poly glue for structural joints and TB or TBIII for the drawer joinery.

[Joe Scharle]

Doing the drawers with dovetails was a pain in the butt, even with a jig. The groovesfor the drawer bottoms didn't line up and it required lots of fine tuning.

Mastering your jig is well worth the effort. Shouldn't take more than 5 minutes to make a drawer with a jig. May have to chew up a lot of scrap at first, but I think you'll like the results.
Good luck,
Joe

[Eric Gustafson]

I have a photographic memory for this kind of stuff. I will remember it 50 years from now.


Spoken like a true youngin' ;)

[Mark Engel]

I have never been very good at trying to make dovetail joints.

One of my first projects when we moved into this house 13 years ago was a 5 drawer dresser out of wide pine boards. I used a drawer lock joint (router bit)for all four corners of the five drawers. This dresser is used daily and there is no sign of joint failure anywhere.

I do like the look of a well executed dovetail joint. I just haven't found the time or need to learn how to make them correctly and I haven't seen the need to make a stronger joint than any of the ones I have been using.

On a side note, the dresser was made with no mechanical fasteners, just to see if I could do it. Just joinery and glue. It was fun.

[J. Z. Guest]

Spoken like a true youngin' ;)

I should clarify that I'm not bragging about my memory in general. Just my memory for things that don't really matter much. Stuff that I need to remember is in one ear and out the other. :(

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

There have been many discussion on the ultimate in joint strength. Do we want the strongest, or just strong enough?

Unless you laminate all your joinery between 1/2" steel plates you won't have ultimate strength. Or is that 2" thick~? I guess we all just have to make a design call at some point and if life teaches an unkind lesson we try to learn from it.

[Mark Singer]

I would not use poly type glue! It often fails. I have repaired more than one piece and I just don't use it at all! TB II or III or epoxy are best. Plasstic resin glue is good and gives more open time.

[Jim Becker]

I'll use poly glue for structural joints and TB or TBIII for the drawer joinery.

Use the PVA glue for the structural joints, too. Poly glues are not really stronger, for the most part, and are not gap filling. And since you shouldn't use poly glue without wearing gloves (unless you love dark stains on your hands for a very long time...) you can cut out that mishigas, too.

I've pretty much moved to pocket screw joinery for things like small tables, etc., including the drawers, to speed things up given my shop time is so little. I don't expect any sacrifice in "effective strength" for these items. For a chair or bed where the stresses are much higher, I'd stick with traditional joinery, but elsewhere, I'm embracing new ideas and methods.

[Chris Padilla]

I would not use poly type glue! It often fails. I have repaired more than one piece and I just don't use it at all! TB II or III or epoxy are best. Plasstic resin glue is good and gives more open time.

I'll be the first to agree that poly glue can be a tad messy but I used it extensively on that floating maple tv stand I made a couple years ago and it is holding up fine. It was used to laminate plywood into thicker sandwiches and to secure the endingbanding on the arched front lip.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=6911

Some failures of poly I suspect may be due to moisture starvation. One is supposed to wet the mating piece.

[John Zilinskas]

The grooves for the drawer bottoms didn't line up and it required lots of fine tuning.

Wish me luck!

Why didn't you do the grooves last ? Thats what I do.

[J. Z. Guest]

Why didn't you do the grooves last ? Thats what I do.

I'll remember that for next time!

[Mike Cutler]

Interestingly, I have a photographic memory for this kind of stuff. I will remember it 50 years from now..

I used to have one too. Now the buffer must be full.:eek:
One new thought in, One old thought out.
I really wish I could select the old thought going out though.;)

Now to get back to the topic.

I think the joints you have selected, in those applications will be fine. All are time tested, and maintain the individual mechanical attributes of the joint in the event of adhesive failure. Which will occur, given enough time.
The dowels would be my last choice, personally. But, I recognize that dowels have been used with success for centuries, so it's an individual thing with me.:rolleyes:

You'll be giving that furniture to your kids someday.;)