Safety question: Which tools are most likely to cause injury?

[David Peters]

This is an unpleasant topic, to be sure, however it's a question that has been nagging me ever since my safety-minded brother-in-law, upon hearing that I was going to purchase a PM2000, asked "why not the SawStop?"

My primary reasoning, as silly as it seems in hindsight, was that all of the other stationary tools in my shop are Powermatic.

Now, having the benefit of learning from many of you (long-time anonymous lurker, first-time poster), the recent thread http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=81807 has put me close to the tipping point where I'd like to sell my PM2000 and replace it with a SawStop.

Before I do, however, I'd like to ask one last question, which is the point of this thread (whew, this is a long intro!).

One tiny seed of doubt that was put in my head from a local Woodcraft owner was that the majority of TS accidents were from kickback, not skin-blade contact. That got me thinking....

Is there any information, either quantitative or qualitative, about the relative injury rates of major woodworking accidents? I've heard that certain tools are more dangerous than others -- the jointer, for example, is frequently mentioned, and there's no SawStop for that (yet?) -- however I use my TS much more frequently than my jointer.

So if you had to guess, for any potential major accident in the shop, which are the most frequently occurring?

[For the curious, if the consensus is that TS skin-blade contact is high up or at the top of the list, that will be the tipping point for me.]

[Terry Teadtke]

The table saw is the most dangerous tool on the shop in my opinion followed by the shaper. According to the Saw Stop DVD, 90,000+ table saw accidents serious enough to require medical attention happen a year or about one every six minutes. If one can afford it, it's almost a crime not to seriously consider a Saw Stop if you're looking for a new saw. I would hope down the road Saw Stop will build other equipment like planers, jointers, shapers, and so on with their quick stop technology. Originally the Saw Stop people had no intention of building their own saws because they thought other manufactures would be interested in purchasing their stop brake. I don’t know the particulars (probably price) but none of the other saw manufactures were interested. I’m wondering what the other saw manufactures are thinking now seeing how well the Saw Stops are selling. And to think that the Saw Stop technology was developed just a few miles south of me in Wilsonville, Or.

Terry

[Ken Fitzgerald]

David....there are a lot of statistics out there concerning woodworking tool accidents. As a I get older I get more skeptical about the reliability of the same statistics. Statistics, like "polls" can be juggled to verify anything you want.

That being said:
'
Kickback and flesh/blade contact are both major problems when dealing with table saws. Sawstop has their way of combating it. European type slider saws have a different way of combating it.

But....the most dangerous tool in the shop is the one you are operating either under the influence of some drug...alcohol is a drug....operating while being overly tired.....operating while being distracted........whether it's a jig saw, circular saw, router, shaper, tablesaw, bandsaw......they are all dangerous if the person operating it isn't properly knowledgeable about safe operation or 100% paying attention to what they are doing and doesn't have it completely thought out before starting. Even hand tools can be extremely dangerous.

I personally know a lady who was doing some remodeling....her being a woman has nothing to do with her skills by the way it could have just as easily been a man......she had an accident with a circular saw that resulted in her femoral artery being cut by the CS blade and she nearly bled to death before they got her to the hospital.

I've seen some stats posted around here that were supposedly taken from ER reports and the number is quite high...higher than I had expected. Is a Sawstop worth it. In my opinion yes. And that's from a guy who said he'd never buy one after they petitioned the CPSC to enforce a similar style device on all consumer table saws. Someday, when I have an extra 5 grand, I might buy one. In the mean time, I'll be extremely careful with my T/S.

[Carl Fox]

ANY tool can be dangerous. They are like motorcycles. In the right hands a bike is pretty safe, with the right training and equipment, but a moments inattention can be a life-changing experience.

You determine how 'safe' a tool is. Whenever I approach a tool I take a good look at my hands. I marvel on how God designed them with all the tenons, nerves, bones, vessels, etc. I strive to make sure my hands look exactly the same after I use a tool as before.

Heck, today I was trying to teach my bride to use a screwdriver and suggested she wear my mechanic's armored gloves.

A healthy fear of injury is the beginning of wisdom. IMHO, sawstop is a double-edged sword. Sure, they prevent injury. However, they also give a feeling of confidence so it becomes tempting to be sloppy.

I like being afraid of that spinning blade, it builds respect for the equipment.

That being said, if I had tons of money and was in the market for a new TS, Sawstop would be on my short list. I understand on top of the safety features it is a top-notch machine.

[David Peters]

Kickback and flesh/blade contact are both major problems when dealing with table saws. Sawstop has their way of combating it. European type slider saws have a different way of combating it.


Agreed... one of my rationalizations was that if the Woodcraft owner was correct, and the majority of accidents were indeed from kickback, well the PM2000 has pretty good safety features in that regard -- although having said that, one of the things that impressed me with the SawStop video was the ease of changing the riving knife to full splitter and back; something that's more difficult on the PM2000 which means, of course, it doesn't happen as often as it probably should.

I also appreciate the comments about other safety considerations -- in my opinion those always apply, and are absolutely the most important factors in keeping people safe. What I have started to realize, however, is that given the number of hours one spends in front of a big power tool, even if you're exercising extreme caution 99.999% of the time, it's that 0.001% that having something like a SawStop might be a finger-saver. And with all possible respect and nearly infinite humility towards the fine craftsmen on SMC, it does seem that a fair number of the members here have had an unfortunate accident at one point in their lives.

I think I might be talking myself into it.... I just hope the height of the table is similar otherwise the guy who helped me build my massive outfeed table is going to be pissed 'cause we haven't even finished it yet!

[Mike Henderson]

To me, the difference between a kickback and touching the blade is that the kickback will most likely hurt you but you'll recover. Touching the blade often (usually?) leaves permanent injuries.

When I buy a new saw, I plan for it to be a SawStop.

Mike

[Tom Veatch]

Since I've never encountered operational blade/skin contact with my table saw and have encountered kickback, my first hand experience is that kickback is the more common. But, since no injuries more extensive than bruises have resulted, I don't know that they qualify as "major accidents".

I think you'd be better advised to consider the potential for serious/major injuries rather than just the frequency of occurrence. A kickback that doesn't induce a blade contact injury has a relatively low protential for serious injury. Whereas, blade contact has a relatively high potential for very serious injury.

Without having reliable statistical data, my WAG is that even if there are more kickback incidents during a given period of time, there would be more incidents of serious injury from blade contact than from kickback during that same period of time.

Even if the Saw Stop didn't do any more than any other saw to prevent kickback, it would be no worse in that respect than other saws. That makes the frequency of kickback is a non-issue in choosing between the Saw Stop and some other model. You'd face essentially the same probability of encountering kickback whichever saw you chose.

However, the Saw Stop does appear to take effective action to prevent blade contact injury. You're the only one who can weigh for yourself the cost effectiveness of that feature.

[josh bjork]

I was gonna answer chisels, but you have all taken a turn in another direction.

[Will Blick]

David, a very valid question. But like most well thought out questions, there is rarely solid data that will answer your question. I have wondered the same thing for a long time. There was a web site that was dedicated to ww power tool injuries, but I can't find the link. If anyone would know, you would think Saw Stop would, as the true uniqueness of their saw prevents blade contact.

Kieth raises an under-stated issue regarding TS injuries. Of course, I realize there will be NO stats to support this, but I wonder what % of the blade contact injuries were a result of being "under the influence", extreme fatigue, or just plain unsafe practices. Regardless, as mentioned, there is no disadvantages of owning a SawStop, other than your bank account. But even then, if you can afford it, seems like cheap insurance policy over a 10 year period....


What I does surprise me is... it seems we all know someone who has made TS blade contact. A friend of mine who is quite smart, last year, a friend of mine, almost lost a few fingers, luckily, they sewed them back on, and after a year of constant medical treatments, the fingers have maxed out at 40% usable...with no sensation of touch. Its very sad.


He is a regular beer drinker, drinks beer every day, never really drunk, but not quite 100% either. I did not have the nerve to ask him how many he had the day of the accident, but if I had to guess, the booze was a major contributor to the accident.


Its tough selling a used TS, my guess is, you take a big hit on it?

[Tom Veatch]

I was gonna answer chisels, but you have all taken a turn in another direction.

If you measure "serious injury/major accident" by the amount of blood spilled, then I'd have to agree that chisels are historically the most dangerous tool in my shop.

[Eric Sayre]

My father gave me a list of most dangerous: 1. chainsaw, 2. radial arm, 3. circular, 4. tablesaw, etc. He logged and was a carpenter.

My shop teacher gave me a list of most dangerous: 1. shaper, 2. router, 3. tablesaw, etc.

The advice I will give my children will be this: 1. any moving bit or blade that you will come in contact with if the workpiece slips, moves, or kicks back. 2. the "invisible" bit or blade....etc.

Since I put my hand into a moving tablesaw blade, tools don't scare me anymore. My alertness and attitude toward them does.

Some tools certainly do require more respect than others, though.;)

[Judy Kingery]

David, very valid question and great responses. One thing that wasn't mentioned was taught in a workshop I attended awhile back and I certainly didn't give it much thought prior to that - your grinder. Pay attention to the sound. Not to be alarmist, but part of a wheel that might come apart, I'd just thought the grinder rather innocuous. And no, never had a problem.

But now when I sharpen tools or a blade or something, I do pay attention to sound and I stand slightly aside. Where I can see, have on a pair of safety glasses or a shield, but if anything flies apart, nope, shouldn't hit me. So just a little foot note to the list of good things people have said. Take care,

Jude

[Per Swenson]

No, not a smart alec. All of them.

Per

[Peter Luch]

The absolutely most dangerous thing in any shop or in the field is.......
Distraction

Even one second of distraction will cause an accident.

The first thing I have taught every apprentice under me is that when a power tool is turned on it gets your 100% attention until turned off.

No matter what the stats are on each tool I would have to say that 90% or higher would be caused by a distraction of the operator.

Even when working in heavy construction everyone knew that when someone was using a power tool you did not disturb them until they were done.
There was only one word that would ever be yelled at someone using a power tool and that was "Headache!!" and that was only used if they were in imminent danger.
Everything else was ignored until the cut was finished.

Don't look up if a car pulls up or a door slams or if some knucklehead taps your shoulder, stay with the machine, mentally 100% till it is turned off.

Aloha, Pete

[Lance Norris]

When I was in high school 27 years ago, in the 4 years I was in woodshop, there were 2 serious accidents. One was on a drill press and the other, a lathe. While I know that the table saw is probably the most dangerous, I really dont fear my drill press very much. But all it takes is a short lapse of attention, and any tool can injure you. To the original question, I have seen, or been involved with people, who were hurt with the 2 tools mentioned and also a jointer and a router.

[Joe Chritz]

I was going to say drill press but in reality it is whatever machine you use most.

The more familar you are with something dangerous the worse it becomes for you. Think about driving for instance. How often does someone do something while driving that isn't so smart?

In my business we have a saying, actually we have lots but this one is relevant.

Nothing is routine.

As soon as you think it is you will get hurt. Safety rules are written in blood. I hate to admit it but some it is even mine.

When dealing with a potentially dangerous operation, which nearly any power tool is, you aren't allowed any lapse in judgment or concentration.

Whether to sell your existing saw for different technology is a decision only you can make.

Stay safe

Joe

[Cody Colston]

I couldn't say which tool is the most dangerous although I have heard the shaper named as such many times. I have never used a shaper so I wouldn't know.

Now, the tool you are most likely to be injured by...that would be the one you use the most often and it's probably the table saw for all of us electron burners. I don't think it's any more dangerous than the other power tools but it's simply that we are exposed to that particular danger a lot more often.

As with my job, woodworking is inherently hazardous. We use powered equipment spinning sharp blades or cutters and hand tools that are sharpened to a razor's edge. Use either incorrectly and it will draw blood at least and sever a member or limb at worst.

Those that woodwork safely have learned to manage that built-in risk either by eliminating it (finding an alternative method) using engineering controls (blade guards, splitters, pawls, sawstop technology) or adapting their methods to make the risk minimal (using push sticks)...but it still doesn't go away.

It takes all of those efforts to avoid serious injury over a long period of time. Sawstop technology is innovative and and I'm sure it will eventually become standard on most all table saws. But, it is not the sole answer to working safely. The wise woodworker will use every safety tool that is available and affordable to them.

[Mike Cutler]

I was gonna answer chisels, but you have all taken a turn in another direction.

This was going to be my answer also.;)

David

Any tool used incorrectly can be dangerous. A table saw just happens to have a more acute dramatic injury associated with it.

In my observation of the SawStop Tablesaw. It looks like a very nice cabinet saw,and herein is the crux of the problem. It is an American Style Tablesaw. The SawStop brake system is a safety mechanism that addresses a basic inherent design deficiency of the cabinet saw, namely the exposed blade,and the required close proximity of the hand to the blade necessary to operate the tool. ( No matter what we say, we all operate the saw with the guards removed and our hands within a few inches of that spinning blade at times.) Remove the design element and the brake becomes unnecessary.

Appreciate the SawStop for what it is, a very well made North American style cabinet saw. Probably the best one being offered in it's class at this time. But, if avoiding injury is the primary selection criteria. I'd be looking at a European style sliding table saw. It's harder to come in contact with the blade, when there is no reason to have your hand close to the blade to operate the machine.

The SawStop is a heckuva machine,and would be my first choice for a cabinet saw, even without the brake system. But my next move will be to a sliding tablesaw when I can.

[Jay Jolliffe]

I agree with Per. Just about any tool in your shop that you use will cause harm if not used with care....

[Robert Conner]

Whenever this comes up the first response is the Table Saw then some other cutting tool. I think the correct answer is the screwdriver which really relates to the Most Used Tool. Chisels are up there too.
That being said it amazes me when the comments start to go towards how easy it is to use a Safety device like the Riving knife. If people are not going to use a Safety Device because it's a pain or difficult to use they should not be using a tool. We all know that an unbelievable number of "Pros" immediately remove the Guard ( and therefore the Anti-Kickback and Splitter features). How many of you have seen a Circular Saw with the Blade Guard Taped or Wired Open? How many people are shot with empty guns?
At this point in time there just are not enough SawStops out there for our "Pros" to figure out how to defeat the Blade Stop. When a SawStop is triggered Too Many times will the worker who gets dressed down or the Supervisor who has to Pay $70. a pop figure out a way to defeat it?
In Schools across NYC the Brett Guard is the most common safety Device used. It is a Pain to Adjust or move etc. As a Shop Teacher I made sure I used it and Eye Protection Every Time I Used a Table Saw. If a Student did not use it I would Hit the Power Safety Cut-Off (most former shop students know about that infamous device). I even have a Brett Guard on my own saw, and use it.
I think the Statistics on injuries would drop tremendously if Woodworkers would judiciously use the Safety Devices available to them.
Robert
Off my Soap Box

[Eddie Darby]

I would consider the SawStop to be a back-up system, that is there as a safety net.

If you understand *All* the dangers, plan your cuts, and use jigs to keep the hands and body out of the line of fire, then most of these accidents could be avoided in the first place.

The learning curve for the table saw is a steep one, and the amount of respect that this machine demands is often greater than people give it.

http://home.att.net/~waterfront-woods/Articles/Tablesaw/tablesaw.htm (http://home.att.net/%7Ewaterfront-woods/Articles/Tablesaw/tablesaw.htm)

Since most fail in these areas, then I would say for them that a SawStop is a Must! For those few that don't fail, then a SawStop is a very nice luxury!

For those interested in jointer safety :

http://blogs.popularwoodworking.com/editorsblog/content/binary/Adams%20Jointer%20rules.pdf

[Per Swenson]

"Pros" to figure out how to defeat the Blade Stop. When a SawStop is triggered Too Many times will the worker who gets dressed down or the Supervisor who has to Pay $70. a pop figure out a way to defeat it?

Robert
Off my Soap Box


Robert,

There is a override switch on the machine.:D

Per

[Jim Becker]

The most dangerous tool in the shop is...the woodworker. Outside of poor maintenance causing something to break at an inopportune moment, pretty much any accident stems to the tool user, not the tool.

That said, the most dangerous tool in the shop is the one you are using at the moment.

To date, all the injuries I've personally suffered have been with hand tools and clamps. The former while sharpening and the latter while trying to stand up in the wrong place...and the clamp hurt more despite an ER visit for the former.

[Colin Wollerman]

Peter hit the nail on the head.
By all means, buy as much safety as you can afford but unless your head is 100% in the game this will not make much difference.
Self awareness; Learn to recognize when you are tired or distracted. I think to myself in terms of %, " It's been a long day, I'm running at about 80%. I need to be extra careful"
I learned this when I was climbing. There are other methods that I am sure work. The trick is to create a habit of awareness. The switch for the tool needs to be a switch in your mind too.
That being said. The Saw Stop seems like a good idea.

ALL POWER TOOLS ARE DANGEROUS, period.
Ok, maybe that orbital sander won't take a finger off but we get the idea.

[David DeCristoforo]

You have a lot of good information here. But I would like to add one small idea. The tool most likely to hurt you is the tool you think is least likely to hurt you. If you talk to people who have been injured, reading "between the lines", it will become clear that the most dangerous thing is not a tool but the attitude of the person using it. If I had to answer this question with one word it would be "overconfidence".

[Jacob Reverb]

The tool most likely to hurt you is the tool you think is least likely to hurt you.

+1

I suspect this is a big reason why the jointer accounts for as many injuries as it does.

[Heather Thompson]

David,

When I was a child I was sitting on the kitchen floor while my mother was preparing dinner, she had a pan on the stove and reached in to see if it was hot, it was. My father worked in a tool and die shop his entire life, lost three co-workers due to industrial accidents, he was never hurt. A few years ago he came upstairs from his basement shop, holding a finger which he severed using his ShopSmith/ confused look on his face per my mom! When I cook and need to know if the pan is hot, I put a drop of water in and see if it disappears. :) I have used power tools since I was in the single digits, have lost some blood over the years, slipped while changing the plugs on a 350 Chevy. When I step into the shop and approach a power tool, I ALWAYS try to review my signature statement! There have been many good posts for your consideration on this thread.

Heather

[Lee Schierer]

The most dangerous tool in the shop is the one that sometimes gets used too much and not enough at the same time. (Working when tired and not thinking before you do it) It is located on your shoulders mid way between your arms. If you don't use your head any tool in your hands can be dangerous. As Norm says, read, understand and follow all the safety rules for the tool you plan to use. If it feels dangerous it probably is....find another way to do it.

[Bart Leetch]

No tool causes injury. The operator sets them selves up for injury. Left alone a tool will not hurt anyone its the interaction between the tool & the operator that has the greatest potential to cause injury.

[Will Blick]

> No tool causes injury. The operator sets them selves up for injury.

Bart, I would think your statement is true 97%+ of the time. There is those rare incidences where a tool fails and as a result, you are standing in its line of fire.

When I turn on the TS, even when there is nothing atop it (loose scrap), I never stand in the blades path. I am probably overly cautious....but the more I read these threads, the more comfortable I feel always thinking safety first.

Some of my worst injuries are from moving awkwardly (pulling something, than thrusting back a few feet, with no power tools on), then, banging my back or hip into a power tool table, not realizing its proximity to me.... one of the consequences of moving tools around a lot. Once my back was out of whack for a few months...

[Todd Bin]

I think you are more likely to get injured using a hand tool. aka Utility Knife, Chisel or even hammering your thumb. But these injuries tend to be small and it is likely you will have 100% recovery. Power tools, however, cause injuries that are severe and you will most likely go to the ER for treatment and you may never fully recover.

[Gordon Harner]

Many excellent comments on this thread. I'd like to add some comments on the purported statistics. Many of us are familiar with the OSHA 300 form the log of injuries and illnesses these forms would have some data are injuries to professional woodworkers but... they may not adequately or accurately list the machine being used at the time of injury. OSHA does not require that all injuries be reported to them only fatalities multiple(over 3 hospitalizations from a single incident) and power press incidents. Osha does not receive all employers annual accident data they randomly select employers for reports. Therefore OSHA's data is poor.

The Consumer Product Safety Commission does not have a specific data collection process and Emergency room data as to cause and machine is notoriously inaccurate. Therefore there really is no good source for tool use injuries.

To repeat what others have said: what is the tool most commonly owned and used other than hand tools? a motorized saw be it radial arm table saw or portable circular saw. Therefore logic would say that the most injuries from woodworking machines would be from power saws.

[Eric Larsen]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned the ol' drill press.

First thing I did when I decided to get good at this was to build a decent table for my press. Seems any time you're drilling a hole larger than 3/4", the workpiece wants to break free and spin towards your unprotected fingers -- mashing, gouging, pinching and otherwise damaging them.

[Per Swenson]

> N


When I turn on the TS, even when there is nothing atop it (loose scrap), I never stand in the blades path. I am probably overly cautious....but the more I read these threads, the more comfortable I feel always thinking safety first.

S..

When we change the shaper tooling...we sit on the floor to start the machine.

Per

[Jim Dunn]

Paint brushes!! They make my blood boil to the point I think I could have a heart-attack:)

[David DeCristoforo]

The whole "tools don't hurt people..." thing sounds just like the whole "guns don't kill people..." argument. It' really just "semantics". It's going to come up in any discussion about the dangers inherent in any device. No one would consider a banana "dangerous". But someone, somewhere will figure out a way to poke himself in the eye with one.... Then, someone will say "Bananas don't blind people...."

[Mike Monroe]

Couple years ago was in a small town lumber yard just ourside a big city picking up some cherry and spalted maple. Struck up a converation with the owner, he showed me their big saw and all the junk they ran into when cutting up logs. We talked about woodworking too. He mentioned about all the retirees from the big city coming out to stock up on wood. He said you'd be suprized how many of these guys retirer, then go out and buy a butt load of tools for wood working. And which tool bites them the most? It's the bandsaw. He said it's because the bandsaw doesn't seem as dangerous as tablesaw and these old new woodworkers don't understand that.

[Lance Norris]

I'm surprised nobody mentioned the ol' drill press.



See post #15 above.

[Ron Bontz]

Well, working in EMS I have seen a couple of good ones. The table saw skin contact was the most deforming. Put a molding blade in that puppy and see what it can do. No clean cuts there. This one is for Judy... I once had occasion to respond to an older gentleman with about a 2 inch gash in his forehead all the way to the bone. Being on his head it bled quite a bit of course making it look worse. His grinding wheel blew apart. I was surprised it did not knock him out cold. Some stitches and he was fine. Except for the scar.
In my shop, my shaper would get my vote. For some reason I always want to step out of the line of fire when starting it. Just food for thought..A lot of farm equipment is a lot more dangerous. Augers, PTOs etc. and they are a lot more deadly.

[Ron Bontz]

Yep. Peter hit it on the head. I have unfortunately yelled at both the LOML and the little LOML for flicking the light switch off and on or yelling at me to get my attention. (DISTRACTION) Now they both just wait patiently for a pause in my task at hand. Thanks Peter.

[glenn bradley]

Ya gotta love statistics. You can make 'em say anything. I think the message is clear; the most dangerous tool is the one you're using at the time. Another way to think on it is that 'you' are the dangerous part.

Many folks have posted here who have NEVER used a blade guard. 30 years later, no problem. Some folks have a near-death experience right off the bat.

I am a safety advocate and have only had an eye opening experience when I blatantly ignore the rules. I haven't done that for quite awhile.

[Wayne Cannon]

My daughter, who works in the ER, says that too-close encounters between a hand and a table saw blade are by far the most common source of serious workshop injuries.

[Steven Hardy]

The absolutely most dangerous thing in any shop or in the field is.......
Distraction

Even one second of distraction will cause an accident.

The first thing I have taught every apprentice under me is that when a power tool is turned on it gets your 100% attention until turned off.

No matter what the stats are on each tool I would have to say that 90% or higher would be caused by a distraction of the operator.

Even when working in heavy construction everyone knew that when someone was using a power tool you did not disturb them until they were done.
There was only one word that would ever be yelled at someone using a power tool and that was "Headache!!" and that was only used if they were in imminent danger.
Everything else was ignored until the cut was finished.

Don't look up if a car pulls up or a door slams or if some knucklehead taps your shoulder, stay with the machine, mentally 100% till it is turned off.

Aloha, Pete

Your so right about that one.

[Peter Luch]

Self awareness; Learn to recognize when you are tired or distracted. I think to myself in terms of %, " It's been a long day, I'm running at about 80%. I need to be extra careful"
I learned this when I was climbing. There are other methods that I am sure work. The trick is to create a habit of awareness. The switch for the tool needs to be a switch in your mind too.


I learned this also while climbing.................on concrete gang forms "inside" elevator shafts :eek:.
Nothing makes you think about what your doing more than looking down an empty shaft and seeing nothing but a black hole at the bottom.

Your so right about the awareness when turing on a tool.
Wish more people really understood this concept.

Aloha, Pete

[Sam Yerardi]

Any tool is capable of causing injury, whether power or not. As far as saying one tool is more dangerous, I think it is relative. I've always thought a radial arm was more dangerous than a table saw. But suppose the person using the radial arm is very experienced and does everything as safe as he/she can. Does that make it less safe than someone using a table saw that doesn't fully understand what they are doing? I think the danger is equally shared between man and tool. If you asked which tool is capable of greater danger, then statistically you could probably point to jointers, shapers, etc. Any surgeon will tell you that with a table saw, band saw, radial arm saw cut, more often than not there is something remaining on your body that can be re-attached, etc. With jointer, planer, shaper injuries, there is usually NOTHING left to recover and restore. So, in that sense, they are more dangerous because they are capable of greater injury if something does go wrong. By the same token, you could seriously injure yourself sharpening a plane iron.

I think your best defense against injury in a shop is to know what you are doing, have your tools in top working order, don't take short cuts, etc. The list goes on and on. Even with all of these precautions, make sure you have a safety kit in your shop. Machinery and tools can fail just like we do.

[Andy Pratt]

I haven't read 100% of the replies, but I think my take on this is a little different than some people's. I treat all tools with a lot of safety, but I'm most concerned and attentive with the ones that can cause serious, life changing injury to me. To me, this puts the following tools on the most dangerous list, in order of danger:

1. Table Saw
2. Sliding Compound Miter Saw
3. Lathe

I have a sawstop with an effective overhead guard that I use all the time, so my biggest concern is the last two, especially since they aren't often seen as extremely dangerous tools to use. The SCMS is on the list because I could lose a hand on it, and the various angles and bevels it's used for eliminate the possibility of a consistent "no hands" area that is marked or guarded permanently. The lathe is on the list because it seems really innocent and easy, and could fling something at you in a heartbeat if you make some basic errors, or just get really unlucky.

I would also add in the risk of open dust ports sucking your hand toward a cutter on any rigged up dust collection. My router table is serviced by a 6" port and can really suck stuff into the opening, including my hand toward the cutter, if I was stupid and had my hand near enough to it when the cutter was moving.

Hope this was helpful

[Per Swenson]

I would also add in the risk of open dust ports sucking your hand toward a cutter on any rigged up dust collection. My router table is serviced by a 6" port and can really suck stuff into the opening, including my hand toward the cutter, if I was stupid and had my hand near enough to it when the cutter was moving.

[/quote]


Hahehha,

This brings up one of the stooopider things I've done.

I smoke like a chimley. (SIC redneck clarity)

I set my lit cig down on the shaper table, tooling wasn't spinning,

but the dust collection was on.

Needless to say I couldn't find it.....for awhile.


Per

[J. Z. Guest]

I'd say the drill press. There are tons of warnings and better awareness of table saw hazards.

The humble drill press, on the other hand, folks take for granted. It seems so harmless, but they have so much torque, things can get out of hand quickly.

I have a great uncle who lost the end of a finger in a drill press accident. (probably his fault)

It is the tool you take for granted that bites you.

In a similar thread on another forum, a lot of folks voted for the chisel for this very reason.

[Colin Wollerman]

Andy,
I have not done too much wood turning but have heard a couple different stories of some guys out here in Hawaii spinning big koa bowls that had their material come apart and just about kill em!
I guess it depends what you are turning but I would have to say a large lathe could be pretty life altering.
The main problem with miter saws is that people misuse them. When used correctly they seem pretty safe to me. Not like an exploding 18" koa bowl!

That reminds me. I went into this old fella's shop once on The Big Island and he had this home made...Mill?
It was like a 4" dia. quill/shaft that stuck out from a table about 4 feet. it tapered down on the business end and held star shaped gouging bit (I forget what those things are called) The whole shaft spun at TSOG (The speed of God)There was an old wood chair right by the bit end. No guards, No electronic voltage sensing stops, No yellow tape on the floor...just a pile of shavings:rolleyes:
Seems safety is a bit relative.

BTW This guy,has for years, produced some of the most awesome woodwork I have ever seen.