Cutting plywood cabinetry

[Nick Prov]

Upon advise from this group, I went and bought the Festool saw + rail. Cut my cabinets with it. There was a little bit of chipping on the edges. Did not bother me this time, as nobody will see the edges once the hood gets attached and refrigerator moves in.

However, when I removed some doors, and cut them, I could not help but notice that the original edges were absolutely perfect and flawless -- no chipping whatsoever. I did not pay attention to this before, but now that I've tried, I realized how much of a problem this is.

This piqued my curiosity as to what kind of tool did the people who constructed the cabinetry in my house had used? Does anybody have any idea?

I thought the $500 Festool is as good as it gets, but apparantly there is something out there that is much-much better for cutting plywood. I am not going to buy one, I am just curious what it is.

-- Nick

[Leigh Betsch]

Scoring blade on a Euro Slider. My Mini Max slider can rip a 8ft sheet of pywood dead square and with the scoring blade raised totaly chip free. There are probably other ways to do this also.

[David DeCristoforo]

"I thought the $500 Festool is as good as it gets..."

It may be "as good as it gets" for five hundred but if you want it as good as it can get you will need to invest considerably more than that in a panel saw. That's what most cabinet shops use for cutting sheet stock.

[fRED mCnEILL]

When I cut plywood that I want to be absolutely CHIP FREE I first of all run the sheet BACKWARDS over the saw with the blade raised about 1/32. I know the safety comittee will consider this dangerous but with the blade up such a minimal amount there is no danger IMO.
Then I raise up the blade and cut the panel normally.

When you run the wood over the blade lowered and backwards it minics a scoring blade on one of those gazillion dollar saws. I've examined the cut under a magnifying glass and it is perfect.

Takes a little extra time but its not necessary on all cuts.

Fred Mc.

[Peter Quadarella]

I can get 100% perfect plywood cuts with the EZ Smart stuff. If I let my blade get a bit raggedy and chew up some of my zero clearance stuff I might get a few small splinters, but if I fix it up again its back to perfect.

[Leigh Betsch]

I like the sound of this. That is essentially what a scoring blade does, climb cuts about a 1/32, just thru the veiner. My Mini Max didn't cost a gazillion but it was a bit north of 10K, it's not for everyone but it's one of those tools that just makes me grin every time I use it.:)


When I cut plywood that I want to be absolutely CHIP FREE I first of all run the sheet BACKWARDS over the saw with the blade raised about 1/32. I know the safety comittee will consider this dangerous but with the blade up such a minimal amount there is no danger IMO.
Then I raise up the blade and cut the panel normally.

When you run the wood over the blade lowered and backwards it minics a scoring blade on one of those gazillion dollar saws. I've examined the cut under a magnifying glass and it is perfect.

Takes a little extra time but its not necessary on all cuts.

Fred Mc.

[Jamie Buxton]

When I cut plywood that I want to be absolutely CHIP FREE I first of all run the sheet BACKWARDS over the saw with the blade raised about 1/32. I know the safety comittee will consider this dangerous but with the blade up such a minimal amount there is no danger IMO.
Then I raise up the blade and cut the panel normally.

When you run the wood over the blade lowered and backwards it minics a scoring blade on one of those gazillion dollar saws. I've examined the cut under a magnifying glass and it is perfect.

Takes a little extra time but its not necessary on all cuts.

Fred Mc.

I do the same thing, but for the scoring pass I run it forward. It may not be a perfect mimic of the scoring blade, but it works, and it doesn't feel as weird!

[Jamie Buxton]

Perhaps they were cut on a slider or a panel saw, but if they're recent, they may well have been cut on a CNC router. They are systems with a giant router on an X-Y gantry controlled by a computer. They're common in cabinet shops now.

[Joe Chritz]

Most of the common stuff has been mentioned.

Scoring blade on a slider, panel saw and nested CNC are the big ones.

Lots of cab shops now out source all the parts. Send a cut list to a company with a CNC and they ship all the parts ready to go to assembly.

If you use a fine blade and a good new zero clearance you can almost get a perfect cut with a guided saw.

Remember good side down with a circular saw.

Joe

[Steve Flavin001]

shops sending work out, CNC, etc. are all good and well for them. The most important single item to my 40 some years of dabbling in some serious degree is the BLADE :) . Try a Freud Fusion blade, retail $100 and see the perfect cuts.

As Joe said, if you are using the Festool circular saw, good side down, but if possible you would want to do these on a table saw, good side up; I assume a table saw is a given for a project of this scope. Also keep the blade clean from gum buildup, zero clearance, plate. Finally, Freud tech. support is 1-800-472-7307; http://customerservice@freudtools.com

[JayStPeter]

I get chip free cuts using my Festool saw. Assuming your blade is clean and sharp, it could be a technique problem. The good side should be up during the cut and the part under the rail should be the keeper. If not technique, it could be alignment of the saw base to the rail. I'd call Festool, they'll help you debug the problem.

[Charlie Barnes]

I haven't tried the "scoring" method yet, but I'll give it a shot. I run a strip of masking tape along the path of the cut (good side up on a table saw). I bias the tape towards the "keep" side of the cut so that there's as much support as possible to keep the veneer together. Make sure to run your thumb along the tape to make sure it's really stuck to the plywood before cutting. Also, pull it off at an oblique angle to the grain, again to make sure that you don't lift up any of the veneer.

Charlie

[Peter Quinn]

I use a good melamine/veneer blade on my TS with a fresh ZCI running A face up and get nearly perfect results. The blade cost $140 and only gets used in veneered plywood.

When using a hand held circular saw I put a sheet of extruded foam insulation under the plywood as a backer, cuts down on chip out.

I don't build frameless cabs so I always orient the b side that may chip out to the blind side or bury any minimal tearing in a rabbit.

Most shops I worked at had big sliders for sheet goods, so a 14" blade has a real gentle exit angle on sheet stock and the scoring unit takes care of the rest. You can even run scoring blades with dados on some of them, though we did our dados mostly with an over arm pin router.

[Peter Quinn]

Another thought, when cutting plywood with fine veneers I typically run the blade up at nearly 2" height above the table, well beyond what I would do for solid wood of similar thickness. It seems to tear less given the gentler exit angle of the teeth. I wont do this for anything but wide panels where I am well away from the blade.

Can you run the festool at maximum depth when cutting plywood? I know I get better results with my skill saw/straight edge by setting the blade to maximum depth even when cutting 3/4" material. It is definitely less safe so you need to keep your wits about you and remember all that blade is hanging out.

[Ted Illi]

When I cut plywood that I want to be absolutely CHIP FREE I first of all run the sheet BACKWARDS over the saw with the blade raised about 1/32. I know the safety comittee will consider this dangerous but with the blade up such a minimal amount there is no danger IMO.
Then I raise up the blade and cut the panel normally.

When you run the wood over the blade lowered and backwards it minics a scoring blade on one of those gazillion dollar saws. I've examined the cut under a magnifying glass and it is perfect.

Takes a little extra time but its not necessary on all cuts.

Fred Mc.

When you say you run the materials "backwards over the saw" do you mean from the outfeed side to the infeed side of the table? If so whats wrong with just turning the blade around in the arbor and send them through against the fence in the normal way? The results should be the same and the fence is going to be totally functional?

[Jim Becker]

Leigh was the first to hit it...the material was probably cut in a production shop on a saw with a scoring blade.

Even when using a guided saw system, Festool or otherwise, you need proper support under the workpiece. (sacrificial stock) And remember that with hand-held circular saws, "good side down" is the normal way to work. That's harder to do if you are cutting down existing built-up cabinets. The rail provides great support for one side of the cut (the part under the rail) but the blade exiting up out of the material can still chip out a little on the unsupported side. You can help to mitigate this to some degree by pre-scoring that side of the cut line with a sharp knife as well as using blue painter's tape to help support the thin veneers on the cut line.

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

Upon advise from this group, I went and bought the Festool saw + rail. Cut my cabinets with it. There was a little bit of chipping on the edges. Did not bother me this time, as nobody will see the edges once the hood gets attached and refrigerator moves in.

-- Nick

Nick, Jim Becker is right and maybe you are doing it already but you didn't specify. You need to have a sacrificial board under the workpiece. Also, make sure the green plastic splinterguard on your saw is installed and contacting the workpiece and that the rubber zero clearance strip is installed and in good repair. Most of the tearout occurs on the side facing up as the sawblade rotates counter clockwise.

Which saw do you own, the TS75 or 55? Reason I ask is the 75 comes stock with an 8 1/4" 32 teeth blade and the 55 comes stock with a 6 1/4" 48 teeth blade. The smaller diameter and greater # of teeth will yield a much smoother cut. I bought a TS75 and then upgraded to a 52 teeth blade and noticed a marked improvement. As good if not better than my Unisaw with a Forrest WW2 blade installed.

[glenn bradley]

This piqued my curiosity as to what kind of tool did the people who constructed the cabinetry in my house had used? Does anybody have any idea?

Guided saws are great for breaking down sheet goods and like routers, folks add all kinds of stuff to them to make them do all sorts of tricks. This is great if space or location demands it or you just plain enjoy it. Given a choice, most folks would use a slider, a properly setup TS or a Panel saw in a production environment.

[Peter Elliott]

You can apply "blue" painters tape to the plywood if your using saw guide setup type. It helps a lot! Make sure your using a good plywood blade for cutting, I've had good luck with Freud.

[Steven Wilson]

Scoring blade on a Euro Slider. My Mini Max slider can rip a 8ft sheet of pywood dead square and with the scoring blade raised totaly chip free. There are probably other ways to do this also.
I was just in the shop making perfect cuts in plywood with my MiniMax combo, a scoring blade is so much better than any of the methods I use to use on my old Powermatic 66 (tape, maga dollar saw blades, scoring with a knife, chanting and making offerings to the plywood God's, etc). Having said that, the Festool circular saw/guide rail system comes very close most of the time so I would work on technique.