Bay Area DoveTail Cutter Wannabees

[Michael Perata]

I attended a very nice class on Classic Dovetail Cutting in San Francisco over the weekend and thought I would pass on my experience to anyone in the Bay Area who may want to take a class in the subject.

The instructor is Arnie Champagne, a crusty ol' Navy diver who just happens to make a good living now doing custom furniture pieces. www.champagnesfurniture.com (site is currently down).

Started out making half blind tails/sockets and then through tails/sockets ending up with a basic drawer.

Good workable technique was taught and I came away knowing a lot more than when I started. Small classes and small price ($195).

[Matthew Springer]

Hey where are you guys in San Jose anyway?

And where are you buying your wood? After spending the better part of 30 minutes yesterday scraping the planer burn marks off some Southern Lumber stock (ick), I've decided it's just not worth it to buy s4s from them since I end up getting twisty, expensive boards. Heck I can get twisty boards cheaper with hand tools.

-Matthew

[Alan Turner]

Michael,
Thanks for the report. Can you give more details? Class size? Materials included? What were they? How long was the class? Etc.
Thx.
Alan

[Lloyd Frisbee]

Hey where are you guys in San Jose anyway?

And where are you buying your wood? After spending the better part of 30 minutes yesterday scraping the planer burn marks off some Southern Lumber stock (ick), I've decided it's just not worth it to buy s4s from them since I end up getting twisty, expensive boards. Heck I can get twisty boards cheaper with hand tools.

-Matthew
Willow Glen, San Jose here. Haven't bought much lumber but Southern Lumber is expensive but they have a good selection. I am doing more lathe work now. Plenty of wet wood around.

[Michael Perata]

Michael,
Thanks for the report. Can you give more details? Class size? Materials included? What were they? How long was the class? Etc.
Thx.
Alan
Friend I attended the class with had just reviewed the Klausz tape and commented after the class how sloppy the Dovetails from Klausz were.

Class was two days Sat/Sun and there was four of us, just right size, cost $195. All materials were provided including tools you forgot to bring.

The tool list is extensive. Best tool tip: Zona saws. For dovetails they are slick. I couldn't even start my L-N DT saw with the thin material we used, but the Zona cut it like butter.

I now know how to cut a dovetail, only need to do it about 100 more times to get good. Arnie's dovetails ARE good.

[Michael Perata]

Hey where are you guys in San Jose anyway?

And where are you buying your wood? After spending the better part of 30 minutes yesterday scraping the planer burn marks off some Southern Lumber stock (ick), I've decided it's just not worth it to buy s4s from them since I end up getting twisty, expensive boards. Heck I can get twisty boards cheaper with hand tools.

-Matthew

Matt

I am down by 17/85, near Los Gatos.

STOP BUYING LUMBER FROM SOUTHERN LUMBER. :rolleyes: Do the math sometime and you'll find you are paying about $17/bf for maple/birch/pine. :eek:

[Matthew Springer]

[QUOTE=Michael Perata]Matt

<i>STOP BUYING LUMBER FROM SOUTHERN LUMBER. </i>

I don't usually, but since I can't really dimension stuff any other way, sometimes I convince myself it's a good idea. After the lasdt round of wood though with a 1/4" of crook in a 3/4" board, I'm done.

So where else is good? i've been to Global Wood Source a couple times. Where else?

[James Carmichael]

Friend I attended the class with had just reviewed the Klausz tape and commented after the class how sloppy the Dovetails from Klausz were.

Class was two days Sat/Sun and there was four of us, just right size, cost $195. All materials were provided including tools you forgot to bring.

The tool list is extensive. Best tool tip: Zona saws. For dovetails they are slick. I couldn't even start my L-N DT saw with the thin material we used, but the Zona cut it like butter.

I now know how to cut a dovetail, only need to do it about 100 more times to get good. Arnie's dovetails ARE good.

Zona? Isn't that an inexpensive little razor saw?

[Chris Padilla]

Global Wood source is decent.

Also, in downtown SJ, there is a place, Plywood for Less (PALS). Bad part, they are only open M-F. I like their prices on sheet goods. A1 Maple 3/4", $80.

Kind of behind Southern Lumber on Phelan Avenue (south of SL, go East from 1st) is Arco or Arko or something like that on the right side of the street just past the RR tracks. I didn't care for the sheet stock prices but their lumber is decent AND they are open on Saturday.

Nice to see a few more BA folks around!

BTW, I'm a good Montana toss from Michael Perata...(heh, I should say Elway...from CO.... :D )

[Manny Hernandez]

Have you tried Minton's there in Mountain View? It's on Evelyn Ave. Haven't been there in a while, but recall they had a fair selection. They used to have another location in Milpitas, a short distance from where I work.

I also recommend Arnie's classes. I took the dovetail class a few years ago and have since taken his plane making class and marquetry class.

Just wondering if I've seen any of you at the Bay Area Woodworkers meetings. Any of you members?



[QUOTE=Michael Perata]Matt

<i>STOP BUYING LUMBER FROM SOUTHERN LUMBER. </i>

I don't usually, but since I can't really dimension stuff any other way, sometimes I convince myself it's a good idea. After the lasdt round of wood though with a 1/4" of crook in a 3/4" board, I'm done.

So where else is good? i've been to Global Wood Source a couple times. Where else?

[Jamie Buxton]

[QUOTE=Chris Padilla]

Kind of behind Southern Lumber on Phelan Avenue (south of SL, go East from 1st) is Arco or Arko or something like that on the right side of the street just past the RR tracks. I didn't care for the sheet stock prices but their lumber is decent AND they are open on Saturday.
QUOTE]


That's Aura.

[Michael Perata]

Zona? Isn't that an inexpensive little razor saw?
Yep, all of $6 or 7 and may be the best buy you'll make for your tool box.

[Michael Perata]

Just wondering if I've seen any of you at the Bay Area Woodworkers meetings. Any of you members?

No. I sent an e-mail to an address I had for a schedule of meetings but never heard back.

Do you have a contact.

[Chris Padilla]

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SouthBayWoodworkers/ (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/SouthBayWoodworkers/)
Jamie sent this one to my attention. They meet the 4th Tuesday of every month somewhere in Saratoga.

For the mid-Peninsula guys, Jamie is a member of http://www.geocities.com/bawanewsletter/index.html (http://www.geocities.com/bawanewsletter/index.html)
They meet the 3rd Thursday of every month.

I think I might hit them both up one of these months.

[Manny Hernandez]

Yeah, what Chris said. :-)

I'm surprised Arnie didn't give you info on it.
Maybe I'll see you guys at the next meeting.



No. I sent an e-mail to an address I had for a schedule of meetings but never heard back.

Do you have a contact.

[Chris Padilla]

Willow Glen, San Jose here. Haven't bought much lumber but Southern Lumber is expensive but they have a good selection. I am doing more lathe work now. Plenty of wet wood around.

Hey Lloyd,

You are just up the street from me. I'm in the Thousand Oaks housing area surrounded by Almaden Expy, Capitol Expy, Branham Lane and Pearl St.

The wife and I were *this* close to buying a house in Willow Glen until we found the house we are now living in. :)

[Mark Singer]

I am not that close ...but we are in the same state. :cool:Drive a little further and you can buy @ Austin Hardwoods , Santa Ana or Tropical Exotic hardwoods...Carlsbad...It's a nice drive!
Klaus goes too fast for good dovetails! You are right!

http://www.anexotichardwood.com/ look at these deals!:p

[Chris Padilla]

Mark,

That is quite a site! I have drool all over my keyboard looking at that site! Thanks for sharing...wish it was closer...wait, no I don't! I wouldn't have any money and I'd be living in a cardboard box! :)

[Rick Haigh]

Yep, all of $6 or 7 and may be the best buy you'll make for your tool box.

Michael,
Do you have any specific information on the Zona saw you used? I found a website for them and they have several kerf's of saws available.

Thanks,
Rick

[Mark Singer]

Michael,
Which Zona saw did he use? They have one the call the "dovetail" saw and others are just called razor saws.

Here is a link to their website:

http://www.zonatool.com/

[Michael Perata]

Michael,
Do you have any specific information on the Zona saw you used? I found a website for them and they have several kerf's of saws available.

Thanks,
Rick

Rick

I apologize but I didn't get that information. I clicked on Mark's url and now I am absolutely confused. Darn you Mark. :mad: :p

I'll call tomorrow and find out.

[Manny Hernandez]

I was talking to Arnie Champagne tonight about an upcoming class and asked him about the saw. It's the 35-500 with 32TPI blade.
These saws cut on the pull stroke. According to some of the guys from the College of the Redwoods you can flip the blade around to make it a push saw.



Michael,
Which Zona saw did he use? They have one the call the "dovetail" saw and others are just called razor saws.

Here is a link to their website:

http://www.zonatool.com/

[Michael Perata]

I was talking to Arnie Champagne tonight about an upcoming class and asked him about the saw. It's the 35-500 with 32TPI blade.
These saws cut on the pull stroke. According to some of the guys from the College of the Redwoods you can flip the blade around to make it a push saw.

Manny

Thanks for the footwork. I used the saw in the traditional manner of a push stroke. It cuts very easily but will follow the grain if not careful. I found the best stoke to be a stroke that cuts the vertical and horizontal at the same time. Got consistent kerfs that way.

[Manny Hernandez]

No problem.
An interesting observation: I hadn't touched the zona since I took the class a few years back. It didn't work well for me and I wrote it off and started my quest for the "perfect" saw. After I posted the info above I went looking for my zona saw. I made some dovetail lines on a squared off board and tried using it again. I've come a long way and can cut some pretty good dovetails with my Japanese or LN saw. I found that I can now do the same with the zona. I guess practice is what really counts, huh? Still prefer my Japanese saw though.

Manny



Manny

Thanks for the footwork. I used the saw in the traditional manner of a push stroke. It cuts very easily but will follow the grain if not careful. I found the best stoke to be a stroke that cuts the vertical and horizontal at the same time. Got consistent kerfs that way.

[Tim Sproul]

Hey where are you guys in San Jose anyway?

And where are you buying your wood?

-Matthew

Matthew,

PALS (plywood and lumber sales) has rough stock. I've only been to the Oakland and San Francisco sites. The folks at both are very good and accomodating. I've been treated well regardless if I look through stacks for 2 hours and purchase nothing or if I purchase several hundred board feet. They often have lots of different types of woods to. EcoSource - Oakland, is owned by PALS and carries rough stock.

Watsonville - down a bit past Santa Cruz. Jackel Enterprises. I like them. Good prices. Good people. Good selection of the more common furniture woods - both hardwood and softwood.

Macbeath - San Francisco location stocks rough lumber. Berkeley location has sheet goods and surfaced stock.

Aura Hardwoods - limited selection by normally good pricing. Good selection of sheet goods.


Tim