First hand tools project

[Amy Leigh Baker]

I attempted my first handsaw/chiseling project last night, to remove the corner from the tops of some table legs to fit a cross brace on the back. The plan was to use a backsaw to cut down from the top of the leg, and then chisel away from the long part to remove the wood. Admittedly the backsaw was an inexpensive one, but I found it very difficult to do what I wanted and gave up on the backsaw. Would this be because I was trying to cut into endgrain? I couldn't even get a proper start, and actually mutilated the wood a little.

After giving up on the saw, I cut a deep relief line on the long part of the leg with a utility knife, then began inserting the chisel into the endgrain, chiseling out this way. Because of the relief line the wood kept from splintering past where I wanted it to.

But my next problem came because I don't have a mallet to drive the chisel with. My hand hurt very quickly. What kind of mallet should I use? There's a $9.99 rubber mallet at Sears that looks like it owuld do the trick.

I found it easier to cut into the long part of the leg with the backsaw.

Amy

[Sam Yerardi]

Would this be because I was trying to cut into endgrain? I couldn't even get a proper start, and actually mutilated the wood a little.
When you cut into end grain you are really ripping the wood rather than crosscutting. Try using a rip saw or a back saw (or whatever) that has its teeth set for ripping instead of crosscutting.

After giving up on the saw, I cut a deep relief line on the long part of the leg with a utility knife, then began inserting the chisel into the endgrain, chiseling out this way. Because of the relief line the wood kept from splintering past where I wanted it to.
Sometimes when you are cutting out a section of wood like you are doing, and you are not using a saw, you might find it easier to chop a line across the grain after you have scored it with a knife. Then from the end grain, start paring away but don't bite off more than the depth of the chopped cut. Chisel that out, then go back and chop deeper again, etc.

But my next problem came because I don't have a mallet to drive the chisel with. My hand hurt very quickly. What kind of mallet should I use? There's a $9.99 rubber mallet at Sears that looks like it owuld do the trick.
I use either a round rubber-surfaced mallet that I use for carving, or a square beech mallet. The harder and more dense the wood, the more I will use the square beech mallet.

I found it easier to cut into the long part of the leg with the backsaw.
Your back saw more than likely has its teeth set for crosscut. For ripping and end grain cuts, once you try a ripping set you will be amazed at the difference it makes.

CONGRATS ON GOING NEANDER!!!

[Mark Stutz]

Amy,
I suspect your problem is part tool related and part experience related. An inexpensive saw is not inherently bad, but most inexpensive modern saws are filed crosscut and you need rip for the endgrain rip cut. They also usually have stamped instead of filed teeth and too much set. All of these can be overcome, but require someone who can hand sharpen a saw. Light starting pressure with a sharp handsaw is needed, but when it happens it is an enlightening moment. A dull saw or one with too much set is what usually discourages people from using a handsaw.

I would not use a rubber mallet (DAMHIKT), although for light paring taps it would probably work. If you have a lathe or a friend with one, and some firewood, it doesn't take long to have one that fits your hand.

Good luck with your project.

mark

[Jim Koepke]

I attempted my first handsaw/chiseling project last night, to remove the corner from the tops of some table legs to fit a cross brace on the back. The plan was to use a backsaw to cut down from the top of the leg, and then chisel away from the long part to remove the wood. Admittedly the backsaw was an inexpensive one, but I found it very difficult to do what I wanted and gave up on the backsaw. Would this be because I was trying to cut into endgrain? I couldn't even get a proper start, and actually mutilated the wood a little.

Amy

Go to this site:

http://www.vintagesaws.com/

Click on the Library saw to the left. Close to the bottom of this page is a link for a saw sharpening primer. This has information about the diference between rip and crosscut saws.

If you do have a rip saw and it is not cutting the end grain, it is likely dull.

The type of mallet is up to you. I started out using a flat faced mallet which works well and now use a cylandrical mallet, most of the time. I also have an old oak 2 X 4 that has a handle carved out on one end. It is usefull for a lot of things including whacking chisels.

Good luck and keep trying, you will find those who keep trying tend to have the good luck.

jim

[Robert Rozaieski]

I have to agree with what everyone else has already said here. Either your saw is filed crosscut or it is dull. Here's a test. Place the teeth of the saw on the palm of your hand and GENTLY push the saw forward like you are making a cut. If the teeth are sharp, you will feel them grab the skin in the palm of your hand. If the teeth simply slide across your palm the teeth are dull. Also, like was previously mentioned, the saw is likely filed crosscut and has too much set. You can easily re-file the saw rip (and sharpen it at the same time) with a saw file. Rip filing is the easiest to do as it is straight across the saw plate. This will also remove some of the set. If you need to remove more set, run an oil stone from heel to toe along each side of the teeth. One pass on each side and check how it cuts. If the kerf is wide, stone each side again. Continue until the kerf is acceptable to you.

Check Pete Taran's Vintage Saws site that Jim linked to. It will give you all the information you need on saw teeth and sharpening saws. It's an easy fix with a little investment of time with a file. Even a cheapo saw can be made to cut well if it's filed and set correctly.

[Amy Leigh Baker]

Thanks, guys! I have to say, I have no love for the handsaw yet, but I do love my chisel :)

[Jim Koepke]

Thanks, guys! I have to say, I have no love for the handsaw yet, but I do love my chisel :)

These were my feelings not tool long ago. I could not cut straight for love or money.

Then, while using a tree saw to cut some limbs in the yard I thought I would give it a few swipes with a file to sharpen the slow cutting blade. It was amazing. I did not even know what I was doing, but it worked better after it was done.

From there, I searched the web, found vintage saws' site and sharpened an old rip saw. Following the instructions I was amazed. All of a sudden, I could saw a strait line with the grain on a board. I have made a few mistakes sharpening a saw, the dumbest being not flipping the rake alignment tool when changing sides of the saw. Nothing that can not be corrected with a little more work.

Once you get a saw tuned, cutting well and straight, you will enjoy it and want to rip your own 8 foot 1 X 2s from a 12 inch board.

jim

[Mike Cutler]

Thanks, guys! I have to say, I have no love for the handsaw yet. :)

This will change. It just takes a little experience and some time.

What is a saw?

A whole bunch of chisel lined up in a row.:eek:,;)

[Tim Thomas]

Hey Amy, when I need to smack a chisel around I use a rubber mallet that I got at the Dollar Tree for the low-low price of ... $1. I'm certainly not a hand tools expert, but it works for me, and it was daggum cheap. Comes in handy for all sorts of things like closing paint/stain cans, giving gentle persuasion to parts during assembly, and giving not so gentle persuasion to the neighbor's cat to stay the heck away from my yard. (I'm just kidding, I would never throw one of my tools at a cat. That is what my pellet rifle is for. :))

I will say that the mallet at Dollar Tree is not heavy, which is both good and bad. I think it is great if you aren't going to be working with it for very long (like just cleaning up a couple of mortises that you made with your non-neander tools). But if you are going to be tapping that chisel a lot, I'm thinking you would need something with a bit more mass, that way you can just tap with it instead of having to swing it.

I can offer you no advice whatsoever on saws, as I am a power tool junkie. You might do well to ignore my advice on the mallet too, but even in the worst possible case you will have only wasted $1.

[Danny Thompson]

What kind of chisel and handle?

[Glenn Shotwell]

Thanks, guys! I have to say, I have no love for the handsaw yet, but I do love my chisel :)

Amy, not sure these techniques will help in what you were needing to do. But I found this site for tutorial videos. There is one under Lie Nielsen category that is titled handsaw techniques. Check it out.

Just wondering, Is your saw as sharp as it can be? I can only imagine since I'm a newbie, but knowing how well sharp chisels perform that your handsaw must be as sharp as it can be.

Also on this site if you go there in the Lie Nielsen category as well is the Brian Boggs video clip...excellent stuff.

http://www.woodworkingchannel.com/dolphin/vidego_video_library.php

[Pam Niedermayer]

The best tool you can get right now is a digital camera. That way we can see what you're talking about and can possibly be of more help.

Pam

[Lee Koepke]

Thanks, guys! I have to say, I have no love for the handsaw yet, but I do love my chisel :)
I learned to sharpen my chisels a few months ago, and that makes using them soooooo much better !!!